Athletic performance in your 40s?

Haven't checked in here for a while--,great to catch up.

It's been a good summer. I've lost a bunch of weight (I don't weigh myself) and feel pretty damned good.

I've recently started doing bigger hikes in anticipation of archery season, though I'm still riding the bike and going to the gym from time to time. I try to power up 2-4k feet as fast as I can and it's definitely challenging.

The biggest change for me was completely dropping the idea of a mandatory meal schedule. I have really focused on listening to my body and eating accordingly. This often results in big lunches after hikes or rides, then small dinners. Breakfast if I'm going to be exercising. Doing this on top of watching what I eat has made a huge difference.

It sounds cliche and really obvious but it's incredible how much better you feel when you really focus on what your body actually wants for fuel instead of defaulting to a schedule or what's put in front of you.

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I know so many grey-hairs that only eat once or twice a day. I'm 47 and function best on one midday meal with an evening salad. No breakfast. Our metabolism changes as we age. Even when we lift and workout.

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Originally Posted by gaijin

I know so many grey-hairs that only eat once or twice a day. I'm 47 and function best on one midday meal with an evening salad. No breakfast. Our metabolism changes as we age. Even when we lift and workout.

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I'm sure there are a few here with better insight, but found this article in Scientific American interesting:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...burn-calories/

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Perhaps the biggest surprise was the stability of our metabolism through middle age. Daily energy expenditures hold remarkably steady from age 20 to 60. No middle age slowdown, no change with menopause. The weight gain so many of us experience in adulthood cannot be blamed on a declining metabolism. As a man in my 40s, I had sort of believed the folk wisdom that metabolism slowed as we aged. My body definitely feels different than it did 10 or 20 years ago. But like hunting some metabolic Sasquatch, when you actually look there's nothing there. Same for the much touted metabolic differences between men and women. Women have lower daily energy expenditures on average, but that is only because women tend to be smaller and carry more of their weight as fat. Compare men and women with the same body weight and body fat percentage, and the metabolic difference disappears.

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Is there anything I can do to build muscle in the low back besides weighted leg raises? I think I mentioned earlier but I have atrophied muscle in this area from an injury years ago and then compensating with surrounding muscles.

I have been putting a dumbbell between my legs, laying stomach down on a bench and doing raises, but curious if there is something else out there I can do. This muscle deficiency pretty much puts a hold on deadlift and even some other excercises until I get it much bigger and stronger.

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Originally Posted by gaijin

I know so many grey-hairs that only eat once or twice a day. I'm 47 and function best on one midday meal with an evening salad. No breakfast. Our metabolism changes as we age. Even when we lift and workout.

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Yeah, no.

I eat 3 to 4 meals a day, haven’t noticed any significant change in my metabolism since I was 20.

Personally I think it’s useful to have friends in their early 30s that are among the fastest local skiers / bikers on the uphill & just maintain that as your peer group. Otherwise you’ll end up recreating with a bunch of creaky pill poppers and reminiscing about the days when you were fast. Next thing you know you’ll be buying an emtb and listening to Rush and the Eagles.

:fmicon:

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Originally Posted by frorider

I eat 3 to 4 meals a day, haven’t noticed any significant change in my metabolism since I was 20.

Personally I think it’s useful to have friends in their early 30s that are among the fastest local skiers / bikers on the uphill & just maintain that as your peer group. Otherwise you’ll end up recreating with a bunch of creaky pill poppers and reminiscing about the days when you were fast. Next thing you know you’ll be buying an emtb and listening to Rush and the Eagles.

:fmicon:

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Yep. That trope about one's metabolism slowing is so tired. People get lazier and have more responsibilities as they get older, which causes them to get fatter. Your body uses and needs fuel the same as ever.

I had a really important ski partner way back when (JayTee) who was like the older mentor who could still keep up. Now that I'm almost to the age he was then I realize that going out with younger folks can be a great benefit to both people. We (might) have some wisdom to share, and they can push us to keep going hard.

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Originally Posted by oldnew_guy

I'm sure there are a few here with better insight, but found this article in Scientific American interesting:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...burn-calories/




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Is there anything I can do to build muscle in the low back besides weighted leg raises? I think I mentioned earlier but I have atrophied muscle in this area from an injury years ago and then compensating with surrounding muscles.

