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is there a such thing as environmentally responsible holes in the ground? And what would happen to price is very little, in the big picture, there isn't that much oil in those places long term. Plus the amount of time for the market to see any of that oil is a pretty good ways out. Save the money, time, and resources and spend it in finding a better way.
When there are budget deficits created by things like a trillion dollar war in Iraq, the Federal Reserve Bank responds by creating new dollars to buy Treasury bills. With all these new dollars created out of thin air, the dollars you and I currently have become devalued - this is inflation. Now that our dollars are worth less, we have to use more of them to buy things like gas. Until we decrease the size of our massive welfare/warfare state and adopt sound monetary policy, we will continue to see prices rise.
In addition, oil is traded in dollars. When the dollar is weak, foriegn investors buy oil futures and further drive up the price. The dollar's value compared to the Euro over the past five years:
http://ichart.finance.yahoo.com/5y?usdeur=x
Long-term, these prices aren't a bad thing at all. You see lots of people actually using public transportation these days, or getting a moped/moto, or getting a used Geo Metro for their everyday needs and leaving the SUV at home. These are good things.
Meanwhile, with all this talk of market forces, what do you think the automakers are going to do? Toyota just sold its' 1 millionth Prius. If the US government won't get fuel standards up, market forces will.
My wife uses 10 gallons of gas per month, I use 20 gallons per month. I am thinking about changing jobs to work 1.5 miles from home.
Do something about it. Decrease demand.
Peak oil is here. Sell your truck, get rid of the snowmobile and buy some fucking skins to take pretty pictures.;)
Just in this morning:Quote:
Originally Posted by goldenboy
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/...oduction_N.htm
DETROIT — Ford Motor (F) no longer expects to return to profitability by 2009 and is cutting North American production the rest of this year as high gas prices and the weak economy continue to hurt sales, the company announced Thursday.
GB is exactly right...Rome isn't full of mopeds and smart cars because they are "environmentally friendly" - they are full of them because if too damn expensive to drive anything else.
In this most important of threads I would just like to point out that going out and buying a second "efficient" vehicle of almost any kind represents false economies for two main reasons:
1) the payback on the fuel savings probably not as good as you think.
2) a second vehicle binds up assets (both personal and collective) that could be better used elsewhere.
True, drilling may take a while but if you don't start it will take longer won't it :). And yes, there are thousands of oil and gas wells around the world that have very little impact on the environment.
Besides, the world wants it's oil and they are going to drill for it. Wouldn't it be better for the USA to do the drilling so that we can have the control over how safely it gets done?
The free market will dictate when it makes economic sense for alternative fuels to take over.
(Read "FREE TO CHOOSE" by ALTA regular Milton Freedman <R.I.P.> You'll be sold on the free market system again)
You also have the problem of unintended consequences with alternates. Look at ethanol and it's roll in food inflation for example. Put simplistically,People are literally starving around the world because we are burning food in our cars.
$109 to fill the van yesterday
ONE HUNDRED AND NINE DOLLA FILLUP!!
Where the fuck are the fuel efficient vans in this country.
They killed the Chevy Astro in 2005 - that was a good idea there Mr AutoExecutiveDouchebag.
Dodge/Mercedes Sprinter would be great, but they dont make enough for supply and wont offer any good financing deals for those overpriced units.
i've got my sight set on this 80mpg monster (CBR125R), but i'm gonna need you guys to keep driving big 5.6L trucks down in the US so we can extend our riding season to more than 6 months up here.
http://www.bikez.com/pictures/honda/...0-%20Honda.jpg
Yeah, I'll agree with that, except maybe for people with huge commutes. I guess I'm just looking at it as a sign of the market, and what the market will continue to do with high gas prices.Quote:
Originally Posted by lemon boy
Hey, he has almost the same name than a famous nobel prize winner !Quote:
Originally Posted by TROLL-HOLE-E-O
So tired of the "drill the US" and "build refineries" BS.
The US has 3% of world oil reserves and uses 25% of world oil production. US oil production peaked 20 years ago. Drilling the last few drops out of the exhaused US reservoirs will make no difference at all to world oil prices, literally ANWR is a drop in the bucket.
Oil companies are not building refineries because they know that global oil production is peaking, so that a multi-billion refinery with a 30 year life is a bad investment. Blaming lack of refinery construction on enviros is SO stupid. If there was money to be made, refineries would be built in Mexico, where enviros have no voice, and the gas would be piped to the US. The fact that this has not occurred shows that the business conditions are preventing refinery construction, not enviros. Anybody who thinks Mexico has environmental protections has not been there.
