I like the weights for touring skis. Light enough to tour on. Heavy enough to ski great in soft conditions.
They’re not really meant as resort skis. I could see the use for a 2500gram Ren as a resort ski.
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I like the weights for touring skis. Light enough to tour on. Heavy enough to ski great in soft conditions.
They’re not really meant as resort skis. I could see the use for a 2500gram Ren as a resort ski.
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Originally Posted by mr_pretzel
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Originally Posted by Mustonen
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Originally Posted by mr_pretzel
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Originally Posted by mr_pretzel
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Originally Posted by Mustonen
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Originally Posted by North
So excited to get on these…..Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustonen
(Just spraying)
Did I read that right— the Hoji is traditionally stiffer (burlier?) than the Renegade?
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No experience yet but have a pair on order!Quote:
Originally Posted by doebedoe
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A pair of the new, redesigned Hoji's just showed up at my door in a 191. Rocker profile looks great, much less drastic but still very much a continuous rocker profile. The biggest impression I had compared to my 195 2019 version is the stiffness from boot to tail. At least in terms of hand flex, for whatever it's worth, it is noticeably stiffer in the tail. The 195's were somewhat soft but these are legit stiff. Tip doesn't feel much different, still on the softer side.
I would like a pair of 191 Renegades. That is my post.
Anyone in Tahoe area have a recent pair that I can try?? BSL is 325. Plz and thx!!
Also, saw this on a Blister review of the 193 Moment Chipotle Banana:
https://blisterreview.com/gear-revie...hipotle-bananaQuote:
While I’ll be offering several more comparisons in the Deep Dive of this ski, I want to mention one now because it’s quite poignant. The other day I was skiing deep powder from the helicopter in a combination of moderate and steep terrain. I started my day on the Chipotle Banana and was obviously having a great time, but about halfway through my day, I swapped out to a pair of 4FRNT Renegades to compare the two seemingly similar skis on the same terrain and snow. From my first turn on the Renegades (which was a steep and sluffy turn right off the ridge!) I noticed an immediate and very obvious contrast between the two skis. The Renegade felt looser, faster, surfier, and pretty much better and easier to ski in every way. The faster I skied, the more I preferred the Renegade, which allowed me to lean into the shovels and pushed into big carved or slarved out turns. On the Chipotle Banana on the run prior, I was constantly feeling the need to lean back a little to avoid driving the shovels deep into the snowpack, no matter how fast I skied. I just couldn’t escape the more centered / backseat stance on the Chipotle Banana, but could immediately get in the middle and front of the Renegade in the same conditions. When I got to choke at the bottom of the run that was becoming tracked out, the Chipotle Banana crushed through the chop with more ease and stability, as expected.
...tasty...
I am a renegade fanboy. I talk more shit about that ski than would be considered healthy. Or- I’m naive. Which is probably kinda true.
Regardless, it’s posts like this that make me question wax.
I’ve never skied a Chipotle. But it’s my immediate assumption that if any ski that big/shape requires a backseat stance, the base is probably dry.
People talk rocker, flex, shape all day long. But I’d be lying to your face if I didn’t admit that my renegade sucked balls after my wax went dry.
Base is so goddamn important in big skis.
meter-man, there's a couple new version (Ibex) 191 Rens in gearswap... including mine (with alpine and AT inserts)! Just FYI, proceed
As good as Blister is, it seems like they often just unwrap the skis, no wax, no edge prep, no detuning - like 3 day a year joeys. I would not be surprised at all if you're correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by gaijin
Thanks for the heads up!Quote:
Originally Posted by tang
Isn’t there a Hoji thread? I mean…you can talk about whatever wherever, but seems odd that the Ren thread has been hijacked by the Hoji.
have definitely experienced this on some S7s before on the groomers, they can get really slidey and are pretty shit to ski when the groomers aren't in top conditionQuote:
Originally Posted by D(C)
Oh boy! 2021 Renegades in hand. See pics comparing my 2013 owls to the new ones. See for yourself.
My thoughts based on my own shotty opinion and best guesses:
My desire for more tip rise came through.
The tail appears to be 1mm narrower.
More pronounced rocker line; I welcome this for a little rest more adaptability in tighter stuff and hopefully even easier to get tubed.
Not sure what to make of the increased tail rise.
