powdork takes the carbon 191 Lhasa Fats for a spin in the trees.
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powdork takes the carbon 191 Lhasa Fats for a spin in the trees.
OK.. have had 2 days on the full carbon 191 FAT now... just running out door for dinner, but they are fcking GREAT ! LOVE THEM... Pat congrats on an amazing ski.. so versitle and as you say I dont need the Stockli really and dont see me using them this trip. What I'm most pleased about is how the carbon gives them a playful nature, but also they are stiff enough to really not be deflected even though the ski is so light.. I have FKS 18's on them and this was a good choice IMO.. skied them every condition going from great powder, to really heavy stuff in the trees. Piste etc etc.. very impressed. I prefer them so much more than the regular 191's. How can they be more versitile and bigger?! What I also liked so much was how much rebound you can get with them also, however get them in the powder and they excel. In terms of mount I went 0.5cm back on advice from Pat. Personally I think I could have gone further, but I'm happy anyway as you just adjust from ski to ski. Will do a more detailed very in a couple of days and add pics when I work out how from my camera!
Alex
Piggity - did I sell you my pair of 187 testers from last year?Quote:
Originally Posted by Piggity
Cause I had a hand bevel put on those and they really sliced.
It's very much a trad sidecut. The tail is 11mm narrower than the tip.
The 191 Lhasa Fat tail is 18.5mm narrower than the tip.
They are indeed different and your description is right on.
The 187 is like a hot rod with a four wheel drive option built into it.
Thanks for the info guys. No buyers remorse from me!
The un-drilled ones with the 188 top sheets.
Bingo...it was like having 4 wheel drive on a GTO. On the other hand, the 191's were like a big ole 4 wheel drive that rides like a Caddy Northstar.Quote:
The 187 is like a hot rod with a four wheel drive option built into it.
The bases on both skis are bomber. But bringing out new skis in early season conditions was not smart, pretty dumb on my part. Submerged rocks and stumps everywhere. Normally I don't care about injuring my gear cause it's meant to be used. But these things are brand new and so purty that it tugs at my heart strings to see them wounded from battle this weekend. End of sob story.
edit: if those are the ones you hand beveled then I owe you a beer, they railed.
Finally got my 191s in pow yesterday and as expected, they crushed it.
That sucks dude! Hit a submerged rock on my lotus 138s the other day. Funny though, my first thought was "Damn, I'm glad I didn't bring the 191s today!"Quote:
Originally Posted by Piggity
I have to keep reminding myself that by the time I'm ready to replace the 191 Fats, I'm sure splat will have thought up another genius ski that I just can't live without.
Yeah, feels like a swift kick to the balls. I imagine hitting those 138s wasn't fun either. Both the 187 and 191 bases are bomber and survived many rocks and stumps. It's my fault my skis need some fixing; I was pow hungry, knee felt kinda good and I wanted to test drive these baby's.
To stay on topic with the 191 fats. I finally caught a puny amount of air since tearing my acl in april, the 191s felt like landing gear on my feet. It's out of my league but I can only imagine these things love to stomp big airs into pow. The tips seemed to have a cushion effect
Had the pleasure of meeting Splat today in CO as he presented me with my shiny new Lhasa 191 Fats. Damn gorgeous ski! Quality is top shelf! The 183 and 187 Bros were there as well and they are tasty too. The 183 all carbon looks to be a killer touring ski. Thanks to Splat for great service! Enjoyed hanging out! Can't wait to put some binders on the 191 fats and get them on the snow! If they ski as good as they look, they will be killer!
Had a full 6 days on mine now and getting to know them well. Have now had them in some powder as well and they rocked. Yesterday I tested their speed limit and didn't find it :) My only negative and it's not really one (because I didn't buy them for this) is that they are a little bit of a handful in moguls and really tight places as they are so stiff. But I'll put up with that because of how they perform over the rest of the mountain. The full carbon lay up is insane. You get such pop in the turns and in pow they are like a GS race ski ! Love them Pat.
Shame the FKS binders have broken so they are out of action for a day or so. Anyone ever seen the rivot on the heel come loose on a pivot? Flippin things pre-released at about 40mph coming along a traverse.