The bottom line is that markets work, and supply and demand will balance at some price, depending on the short and long term oil market elasticity. Which means that oil prices will increase to whatever level is required to force US consumers to conserve, whether that is $5/gallon or $20/gallon. 5% of world population will not continue consuming 25% of world oil production, although I suspect that we will bankrupt ourselves both individually and as a society before we accept reality.
i think it is funny that every single one of the worlds issues right now comes down to one factor....and that one factor nobody ever wants to talk about, especially here in the US.
OVERPOPULATION!!!!
So kill yourself and start the trend! :FIREdevilQuote:
Originally Posted by montanaskier
We have an oil man in the White House, a country that is spread out like a cheap hooker and love cars. Until the EPA and greenies allow more refineries we’re fucked.
shit, u ever see how much they pay for a LITER of gas sumplaces in europe. don't complain. our gas is still cheaper then most the world. but i would really like to see a hydrogen/electric movement. as long as it gets me to the ski hill i dont care what it runs on.
There is more oil on the western slope of CO than in the middle eastQuote:
Originally Posted by tommyvee
Why is it multi-billion :rolleyes2Quote:
multi-billion refinery with a 30 year life is a bad investment. Blaming lack of refinery construction on enviros is SO stupid.
We have enough oil to not worry about the world market, we just can't play with it.Quote:
The bottom line is that markets work, and supply and demand will balance at some price, depending on the short and long term oil market elasticity. Which means that oil prices will increase to whatever level is required to force US consumers to conserve, whether that is $5/gallon or $20/gallon. 5% of world population will not continue consuming 25% of world oil production, although I suspect that we will bankrupt ourselves both individually and as a society before we accept reality.
At the moment oil prices as a % of individual income are still lower than at their peaks in the 70's. This means that there is still plenty of room for them to go up.
As previously mentioned high prices are annoying, but not a bad thing as they will increase the pressure on people to make use of more energy efficient solutions.
I sure have seen a lot more bike riders out there these days.
In a nut shell:
#1) Major growth in China and India + continued growth in Europe and America.
#2) Finite supply of recoverable oil = expensive to retrieve & find
#3) U.S. fiscal policy = spend and borrow + low interest rates = more dollars + inflation = deflation of U.S. dollar and increased prices.
#4) U.S. congress that nary batted an eye when the likes of ARCO, BP, Concoco, Philips Petroleum, Exxon, Mobile, Shell, Texaco, Chevron et al came a knockin' and wanted to merge. It's better for the consumer they told 'em.
#5) Environmental restrictions on new U.S. refineries + cost of new refineries + see #2 above.
#6) No comprehensive and coherent energy policy since the OPEC embargo of 1973.
#7) Lazy, ignorant Americans who have an entitlement mentality.
I know I've probably missed a few things, so please feel free to add to the list.
Back in 03' when I bought my Ram 2500 cummins Diesel was a good $1.00 cheaper than gas. I knew that spending the extra 6K for the diesel was a smart idea.
doht! Just filled up - cost $140.00 I only work 8 miles from home so it is tough to justify buying a new vehicle. There are no bio diesel stations around here either.
Thought about a motorcycle but the 8k in cost is a lot of gas.
What you running in your diesel these days lemonboy?
The bright side to oil prices is that skiing is not inherently oil-consuming.
Anybody who has skiied in the Alps knows that the train/telepherique/skin/refuge system will let you access awesome terrain with almost no direct oil usage.
If gas prices are this high next winter, I predict that the I-70 resorts in CO will be running bus systems from the Front Range. Personally, I welcome a few less whining snowmobiles, a few less pickups/SUVs clogging the roads, a few more bicycles, and little less smog. all of which high gas prices will bring. Your mileage may differ.
Dont worry though - food is also going to get more expensive, especially with the push for ethanol production driving up corn prices. Maybe this will reduce fuel prices, but your taxes will be making up the difference as they go into subsidies for ethanol production.
Ummm, Big Oil has a profit margin of 8%. Most all other companies see that number up at 20-30%.Quote:
Originally Posted by GoNads
Well of course it depends on circumstances. We have big ( 1 ton diesel Dodge) and small (Toyota Matrix standard). As a couple we need two vehicles but 90% of time we don't. I bike to work or take transit. She needs car for work and gets paid for mileage. Try to use Matrix for most use but if two vehicles are needed then the truck is used. Or if need to haul a trailer then of course the truck is used. ( trailers in the dougw stable, 2 horse, 4 horse, utility 14,000lb, and travel )Quote:
Originally Posted by lemon boy