I'm personally stoked for the 191 length since I am only 5'9".
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...71757c30dd.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...84b771c80a.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...462fdb9e47.jpg
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I ski and love the Owl so these pics are very very greatly appreciated by me.
Thank you.
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I'll second that! Would love to get on a pair of the new renegades to AB with the owls.Quote:
Originally Posted by gaijin
I probably don't ski mine as much as gaijin does, but they are the favorite ski in my quiver. I've mainly used them for touring duties, but I pulled the dynafits off and put a cast set up on them this year because I'm always wanting to ski them in bounds.
Owl stoke
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...113187dc9f.jpg
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You r welcome:)Quote:
Originally Posted by gaijin
Do your owls look like they have the same rocker line as mine?
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I’m a Renegade owner again. Previously owned 2013s (sold) and 2017s (gave to my 22 yr old son).
Been skiing really light and really deep powder at Whitewater all week…. and tonight had a couple of extra beers and somehow now there are some new 184cm Bear Renegades on the way.
Thinking of mounting with STHs or Pivots or maybe even Pivot/CAST….or a Duke PT….we will see when they get here.
You are such an evil man. The way you casually drop in with new boards on the way and you can’t even choose a binding… all based on a dream week at Whitewater (that may or may not repeat again.)
There’s no reason to Pivot without CAST. And there’s no reason to STH without Pivot.
So, clearly this is about a CAST vs Duke PT.
For Japan, as I own a Ren/STH, the wanted set up is a Ren/CAST.
But you do you. We’ll cheer on whatever makes the most sense.
By the way— Japan is popping early this year. I can only hope this level of snowfall remains constant. It feels like everything is a month early. It’s New Year, but it feels like we’re entering February.
Hey gaijin,
Ya sorry. Can’t help it. I am who I am.
Whitewater has been epic since Dec 23. The lightest and deepest blower pow that I’ve skied in a while. It has snowed 4-5’ since we got here.
I’ve been loving it on my 181cm 115mm Icelantic Nomads, which are great pow skis (150-115-140), and they only have 2mm of camber so they are pretty maneuverable. But I miss that full-rocker, no-thinking feel when skiing Rens fast in deep pow.
Re bindings….I have new in the box Duke PT 16s which were destined for my Blanks, which already have some blue STH 16s on them. Also have some gold Pivot 15s (on R11s) and white Pivot 18s (on Protos) that I may sell, cause I bought the Rens and Blanks. Blasphemous to think of selling R11s and Protos I know. But the quiver is big.
Not sure I want to CAST for some reason? I think I’ll f up the CAST post mounts? And I don’t really get a good feel from the local shop about them doing it.
CAST Freetour is about $475CDN.
I could get another pair of Duke PTs from Corbetts for $629CDN, less selling the STH which only have a few days on them? And then could sell the Pivots too. So the “net” cost of Duke PTs is less than Pivot/CAST right now.
I plan on keeping the Rens for a while….so Duke PT may be the way to go. As it would be a blast to tour on them occasionally.
PS gotta tell this story…..my spouse and I run an online CPA firm….under the name “Forefront Consulting Ltd.” I’m a CPA but she isn’t so back in 2018 when we set the firm up we couldn’t use our names for our firm. So we picked Forefront. Therefore 4FRNT Rens are really a business advertising expense?
Notice the single 170cm 4FRNT Hoji standing in the corner of my office. Picked that up on eBay for $50 to use as a company sign:
http://forefrontconsulting.ca/about-2/
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I'm thinking about buying the renegade in 184 as a dedicated powder ski. I'm old and fat (64 yo, 5'10", 210lbs) and not a good powder skier, yet. I'm not looking to straight line and charge. (There are no 184 Hoji's available unless you buy skins with it.)
I have the Mfree 108's 192 which seem to force me in the back seat in order for them to plane near the top of the snow. Also have patrons in 192's and they are a lot of work to maneuver. (Perhaps these need to be mounted further towards the tail instead of on the line.)
In Sun Valley we don't get many opportunities to ski powder and it's typically pretty dense. After the first 15 mins it's mostly short shots and trees. I hope to become good enough to cat ski and perhaps heli ski in the coming years. BC is not a consideration at this point so sticking w an alpine binder, of course if the Hoji was the better option I'd buy the skins anyway. Unless the ski is a complete miss it will be in the quiver for a long time.