I have been putting a dumbbell between my legs, laying stomach down on a bench and doing raises, but curious if there is something else out there I can do. This muscle deficiency pretty much puts a hold on deadlift and even some other excercises until I get it much bigger and stronger.

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Back extensions work well

Sent from my moto g 5G using Tapatalk

I think everyone is different but I normaly eat smaller amounts twice a day , one can buy a digital scale for < 20$ , I do a fasting weight check every morning when I get out a bed and it will gives an accurate read on whatever I put into my body yesterday

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Originally Posted by oldnew_guy

I'm sure there are a few here with better insight, but found this article in Scientific American interesting:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...burn-calories/




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Is there anything I can do to build muscle in the low back besides weighted leg raises? I think I mentioned earlier but I have atrophied muscle in this area from an injury years ago and then compensating with surrounding muscles.

I have been putting a dumbbell between my legs, laying stomach down on a bench and doing raises, but curious if there is something else out there I can do. This muscle deficiency pretty much puts a hold on deadlift and even some other excercises until I get it much bigger and stronger.

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Which muscles in the lower back? Most muscles in the lower back run all the way to your upper torso and attach in the legs. Trap bar deadlifts, single leg squats, Bulgarian split squats, hip thrusts all work the muscles in the general area but if you have that bad of atrophy you should see a PT and do rehab before you do general fitness workouts.

One thing I’d want to focus on (and I do it in my lifting personally as someone who’s never had a real back injury) is your anti rotation and rotation strength. Your lower back is a “stability joint” whereas your thoracic spine is a “mobility joint”. You want your lower back to be stable, not to be highly mobile.

These are great.

https://www.muscleandfitness.com/wor...and-variation/

Progressing chops

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=SiFt13a3NGI

Progressing a rotational lift

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4aTzZ0Bs_TY

+2 on the atrophy suggestion. A PT literally changed my life by getting some of the small muscles in my low back to fire again. The movements were very slow and very minimal with a big focus on isolating those muscles away from the bigger ones. Took me months to get up to the type of exercises above

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Originally Posted by Supermoon

+2 on the atrophy suggestion. A PT literally changed my life by getting some of the small muscles in my low back to fire again. The movements were very slow and very minimal with a big focus on isolating those muscles away from the bigger ones. Took me months to get up to the type of exercises above

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I have some chronic issues with my quadratus lumborum / QL on both sides. Were those muscles an issue for you at all and if so, can you share any of your exercises? I/ m supposed to be getting in to see a sports medicine practitioner, but the referral process from my PCP takes forever, so who knows when that will happen.

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Originally Posted by dan_pdx

I have some chronic issues with my quadratus lumborum / QL on both sides. Were those muscles an issue for you at all and if so, can you share any of your exercises? I/ m supposed to be getting in to see a sports medicine practitioner, but the referral process from my PCP takes forever, so who knows when that will happen.

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You'd think after a decade of dealing with a bad back I'd know a lot more about the anatomy back there, but I'm not exactly sure. i have all of it in the notes my PT gave me, but those are in storage for a few months.

I had a compression fracture of my L5, then the next year herniated my L5/S1 (surely related). I spent years dealing with the nerve pain, and all the fun stuff that comes with it. When I went to this PT he was poking around the small stabilizers next to my spine. On one side there was a bunch of meat there, but on the other side, around my injury, there was nothing. Apparently you can brace so much with your bigger core muscles your stop firing those little ones (at least that's what I understood from his explanation). All the core moves I had been doing had been essentially reinforcing that by doing big movements like plants, wood choppers, etc.

What he had me do was lay flat on my stomach with a pillow under my hips, clench everything in my core, do a kegel, then slowly lift an arm and opposite leg. 10x3 a couple times a day. Moved up to the same move but on all fours like a bird dog (still clenching everything) after a couple of weeks, then after like a month or two of that, started adding back in the big core stuff after I would do those two. He also had me scale back on rotational stretches and do more hinge stretching and more hip flexor stretches.

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Originally Posted by oldnew_guy

I'm sure there are a few here with better insight, but found this article in Scientific American interesting:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...burn-calories/




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Is there anything I can do to build muscle in the low back besides weighted leg raises? I think I mentioned earlier but I have atrophied muscle in this area from an injury years ago and then compensating with surrounding muscles.