Good meeting up with you, ColoMike! Damn, that Denver SIA show sucks compared to the goodle daze of Vegas. Heard they had beer nazis shaking down people's booths for beer, crowd was small, vendor displays seemed half as many as Vegas would have had and it was generally kinda lackluster. But the bars were good!Quote:
Originally Posted by ColoMike
MickeysEars - you should be seeing some more 191 Fat all carbons in the tram line. Did you get all the snow you asked for?
Pat - yep 60 inches just before we arrived and about 20 inches so far since we arrived. All good... you were pretty close with the 17th Jan for Tahoe snow ! Glad you got off the mark with 50 inches also. Ah there are some more in the Village hey? Have seen 10 pairs or so of 186/191 regular Lhasa Pow, but no other Fat's. Snow tomorrow hopefully so will keep my eyes peeled.Quote:
Originally Posted by splat
Another update.. today my skis are in at Pepi's as the FKS have broken so I took out some BMX 108 in a 188... I did like these last year but now having had the 191 Carbon FAT I really was missing my skis! I love the way you can vary the turn radius on the Bros so well and still get a clean solid carve. The 108's seem to be a little one dimensional in that they dont seem to have a great ability to vary turn radius.. yes is you crank them over they rail like the best but on much steeper terrain you want to be able to carve a different radius and they don treally like this. It's on or off.... the Bros however kill everything.. One weird aspect was the combo of the 108 and the Jester gave me serious knee ache. Went back and grabbed by dp pro+ (193cm) and they were so much better and no knee pains!
Summary - 191 Fat = best ski going and I'll use these almost everyday in USA and Europe.. very impressed Pat.
Was that you Splat or ColoMike walking around the show with the fat? Looked sexy, even from a distance. Almost yelled at you from a booth down to check em out but was showing some product so I decided it probably wasn't the best move.
Yeah, that was me or ColoMike. I had my homie Jeremy at the Wintersteiger booth do the ultimate grind and edge tune for ColoMike. I was wearing a hat, CM wasn't. Shoulda hollered anyways, we woulda hung around to shoot the shit with ya and show them off.
I've finally had a chance to ski my Fats in soft snow - 4 days of boottop to waist deep powder of many variations, and the skis performed flawlessly. I've never skied as fast or felt in so much control at speed. They behave absolutely predictable, never a nasty surprise. We've mostly been skiing in and out of moderately steep (35+ degree) trees, with a mix of tight turns and high speed bits in the open areas. I wish I could give a more nuanced description of how they are behaving but I keep getting lost in the moment. Certainly they like to go fast... the early rise is just enough to make the tips unsinkable but not enough to contribute to turn shape, so you have to get forward and work the ski to do medium or short turns. Which is great- straightlng between gaps or through tight spots feels rock solid.
They like to go fast. Doing short slow turns is fun too, but the ski won't do it for you. I'd say that the fast you go the happier they get, and that if you get in trouble the best answer is to point them downhill and go.
They do great in and on the snow, and when you fel like flying its laugably easy to pop off the tails and turn in the air or clear an obstacle.
I think the would be an awful lot of ski for an intermediate skier. They make powder super easy and fun if you already know how to ski it, but a beginner who tries to ski them from the back seat by muscling them around would be quite sad. That sort of skier should be looking at somethig with tail rocker and lots of sidecut like the DPS 112RP.
I should point out I have one of the first, I-beam stiff pairs. It sounds like they are coming out softer now, which would make them more user friendly and better for 99% of people (including me for the last hour of a long day when I get tired and want to ski lazy)
Conclusion: still think they are the best ski ever.
Glad you're still digging on yours Patches. I took mine out yesterday ski mountaineering because I haven't gotten around to epoxying the inserts into my K2 Hardsides. Definitely not the best ski for that, but they got the job done. They did a pretty decent job up high in some very funky snow. Definitely a little spicy on bulletproof in super-tight trees down low.
Biggest problem was that my ski crampons don't fit over the 117 waist. Definitely made skinning pretty sketchy in places.
