No shit Sherlock, I posted military style, which is what a 300BLK SBR is modeled after. Like every other AR platform weapon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Stainless
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No shit Sherlock, I posted military style, which is what a 300BLK SBR is modeled after. Like every other AR platform weapon.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Stainless
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Ah ok. My bad.
My wife has been a teacher her entire adult life.
Doors have always been locked. Again, it's a deterrent but will absolutely not stop anyone from getting in.
The resource officer at one school made it perfectly clear multiple times to many teachers that he was going home at the end of the day no matter what.
The issue is the guns. Americans and their guns.
Are the ammosexuals good with big pharm getting the same protection for slinging opioids? They're already much more highly regulated/controlled than guns.. Yet Purdue Pharma is getting gutted by the settlements coming due. Oxy doesn't take itself..Quote:
Originally Posted by Flounder
The thought of those cops high-fiving and good-gaming each other during training contrasted against their gutlessness is something else.
video game play acting ...Quote:
Originally Posted by Mazderati
. . .Quote:
Originally Posted by jackstraw
if a 'locked door' "will absolutely not stop anyone from getting in. " it is not a "deterrent" and does not sound like a locked door to me -
so let's prop the doors open, claim the Only issue is guns, drop a bunch of f* bombs and try to sound tough.
or
we could look for solutions to the problem(s) --
you'll get no argument from me that guns are part of the problem - but guns by themselves are not carrying out these massacres - this is a people problem ;
when a thread about school Safety becomes thirty pages of ' all things guns ' , we have further evidence this is a people problem.
when the ownership of assault weapons ( definition - those designed and intended for killing people. there are other definitions - we can get lost in the minutiae of arguing the definition, but let's start there > guns designed to, and intended to, kill people. )
... when the ownership of assault weapons is defended as a "valuable" investment, I would offer, one needs a better investment strategy.
so., school Safety -
I hate the term 'hardening' schools - it certainly fits the lexicon of the era, but let's try to make schools safer again.
up-thread, the idea of school Safety was dismissed as "insane." Thank you, dunfree - "stupid is, as stupid does. " (Gump)
it IS the teachers who are in the best position - and have the most to gain by taking protective measures. lock the door - Especially when the classroom is equipped with a Safety door.
these are different times, and we need to recognize society has changed -
Safety First. And always. Safety always --
I would be happy if citizens surrendered assault weapons. it ain't going to happen willingly; and it ain't going to happen anytime soon.
we can make schools safer - by September. but it requires buy-in., and it requires ,,, buy-in. parents, teachers, society, administrators, the public. students.
and one of the problems I see is schools are a current focal point for arguments about covid policy. it is sickening.
we aren't even going to be able to agree on basic, fundamental steps to enhance Safety.
lock the door. lock the door. a barrier door, Not a cylinder lock --
authorized entry Only. does one have an appointment to be there (?) authorized entry Only. lock the door
let's start there. tj
alternatively,
This is the cost of living in the gun culture -
now I see why americans live elsewhere -
I doubt I am going to do that. but If I was forty ( or twenty-five ), that might merit serious consideration.
. . . back to your Gun 'discussion' ...
Someone should make him a gofundy. I wanna buy him a beer.Quote:
Originally Posted by ::: :::
The issue is parenting actually. Not guns, not mental issues, fuck the social pressure breeders. And they want to encourage that too. No you can't fuck with your body? Hits head on wall gives up. Locked and loaded. Merca.Quote:
Originally Posted by jackstraw
any way you cut it people will find guns, so maybe the issue is asking why people want to kill other people and why do they think it would be a good thing ?
Attachment 417597
The artist dated that in ‘17
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Great point, it’s not even worth it to try anything at all to help the children in our country. Kinda like every morning now I stopped even eating my breakfast since I’ll just end up shitting it out sometime later…Quote:
Originally Posted by XXX-er
Would it be ok to make it more difficult to obtain guns, or is it no deal?
If people are so interested in having guns to defend themselves from our government, why don’t they just stockpile them illegally? Why care about laws during an insurrection?
The less guns there are to find the more valuable said guns become and the harder and more expensive they are to get.Quote:
Originally Posted by XXX-er
If we required all guns to be registered and the owners of those guns to be responsible for them the number of illegal guns would slowly go down.
Also, to get something illegal, like a gun you have to know the sort of people that know the sort of people that sell those things.
Most of these mass shooters are kinda loners, socially inept, weirdos for lack of a better term.
They are going to have a harder time finding illegal things plus lots of criminals that would have no issues shooting an adult for a number of reasons would never sell a gun to someone they thought was going to kill a bunch of little kids.
There is a code.
It wouldn't fix everything overnight but it would be a start.
Maybe just ban weirdos then!?!
Hey now.
Well identifying kids who struggle socially and helping them learn social skills as well as stopping bullying and promoting inclusion, tolerance and acceptance of differences probably wouldn't hurt.Quote:
Originally Posted by jfost
This might be unpopular with both sides but here we go:
The ATF recently changed the requirements (process) for buying a suppressor (silencer for laypeople/movie folks). Note that they make firearms quieter but they are FAR louder than what you hear in the movies, FWIW. But I digress...