I have been putting a dumbbell between my legs, laying stomach down on a bench and doing raises, but curious if there is something else out there I can do. This muscle deficiency pretty much puts a hold on deadlift and even some other excercises until I get it much bigger and stronger.

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You need to see a good PT.

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Originally Posted by Dantheman

You need to see a good PT.

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This. A good PT. You will have set backs as you push forward. I've been through something similar and having someone smart to help me figure out the puzzle was key.

+100 on seeing a PT.

A good progression to deadlift as I found out recently is cable pull throughs, Romanian deadlifts, then actual deadlifts. Four weeks, twice a week cable pull through. Next four weeks RDLs. Next four weeks - deadlifts. YMMV

SEE THE THERAPIST FIRST. And good luck with recovery.

I posted link to the source up thread somewhere but here it is again : https://youtu.be/ixkQaZXVQjs

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Originally Posted by Lvovsky

+100 on seeing a PT.

A good progression to deadlift as I found out recently is cable pull throughs, Romanian deadlifts, then actual deadlifts. Four weeks, twice a week cable pull through. Next four weeks RDLs. Next four weeks - deadlifts. YMMV

SEE THE THERAPIST FIRST. And good luck with recovery.

I posted link to the source up thread somewhere but here it is again : https://youtu.be/ixkQaZXVQjs

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That’s a great video. Cuts to the chase but keeps it simple. If my wife gets into weightlifting like I want her to imma show her that.

What are you guys doing to keep your joints healthy? Between my cardio and 4 days a week of lifting I’m pretty happy with my general fitness now. My knees and ankle are definitely my week point now. For example, last week I did a backpacking trip which included a 20 mile, 5k’ vert day and overall I felt great during and after, with the exception of my knees. I spent the next half a day walking around like an 80 year old with swollen ankles and knees.

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Originally Posted by alias_rice

What are you guys doing to keep your joints healthy? Between my cardio and 4 days a week of lifting I’m pretty happy with my general fitness now. My knees and ankle are definitely my week point now. For example, last week I did a backpacking trip which included a 20 mile, 5k’ vert day and overall I felt great during and after, with the exception of my knees. I spent the next half a day walking around like an 80 year old with swollen ankles and knees.

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Are you doing any significant walking or running now?

Unless you train for a 20 mile hike with a pack, you are going to end up hurting. And even then, a 20 mile hike with a pack isn't a walk in the park for anyone, especially someone over 40.

Consistently running would help condition your knees for hiking/backpacking but a lot that will depend on your body/history.

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Originally Posted by ironhippy

Are you doing any significant walking or running now?

Unless you train for a 20 mile hike with a pack, you are going to end up hurting. And even then, a 20 mile hike with a pack isn't a walk in the park for anyone, especially someone over 40.

Consistently running would help condition your knees for hiking/backpacking but a lot that will depend on your body/history.

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I do quite a bit of walking but do 0 running. I have a fused ankle so running is more like hobbling and anything more than 100 yards is rough. Cardio for me is either hiking or cycling.

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Originally Posted by alias_rice

What are you guys doing to keep your joints healthy? Between my cardio and 4 days a week of lifting I’m pretty happy with my general fitness now. My knees and ankle are definitely my week point now. For example, last week I did a backpacking trip which included a 20 mile, 5k’ vert day and overall I felt great during and after, with the exception of my knees. I spent the next half a day walking around like an 80 year old with swollen ankles and knees.

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You only spent half a day like an 80 year old? Seems pretty good recovery to me.

If you have osteoarthritis there's not much you can do. Age related degenerative changes in the knees or ankles won't simply go away, certainly not when exacerbated by the high activity level previously described. Seems pretty reasonable to feel 80 years old after hauling a pack for those distances. Your certainly probably healthier than 99% of the population who couldn't do that when they were 20.

There is 3.5 billion spent annually on glucosamine/chondroitin supplements with marginal/questionable efficacy, but who knows, maybe the placebo effect would help you.