I had a fun day on my 191 fats few weeks ago. The battery in my cam died before the good terrain opened so I'm reluctant to post weak inbounds stoke, overall fun day though
Patches - when you said you wanted them I beam stiff, I made them I beam stiff, no doubt, but a little voice inside me said, "I'm not sure Patches fully understands how stiff an I beam really is." Yours and auvgeek's and I think MickeysEars pairs are really fukkin stiff. A big guy who appreciates a stiff ski, I prefer the slightly less stiff pairs we did, including the hybrid. The flex in the nose is just right to initiate a flex through the body of the ski that comes into play at crucial moments of compression, turn initiation and rebound. Just shipped the last pairs of 191 Fat all carbons to sf in Norway and StuntCok in Japan. sf is going tele and wanted the softer flex, Stunts is going AT and wanted the stiffer flex. I can't wait to hear their feedback. whyturn is on the hybrids. ColoMike might comment on his softer version of the all carbon supa stiff flex, hopefully, and otto parts has the slightly less stiff stiffies, too. I felt like I had to talk otto parts into the softer stiffie, but I hope he'll thank me for that.
Piggity - I got a Mammoth pass so I'll be seeing you soon.
I'll take your word for it Pat... for now I'm enjoying the feeling of being a maglev train pointed fall line. And they turn easily and precisely when I want them to, so don't lose the recipe for the I beams just yet.
Still loving my mega stiff 191 Fats...! They are off to Chamonix next, so they will grace those great mountains soon. Only place I cursed them was when they wouldn't flex enough on a steep chute that wasn't wide enough for the skis and I was trying to avoid a huge rock... so I just went straight instead and they were fine -;) Still addicted to the way they accelerate out of the turn for such a big ski.
Well, by gawd, I love you guys that love 'em that stiff. Just got out for my first day of the season today on the 187 Fats and left trenches in that hard icy stuff at Squaw. Had I been on the 191 Fats, I woulda loved that, too. If any of you local boyz wanna try the 187s out, I mounted them with demo binders. I'm thinking I might mount some 191 Fats with sth 916s this week...cause I don't really want to share them all that much. And I heard we might get some snow...
And Patches - no knee pain whatsoevah!
I'm out for the season, but anyway are you making lots of 187s because that looks like my good-days ski for next year...or the 188 if it gets softer, tip rocker, and more sidecut.* (*I expect not.)
whippersnapper - once the word gets out on the 187 Fats, we'll be making tons of them for next year, I'm sure. It's such a sick ski that I could forego the 188s next year and just make 187 Fats. Serially.
Excellent Splat. It kinda felt like that's the way it was going. Besides, a ski as thin as an OG Bro almost looks nekkid anymore. And blimps like me, getting blimpier, can always use more float...
If the snow would cooperate this season then the 187's would be getting more hype, hard to hype any skis with such a dismal snow year. They are sick skis though. I only have 1 day on them but I was already trying to figure out how I could afford another pair next season.
The 187s were my first choice all last season when conditions were variable. They even worked good for me in big bumps. I haven't skied them this year because I loaned them to a friend and when I inquire how he likes them, he acts a bit like Golum when he has "Precious". I've only skied the new 183 Fats with the stiffer layup this year and they are great, but there is something extra in the 187s that I'm missing. Got a new pair on the way.
Come to AK so I can demo the 187's and the fat 191's! I love my 192's but something friendlier for touring is on the menu.
Would any 187 Fats be available around the time my tax return comes? How would you compare the 187 Fat to the 186 lhasa pow?Quote:
Originally Posted by splat
kevino - the 187 Fats have a traditional sidecut and a Lhasa-like rockered tip. The tail is not as loose as the 186 Lhasa, which is a cm narrower. The 187 is/has solid grip on ice and the tail holds because of that trad sidecut and tail width. It is solid through chop and crud and floats pow almost every bit as well as 186. Maybe we can get powdork to chime in on the 187. He skied it all last year, prolly 200 days. We have enough left to be finished to last a while, hopefully you filed early.
I had the pleasure of trying out the all new carbon weave which Pat is putting into next years version of
the 191 Lhasa Fat as well as getting his first full base grind and texture on the new wintersteiger.