I've been interested in them for a while as my hearing isnt what it used to be but it was a giant pain in the ass...fingerprints at the sheriff, giant applications, find a suppressor dealer (special ATF certification), get passport phtos taken, etc., then wait for a year to hear back.... so I never got around to it and didn't care enough to deal.
Recently, the ATF has created a digital process. Essentially, you go to the dealer, pay for the suppressor which they then put in a safe, step over to a digital kiosk that takes your finger prints, photo, all of your information and submits the whole kabab to the ATF digitally. Supposedly, approval for the suppressor "stamp" (approval for YOU and only YOU to use said suppressor) now takes about 90 days, at which point I come back to get that suppressor out of the dealer's safe--all assuming that I pass the FBI/ATF deeper background check.
So...why not leverage this tech for all firearms? It would NOT be an end to firearms violence but would be a meaningful step in prevention and also put in place a delay. Personally I think a 14 day delay would be reasonable for most firearms but that's just me. I've been hunting most of my life and cannot ever remember a time where I needed a new gun inside of 14 days.
In the end, it wouldn't change which firearms you could buy nor infringe upon your right to do so, but the deeper background check combined with delay seems like it would be helpful, no? I mean, the tech is already there.
Man, I'm for anything that increases the time period between "want me a gun" and "got me a gun". Inconvenience seems like a small price to pay for a potential decrease in gun violence.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Reverend Floater
I'm at the point where I'd be pretty stoked on pretty much any move towards more gun control, however insignificant it may seem. Small changes won't solve the problem, but will have an impact IMO.
Texas. It earned it.
The issue is the whack job locking himself in a 4th grade classroom and killing kids. He could have done that with almost any gun and cops have no ability to breech. Hardening schools is the only solution.Quote:
Originally Posted by jackstraw
The AR kept the cops at bay. And when the cops are out gunned we need to take action. If we’re fair, and rule out suicide by active shooter in their job profile, This is a perfect example of how they were powerless.
* I’ll also add, an AR gives the lunatic confidence. Emboldens him, fills his fantasy. Yes I’ll say a riot gun would have had the same outcome, but maybe he’d never try in the first place.
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He was in there for almost an hour. He could have killed with a knife. It doesn't change the problem. Look deeper into psychosis.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cono Este
Seriously, look at the situation. He went to school there. He blasted rounds outside, he announced it on facebook, he went in, found a classroom and popped rounds for a long time. Simple. Then start asking why. He was in a closet. He just wanted to extract max pain. But why? That is the question. Can you approach it? The kid was hurting, why? Not because of guns. Why was he hurting enough to do that? Do you have an approach for that? We have all felt max pain, but didn't shoot children. Why did he? That is a story that maybe parents can learn from, no?
I don't assume to know when the last time you talked to someone of that age, but the last time I did it scared the fuck out of me.
And as a P.S. you are a fucking asshole, as much as I try to treat you with a modicum of respect as a person. That's just me venting.
^^^yes, but why is it only happening here? You have kids with mental problems all over the world ....im not confident anything worthwhile will get done because both sides of the aisle value their egos more than compromising any concessions with guns. Whether background checks or eliminating AR type purchases. Just my 2 cents.
aka Class 3.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Reverend Floater
The Silencer Shop kiosks work for all Class 3 items.
The fact something that makes a gun less obnoxious is Class 3, is absurd.
Of course this would only work if you require private sales to go through a FFL.
And grocery stores, and Walmarts, and shopping malls, and churches, and synagogues, and mosques, and outdoor concert venues, etc....Quote:
Originally Posted by Cono Este
Beau’s idea here makes a lot of sense to me given the political realities
Coupled with making the waiting period “as long as it fucking takes to make us comfortable that you are not a danger to self and others”
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Reverend Floater
They aren't allowed to. NRA and others lobby hard to prevent digitization of processes or anything that would eliminate the burden of tracing and data patterning to do things like identify problematic straw purchasers.
Here's an older article, but as far as I know, these laws still stand.
https://www.thetrace.org/2016/08/atf...ble-databases/
A suppressor shouldn’t be harder to get than an AR and a handful of 30 round magazines that’s for sureQuote:
Originally Posted by Bobby Stainless
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The cost of gun violence in America is approaching $300 billion annually. Everybody’s taxes are paying for the gun problem and it's yet another reason the National Rifle Association and other influential gun rights advocates don't want anything digitized or studied.
I don’t get your last paragraph. I have two 18 yr olds, twins. I have a harder time than most trying to imagine this.Quote:
Originally Posted by MakersTeleMark
We ban assault weapons and kids won’t have access to the same weapons they precondition themselves to use playing CD 12 hrs a day. They won’t have confidence to take on the town, and it will save some lives vs a shotgun. And when it happens the police will have a chance.