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Originally Posted by oldnew_guy

I'm sure there are a few here with better insight, but found this article in Scientific American interesting:

https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...burn-calories/




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Is there anything I can do to build muscle in the low back besides weighted leg raises? I think I mentioned earlier but I have atrophied muscle in this area from an injury years ago and then compensating with surrounding muscles.

I have been putting a dumbbell between my legs, laying stomach down on a bench and doing raises, but curious if there is something else out there I can do. This muscle deficiency pretty much puts a hold on deadlift and even some other excercises until I get it much bigger and stronger.

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Kettlebell swings are your friend.

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Originally Posted by NW_SKIER

Kettlebell swings are your friend.

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As long as it's been cleared by a physio therapist.

He really needs to figure out what is wrong before you can safely recommend exercises to fix it, you risk causing more damage (especially with your back, especially if you are over 40) otherwise

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Originally Posted by ironhippy

As long as it's been cleared by a physio therapist.

He really needs to figure out what is wrong before you can safely recommend exercises to fix it, you risk causing more damage (especially with your back, especially if you are over 40) otherwise

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Your comment is implying I told him to start with 80lb bells. SMH. If he can hold and pick up dumbells with his legs while laying on his stomach, I'm pretty sure he can swing a light kettlebell and work up.

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Originally Posted by alias_rice

What are you guys doing to keep your joints healthy? Between my cardio and 4 days a week of lifting I’m pretty happy with my general fitness now. My knees and ankle are definitely my week point now. For example, last week I did a backpacking trip which included a 20 mile, 5k’ vert day and overall I felt great during and after, with the exception of my knees. I spent the next half a day walking around like an 80 year old with swollen ankles and knees.

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good genes, the orthapedic surgeon looking at an MRI of my knee told me ( other than the blown ACL ) I have the knee of a teenager


I had my second visit to Gerda the Osteopath last week, which involves driving 45 min into the country to a BnB a log home with dogs ducks and geese wandering around and a physio office. This time I tried to read the 5 shingles on her wall except they were all in cherman but she said physio/ acupuncture/ chiro and 2 others i forget. She has been working on my fascia, the first time she did something that made my back click and no more pain in the neck the back was better

this last time she did something on my left side which tweaked my back (hard) on the right and it feels pretty good, the drill is to wait 7-10 days and call her to report the situ and maybe book another but i think I might be fixed and she only charges 50$ a visit

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Originally Posted by alias_rice

What are you guys doing to keep your joints healthy? Between my cardio and 4 days a week of lifting I’m pretty happy with my general fitness now. My knees and ankle are definitely my week point now. For example, last week I did a backpacking trip which included a 20 mile, 5k’ vert day and overall I felt great during and after, with the exception of my knees. I spent the next half a day walking around like an 80 year old with swollen ankles and knees.

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There's a pretty decent number of placebo-controlled RCTs showing that hydrolyzed collagen supplementation improves joint pain related to sports and mild to moderate osteoarthritis compared to placebo. There are also some high quality radiolabeling studies showing that collagen peptides are incorporated intact into cartilage and skin which may be directly stimulating connective tissue synthesis.

Hydrolyzed collagen supplementation is also effective at improving skin wrinkles and skin elasticity (in people old enough to have such issues) and outperforms placebo. Some of these studies used 3D photographic techniques and computerized analysis to measure wrinkle count and depth objectively, so they're not just based on subjective visual assessment. This is off-topic from joint pain, but it does seem to support the idea that hydrolyzed collagen supplementation improves connective tissue synthesis throughout the body.

10 g/day seems to be the ideal collagen dose. I also take about 10 g of glycine daily. I've found several papers that suggest that glycine supplementation improves collagen synthesis (links below). Glycine also happens to be very sweet, almost as sweet as sugar, so I dissolve it in a little hot water then mix in lemon/lime juice and seltzer to make super tasty healthy lemonade/limeade. It's pretty cheap, I think my last order worked out to something like $0.25/10 g dose.

https://link.springer.com/article/10...038-009-0100-9
https://link.springer.com/article/10...726-013-1493-1
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6153947/

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Originally Posted by alias_rice

I do quite a bit of walking but do 0 running. I have a fused ankle so running is more like hobbling and anything more than 100 yards is rough. Cardio for me is either hiking or cycling.

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Consider getting into rucking and replacing your walks with rucks.