Picking them up as they're being finished. it's a fun process to watch
http://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images...r-lake-059.jpg
pat and jeremy running them through the wintersteiger
http://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images...r-lake-067.jpg
the finished product is a BIG ski at 4.24 lbs/ski
http://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images...r-lake-069.jpg
so lets throw some heavy ass dukes on em
http://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images...r-lake-089.jpg
wax on
http://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images...r-lake-104.jpg
wax off (i guess technically, those are both wax off)
http://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images...r-lake-107.jpg
there's a good view of the carbon weave
http://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images...r-lake-114.jpg
this was on a wednesday on the way to crater lake, oregon since tahoe had zero at this point. crater lake had zero to very little as of the previous friday. things change fast. the skis are definitely lively and i think the tree lines show it off pretty well. the ski definitely has the dual personality of the 196's (the red white and blue ones on the wall in the pic above) from 2 years ago meaning you can stand on the tips and point it or stand in the center and get it to act like a smaller more playful ski.
when i returned on saturday it was hitting tahoe. high snow levels meant not much in the way of depth, but everything was plastered nicely. on monday they loved kirkwood as well
then, on tuesday, disaster struck. ok, stupidity is what struck
i went for what was supposed to be a short tour off tahoe mountain down to the high school to ski with the dog and look at what might be fun skiing at times. anyway, it had turned to mank and wasn't fun and was not good for the dog once he was out of the skin track. we turned around and went back. for some reason i left the skis in the snow in front of the car instead of leaning against the car or set perpendicularly on parallel poles on the road behind the car. to the point, i drove away without the skis/skins/duke bindings, and mismatched poles. since i had a cold, i didn't ski for the next three days and on friday i cleaned the car and realized the skis weren't there, nor in the garage or my room. i went back immediately (which was friday afternoon at 4 (coincidentally right when i had to be at work) and the skis were gone. i put up flyers and have received two calls both saying they saw the skis on thursday.
they are blems and have a noticeable sidewall repair that has been covered over a little with white marker. as far as i know they are the only 191 fat lhasa out there at this time with the darker graphics and the perpendicular weave (without the diagonal pattern) but Pat can correct me if I'm wrong on that. Mounted with old dukes (black/gold/small) at 306mm. BD Glidelight skins in the tire tread pattern were also included in the package dammit.
here they are
http://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images...e-114-thin.jpghttp://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images...114-bigger.jpg
and here is where they were
http://www.aboutlaketahoe.com/images.../lost-skis.jpg
it is important to note that it snowed or rained in tahoe six out of six days i had the skis, and it it's only snowed 2" in the 12 days since. help find my skis and i promise it will snow again.
Here's hoping we find those in the lift line some day.
If I ever make it to Reno I am bringing beer and demanding a tour of the factory.
Thanks. That sounds like what I want. Is the weight around the same, ~4.3 lbs per ski? And yes, I did file early!Quote:
Originally Posted by splat
This years are probably lighter than that since he is using better carbon but that sounds close to last years weight. Ironically, I weighed mine earlier today, mounted with Barons, and it showed 7.2lbs. My scale might need to be calibrated, regardless they are ridiculously light
Just shipped the last pair of finished 191 Fats and went looking to see what we have left that needs finishing. Looks like we're down to six pair of hybrids. Three of those pair have the twill fabric on top like whyturns and three have the 45/45 weave like powdorks. The 45/45 pairs are def the trippier-looking of the two but seem to have come out with slightly higher cambers.
Price has been dropped to $899 on all our skis, 179 Lhasas to $799.
Price drop, say whaaaaat? Insane deal for a sick ski.
Edit: My 191 Fats mounted with heavy PX15 race bindings weighed in around 7.2lb's also, super light for a bigger ski
Oh god, oh god. Looks like I need to start saving now. How long is the price reduced.
Til they're gone, Jed. Only three or four pair left. Got a pair of hybrids with the trippy carbon tops like in powdork's photos that will be going into a blem sale tomorrow. Camber came out too high but they're cherry.
I should have the cash in the fall. I want pure carbon anyway for the dynafit experience.