My GYM is better designed and has more security than my kids school. Jewish center, they stopped waiting for the govt to do something.
Security is a growing industry around the world. Chile is 10x more dangerous than it was in the 80’s. Guns come down from Columbia all my friends sold their houses and move to high rises due to crime.
It’s a fact of life. And it’s a fact of life even democrats will leave the lunatics with an arsenal.
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- Your first point is just wrong. The cops were inside the school within two minutes of the shooter entering the school. During which time the shooter had already fired a 100 rounds. Two cops immediately received grazing wounds and that's why they backed away. If the shooter had been armed with only a knife then even the incompetent cops of Uvalde would have just shot him.Quote:
Originally Posted by MakersTeleMark
- Old people complaining about young people is timeless. The bigger the age difference the worse it seems to the olds. In fact, the overall rate of school shootings was higher in the mid 90s than now. For some reason the rise of school shootings coincided with the proliferation of easy-to-buy assault style weapons. Then, shootings started to go down in late 90s and early 00s before ticking back up.
- I think all the school drills, all the security, all the media coverage, combined with easy access to weapons have made school shootings a cultural meme like serial killers were in the past. Serial killers used to imitate other serial killers. Now gunmen are imitating other gunmen.
It's clear that the mental health system in this country is badly broken. My Dad was a psychiatrist who worked for the state and the Feds (with the VA), and I grew up with this crisis brewing, my Dad talked about it a lot, and predicted it. Unfortunately he was very right.
It's also clear that guns are out of control, and I use that phrase advisedly. There is a lack of control. That's obvious to anyone.
But to say that nothing can be done about guns because the mental health system is broken is just whataboutism. Both things need to be addressed.
Another offshoot of Reganomics.... shutting down the federally funded system of mental health hospitals. Now the answer is to put the crazy people in their parent's basements and HOPE they take their meds..Quote:
Originally Posted by ötzi
This is also a problem that universal healthcare would greatly alleviate.. It would better facilitate annual/periodic psych exams for CCW/CCL holders. And, the people most opposed to those are the paranoid nutjobs (but wut if da gubbermnt just says im insane to tek muy gunz?) that shouldn't have guns in the first place...
AWB is put into law 1994 and expired in 2004. Is it coincidental that is the same timeline in your post?Quote:
Originally Posted by MultiVerse
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This makes too much senseQuote:
Originally Posted by ötzi
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Where’s Louise Fletcher when you need herQuote:
Originally Posted by SumJongGuy
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Maybe you should speak to an educator. While doing so ask for some English 101 tips also.Quote:
Originally Posted by skiJ
Doors...[emoji1782]
Also, those mentioning parents and raising children properly. That sounds wonderful and all, but unfortunately it's not reality for so many children these days. The opioid epidemic has left thousands of kids parentless either from death or prison. It's gut wrenching.
If you don't know or speak with educators you don't really know what is going on in the school systems. And on that note many schools are desperate for teachers, so let's make it like a prison because that's exactly why teachers want to teach. Give them guns too. Awesome!
Fuck you and your guns America. This happens nowhere else. That's the bottom line.
Reagan made the problem much worse but it started in the '60s with the widespread introduction of psychotropic drugs like Thorazine. State Legislatures nationwide said, shit, that means we can just give them drugs and shut down these damn expensive hospitals, let's do it! And away we went.Quote:
Originally Posted by SumJongGuy
My Dad said, "I used to be a psychiatrist but now I'm just a psychpharmacologist."
GOP congressman Rick Jacobs now supports more gun control https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news...t-is-unlimited. As so often seems to be the case with conservatives, their view on drug decriminalization or legal abortion access or XXYY only evolves when an event close to them ‘changes their mind’, as if they lack the empathetic skills to engage with, say, the geographically distant Parkland or Columbine tragedies.
One thing I may have missed in this thread regards the Mental Health strategy in actual practice. We all know that there are people whose mental health shifts after a nasty divorce or job loss or other trauma, so from a gun safety perspective the only logical mental health strategy would be one in which someone objectively determined ‘at risk’ would not only not be able to buy the class of weapons in scope, but would have to, at least temporarily, turn in their previously purchased firearms. But that latter action effectively requires a robust, digital, national registration database. Without it, the entire ‘mental health’ solution falls apart.
Not always, but often mental health crises are short term and fade with time. That's why waiting periods reduce total suicides because suicidal ideation, as does homicidal ideation, goes away some of the time.
Not just schools that would need to be fortified like prisons.. Crickets from the gun carrying crowd. We either accept that every week some "good guy" will lose his/her shit in one of these public venues somewhere if we keep allowing people to access these venues with guns/continue business as usual. Schools are actually the most secure of all the above already.Quote:
Originally Posted by SumJongGuy
I'm expecting some half hearted "it's the price of freedumbs" response to the reality above. Because me having my gun matters more than doing more to protect all the public places of business and fun. So tough shit and thoughts and prayers for everyone who gets killed when some suddenly former good guy/gal mows people down without warning..