Any advice? Thanks.
Just grabbed the last pair. Can still change my mind though.
I say go for it. It’s great as a pow ski based on width and shape. It’s mellowed over the years - you’ll want to stay centered on it but it’s not as punishing as the early versions in case you get back in the tails. And it’s a pretty low weight for its size. Just be aware of the progressive mount. I don’t think you should stray far from the rec line, but you may go back some if you’re used to a more traditional mount point
Loving your optimism!Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopeless Sinner
Your skis don’t have to plane on top all the time. Be patient, quit leaning back, they’ll find their way there as you pick up speed. That m108 has a big tip, you absolutely should not have to lean back. Play with pushing the tip down and pulling it back up. Re: the Patrons, I’d guess that your problem there is patience, too. Small movements, let it happen…. {/unsolicited advice}Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopeless Sinner
Ski ‘em! You’re 64! It’s a few hundred bucks!Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopeless Sinner
You made a good purchase.
I’m 55 now and have owned Hojis and Rens off and on since I was 47 (had the Owl RENs and Pilsner Hojis in 2013). Had the HALs Rens in 2017.
I just re-bought 2022 184 RENs cause I miss that feel when you ski them. You know. Unthinking, loose, fast, and easy stupid fast in pow. They will make you ski pow better.
I’m putting Duke PTs on mine as this is a ski you want both for the resort on deep days but also to be able to take out in the side country.
Thanks guys the 184's are on the way!
I'll get to be a good powder skier, and all advice is welcome. My powder experience is on 201 Atomic slalom skis back in the day so the backseat comes naturally.
The Blanks are that good eh?Quote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
Yes but it’s more than that. Previously I had Shifts on my green R11s….so they at least got sidecountry duty, and the inbounds skiing prior to on those days. My latest R11s had Pivots. And too many other skis push it out of the way for inbounds duty. If I had to own 1 ski….R11 with Duke PTs could likely be it. But in a 10-11 ski quiver….R11s with Pivots don’t get skied.Quote:
Originally Posted by ticketchecker
Cause…
Blanks = more fun than R11,
Enforcer 104 = more versatile than R11,
Protos = more turny in pow than R11,
Then add in Rens, Nomads, Proto 118s for really deep days, and Ravens and M-Free 99s for not so deep days and when am I gonna ski the damn R11?
I just offered them to a buddy’s 16 yr old kid who rips, and needs skis. So we’ll see.
Or I could CAST them? But I think I’d rather put Marker Duke PTs on the Blanks.
This last week at Whitewater made me buy the Rens….kinda want some Pescados now too. Haha
Let me know if your R11’s don’t end up on that young rippers feet.
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MF108 floats better if you get out of the backseat. It seems counterintuitive but it allows the tip to flex and rise out of the snow.
Don't confuse float with bouyancy. Unless you're on a K2 Pontoon or something you're not going to always be on top.
Float in my book more means the ski gets "on plane" quickly and not get bogged down, making the ski maneuverable in deeper snow which may or may not correspond with how deep you're physically in the snow. A ski with good float can be skied in an athletic position without resorting to backseat tactics.
The Ren is not a buoyant ski but it does have good float... keep that in mind.
A good thing to try is to find a mellow pitch that you can gently straightline with some powder. Play with your fore-aft balance... you might be surprised how far forward you can get if you trust your tips.
Also, stop looking at your feet.
Yeah, and stop worrying about the damn tips. They’ll take care of themselves. Worry about the ski underfoot and slightly in front of your foot and look where you’re going.Quote:
Originally Posted by TAFKALVS
Thanks for the comments. Once I put my groomer zoomers back on I realized how badly I was skiing the MF108 wrt to the lack of an athletic posture and overly timid approach.Quote:
Originally Posted by TAFKALVS
I’ve been Renless for 3 years. Sold some beloved R11s and pink Ranger 102s to buy these. Happy to have Rens back in the quiver for a Powder Highway trip in Feb.
Mounted at -5.7cm with Duke PT 16s.
This time I have a Renegade bumper sticker too.
….paging drunk gaijin to comment here.
