My intention is not to cunt up this thread, and I debated for awhile before deciding to post as it is not constructive to what is a healthy discussion on this board regarding what many think should be done regarding signage. Also, in advance, i mean no discrepsect to Sam or anyone else who has lost friend or family member to an avalanche.
I do, however, have a different opinion that is part of the broader debate. And after reading a couple of posts i couldn't resist adding a voice of dissent...and in the time it took me to write this flatlander hit on a number of points, so sorry for repeating anything.
Signs SHOULD NOT go up everywhere all over the place, near every road in the moutains. There are signs in place at numerous locations along berthoud pass and I believe at the summit of loveland pass. These are CDOT signs that are most commonly noticed as respositories for stickers. These are not be as explict as the group here is proposing, but in my view, the "scary" message is no more effective than the boilerplate language which already exists. A sign is not going to change behavior, evidence of which can be seen every year at the Canyons, Alta, Berthoud, Loveland Pass, Arapahoe....all places where there are signs or gates, and on a regular basis people with and people without the knowledge or skill ignore the sign and are killed. The picture from the canyons with the skull and cross bones is mounted on a swinging gate through which you have to forcibly walk. How much more explicit can you get? Do i want a turnstile at every pullout and pass in the state? No. The next logical step in protecting ourselves from ourselvs and our decisions is a USFS ranger at the trailhead doing beacon checks and forcibly denying access to the backcountry. Will this save lives...yes I am willing to concede that this extreme hypothetical would save lives. Would I support this infantilization of the general public in the interest of safety? No. And for the same reason, i don't support the infinitely more reasonable approach of trying to sign our way to safety.
Passive liberalism is for pussies? Give me a break. I'll tell you what is for pussies: having a sign posted for every hazard at every location at every time. Your logic is the kind that endorses suing mcdonalds for not labeling their coffee as hot, and wants Homeland Security to spend millions protecting the sewage treatement plant in Fargo from Al Qaeda.
Your BS about "syaing or doing nothing is not the American way" sounds like a politician's bluster. What I want is for people to take responsibility for their actions and to stop insisting that the USFS, CDOT, CAIC, FOBP, ski resort or anyone besides themselves and their partners are responsible for what happens once they leave their car or the boundary rope. Are there a lot of uneducated people out there using these access points? Well yes, that is obvious. Can they use help in learning about avalanches? Yes. Is a sign at the trailhead going to be that final piece of information they internalize and which makes them reconsider their actions? Not a chance in hell as far as I see it. Outreach and education systems exist and many people are capable of utilizing the educational resouces, weather and avalanche forecasts and accumulated knowledge of fellow backcountry skiers to keep themselvs safe. If backcountry users willfully disregard all the resources and input avilalbe to them in advance, why should we think that a sign in big letters is going to be anything but a placebo?
To end on a positive note, I'll offer a few suggestions of where I think that maggot support SHOULD go and that I believe would both prove more effective in terms of changing behavior while also respecting the fact that in a free country at some point individuals must take responsibility for their own actions.
- Write your state legislator(s) and tell them that the CAIC should receive more and more stable state funding to do more extensive outreach and education efforts in schools, through print and radio media, and through targeted TV public service announcments.
- Write to Colorado Ski Country USA and encourage resorts to subsidise educational events like beacon bowls, make their ski patrols avilable for educational purposes on the slopes, and perhaps even to do occassional "adopt a pass" programs where members of nearby patrols (Winter Park/MJ at Berthoud; Loveland/A-Basin at Loveland; Vail and Copper at Vail) are paid to do outreach at trailheads or even lead free Backcountry laps for newbies.
- As lemon boy and others have stated, don't pick up Jonny Gaper at berthoud or loveland if they obiously are w/out gear. Or, taking the localism vibe that someone mentioned in some thread somewhere, pull over next to Jonny Gaper, ask if he has gear, if not then give him as thorough of a verbal lashing as your personality can muster, tell him to fuck off and get some gear and education and then drive away.
- Taking a cue from some enviro types who enjoy stickering soccer mom humvees with phrases like "i'm changing the climate , ask me how", print up some cheap sticker that read "I help kill people in the backcountry...ask me how." Carry them around and plaster them on cars you see with a bed full of gearless jonny gapers, or on the parked cars of those not running shuttle.
FINALLY, JOIN CAIC...GIVE THEM YOUR $$$...DO IT NOW