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Unfortunately I'm not very drunk right now, but I think we can all admit that you did a good deed by off-loading two worthless skis for an actual ski designed for pow. A big question on my end is how your new Ren compares to a HALS Ren.Quote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
I'm considering starting a new thread asking for comparisons to HALS Ren and Marshal's new C120. It's all speculative, but I never skied that OG pintail Lotus 120. But there is a reason (and probably a substantial one at that) that he hasn't yet listed a HALS-like Ren in his quiver.
So my drunk ass asks two things of you-- How does this Ren compare to a HALS? And on a further note-- how does it ski compared to an OG Lotus 120?
If you have never skied a Lotus 120, or don't have one in your quiver, then I will simply turn my head in disgust. "Who is this person?"
By the way, your binding choice on your new pretty, shiny, weak-ass looking Bear Ren makes me even angrier that it's not mine.
Also curious what boot you're using to drive/tour those? Looks like a rad daily driver for Japan's mid-season.
Those bear rens ARE really pretty…..
I didn’t really dig the Lotus 120. I don’t get along well with pintails….the nose pulls you around but the tail doesn’t finish the job. Rens are more neutral overall and result in a more rewarding, dynamic experience. For me. That’s super subjective, I know, but that’s what I’ve got. Rens are slashy and intuitive and oh so good and the Lotus 120 weren’t really those things, at least not for me. They were like a work truck. Got the job done with no drama.
HALs Rens vs. new Rens: I’m still figuring it out. New Rens have much better suspension. They lose a little bit of that slashy but always gotta be on it feeling, but still feel slashy. In good snow (which I’ve not found much of, lately) they still disappear in all the good ways. I haven’t found that feeling of getting low in good or funky snow and feeling like I’m skiing inside a tennis ball with new Rens….yet, but again….haven’t found much good OR funky snow lately and I’m also in piss poor shape compared to years past. I can say that I had no problem skiing HALs Rens as a daily driver… even on hard snow they had something ineffable that was FUN and I’m not quite getting that same vibe from the new ones, jury is still very much out, though.
How’s that for a subjective, not-really-saying anything comparison?
winky faceQuote:
Originally Posted by gaijin
Drool
What's HALS? I'm plain f'ing dumb.
Mustonen your description actually comes across very well. What's a tennis ball and what does skiing inside it feel like?
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HALS is just the cool looking wood sidewall. I dunno what it stands for and didn’t know it was called that until I asked the same question upthread a few pages back.Quote:
Originally Posted by skinipenem
I’d liken the tennis ball feeling to kind of bouncing around off of stuff. Centered and a part of the ski rather than using the ski as a tool? You don’t really arc turns on the Rens…. When you and they are in the zone you slide/roll/slash around. A part of that feeling is very much the reverse camber/matched side cut/stiff ski. You roll around so the ski meets whatever part of the hill you’re engaging with, but the ski itself doesn’t change that much in shape. Note that you also aren’t getting a ton of rebound out of it either, or at least that rebound you do get is different than loading up a traditionally cambered/shaped ski.
The tennis ball analogy is something somebody else used, maybe in this thread, though I think they meant something completely different.
Keep in mind that while I may not be a total beater, I’m beater-adjacent, but when I’m in my tennis ball I feel like a hero.
It’s been a long time since I skied the HALs Rens. My son still has our 2017s but his bsl is now bigger than mine. If ya need side-by-side rocker pics I can get some.Quote:
Originally Posted by gaijin
Ren binding choice.
I think you need the ability to walk in your Rens.
I considered CAST. Got sketched hearing some pillar issues (not being straight) with the CAST system. Duke PT 16s look burly. I’ll mostly be using these inbounds. And Duke PTs can quickly change between different soles.
Boots….Lupo Air 130 or Lupo HD 130 if I’m walking in the pins. Krypton 120 or 130 if skiing inbounds.
PS I’m tempted to post a pic a pic of my Rens and my new K108s for you gaijin.
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Owls and bearsQuote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...f8bca3518c.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...4146369326.jpg
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I regret selling my owls.
Ya big regrets here too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustonen
Here’s my Owls from 2013. Remember Sollyfit plates?
Kind of miss those Comis too. And the Pilsner Hojis. Good memories....this pow quiver was from when I had just got divorced and lived at a Baker cabin for the winter. 81 days at Baker that year.
Attachment 402056
PS here's the full quiver that year....Deathwishes and Belafontes.....fack! I could have probably just skied this quiver until now:
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