Mystery Ranch Blackjack Avy airbag

For anyone who hasn't heard, WARY is out of business and Mystery Ranch stopped making the Blackjack. No idea if MR is looking for a new airbag supplier or not (would assume so), but current Blackjack owners might want to pick up a spare cylinder while still available (no doubt sledder vest owners are buying them up).

Snowbigdeal bought out WARY's inventory: http://www.snowbigdeal.com/avalanche...e-airbags.html

I bought an empty cylinder from them for $99 a couple weeks ago, but scarcity (or high season) has pushed the price up to $150.

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Originally Posted by 1000-oaks

For anyone who hasn't heard, WARY is out of business and Mystery Ranch stopped making the Blackjack. No idea if MR is looking for a new airbag supplier or not (would assume so), but current Blackjack owners might want to pick up a spare cylinder while still available (no doubt sledder vest owners are buying them up).

Snowbigdeal bought out WARY's inventory: http://www.snowbigdeal.com/avalanche...e-airbags.html

I bought an empty cylinder from them for $99 a couple weeks ago, but scarcity (or high season) has pushed the price up to $150.

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a few weeks ago I was looking for a smaller pack and MR said they would have something for 15/16, that was before Wary went out of business. Earlier this week wildsnow published MR stopped making the blackjack and they would have a new ski line for 16/17, so 2 years out as of Today!

ABS or Snowpulse/Mammut would be my guess, not sure K2 is OEM'ing the float bag, and not sure the battery fan bags are ready for OEM as well

I'm curious to see what happens and who MR is reaching out to

i'm looking for one of the non-airbag top pockets for the blackjack. pm me por favor if anyone has one they could part with.

bump.
kits back in stock at snow big deal.

Wow - I was not aware of this. Bummer, as I love my Blackjack. While not the lightest pack around, it carries excellent, is durable and very well thought out.

Is there a specific reason folks are loading up on extra cylinders (i.e., do they have a life-span I am not aware of)?

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Originally Posted by Unfrozen Caveman Lawyer

Is there a specific reason folks are loading up on extra cylinders (i.e., do they have a life-span I am not aware of)?

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Not really a life span, but there's a test date stamped on the bottles and they can't be refilled after so many years after that date (can't remember if it's five years, etc), but it's cheap to have the bottle pressure tested and re-stamped at a SCUBA shop.

I only grabbed a backup cylinder to keep in my gear bag in the car, so if I'm away on a long weekend I won't hesitate to pull the trigger early. Don't want to be trying to decide in the heat of the moment if it's worth blowing my only cylinder or not. With a backup available why not err on the side of caution.

Interesting news about Wary. At least the bag has potential to swap out inflation systems .... I wonder if you could use a jet force system retrofitted into this pack?

I've been flying a lot lately and was thinking about an extra cylinder to keep at home and having a "travel cylinder" just because the hunt to refill the pack on both sides of travel is a pain: keeping an empty one at home makes flying a bit easier.

Any splitters here? One really interesting thing is having a reliable way to attach poles and whippet while minimizing the chance that the pole punctures the bag during inflation. I normally do tips up and pole stashed to the side but that puts it right in the inflation area. Whippets are also next to impossible to stow tip down as well.

I split and thought the same thing, but haven't had a problem tips down yet. Attached to the zipperered side as I'm going through there to get into the pack most times. Tips into the ski loop, both compression straps & then the very top buckle to the lid goes through the wrist straps. Secure enough.

Any other Canadians with this pack though? SnowBigDeal wants $20 to ship the refill kit.... maybe do a group order?

SnowBigDeal has the cylinders (empty) for $99 again.
http://www.snowbigdeal.com/avivest-airbag-canister.html

I just did a test pull on my blackjack after a few years of skiing without incident. I had to go back to my manual and look for my replacement o-ring set (which was lost). This led me to research where Blackjack owners stand today in terms of support for this product. I previously knew the Blackjack had been discontinued but did not know Wary was also out of the game. While I know it shouldn't affect something successfully designed in the past and still operational, it does feel a little bit off to be using a device which my life could depend on that is no longer supported. While nothing beats a dana designs (MR) pack - I think this whole experience might be an argument to go with a brand in the future that is more likely to be around and in the game.

I am ordering a new o-ring kit - and have the cylinder filled at scuba shop. How do other Blackjack owners feel about continuing to use the Blackjack years into the future knowing the system is no longer officially supported?

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Originally Posted by Driver

I am ordering a new o-ring kit - and have the cylinder filled at scuba shop. How do other Blackjack owners feel about continuing to use the Blackjack years into the future knowing the system is no longer officially supported?

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Whether or not it's "officially" supported has little bearing on my confidence in the system. The WARY system was supported and in use long enough to reveal any manufacturer defects or inherent flaws in the design. None have been identified (to my knowledge), and the design is simple and easy to test. If a failure occurs, or a meaningfully better option comes to market, I will upgrade.

Until somebody makes a pack or vest that fits big guys, the Blackjack will have to do.

I'm sticking with mine until I run out of o-rings. After that, I'll probably pull the airbag components, find a way to get a new top pocket made, and keep using it indefinitely.

I have confidence in the system, the pack is top drawer, and I ain't gonna drop dime on a new airbag at least until the fan packs have gone through a couple more iterations. Maybe never unless the price and/or weight comes down significantly.

I agree with covert, and I'll also note that MR provided customer support last year when we needed/wanted extra o-rings.

Bob, I stocked up on extra parts (another canister and O-ring kit) 2 years ago and it's been fine. Theoretically the Venturi valve could be adaptable to other inflation systems in the future if it ever becomes impossible to get more O-rings (which is really unlikely due to that being a standard part once you know the spec). At some point, the line/bladder/valving assembly should be retired anyways to stay within acceptable margins of safety.

By then I'd hope that MR has signed a licensing agreement with other inflation mechanism vendors such as Arc, BD, Snowpulse etc.

Exactly... running out of o-rings supplied by the pack maker should not be a reason to ditch the gear, as long as other components aren't worn beyond safe use. O-rings can be purchased from other sources.

I see no reason to ever stop using a Blackjack if you like it, it's not as if the airbag system will wear out. O-rings are o-rings.

That said, I don't like the way the bag is folded per the manual. I pack mine accordian style to eliminate internal friction, not folded end-to-end.

I know an operation that may be selling some of their Blackjacks in the next year. If anyone replies with interest I'll follow up.

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Originally Posted by Summit

I know an operation that may be selling some of their Blackjacks in the next year. If anyone replies with interest I'll follow up.

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Interested. Missed out on a killer deal on one here due to being busy over the holidays.

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Originally Posted by 1000-oaks

That said, I don't like the way the bag is folded per the manual. I pack mine accordian style to eliminate internal friction, not folded end-to-end.

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Interesting ... I'm personally less willing to deviate from the manufacturer's spec on that kind of thing. But I am curious what the WARY design criteria was for total number of duty cycles. I'm hopeful that, specifically with respect to folding, there was some rigorous analysis conducted that balanced reliable breaking of zipper force with huge margins of safety against fabric wear and loading stress during inflation. But maybe they found that fold to work okay during field testing and just stuck with it. In my experience these kind of details come down to the combined anal-retentiveness of both the product manager and the engineering manager ...

But yeah, I'm hesitant to deviate from the original spec without significant analysis.

Anybody know the o-ring spec? Should be able to order from Parker O-ring catalog, right?

Also: anybody know if the o-rings are the same as the Wary AviVest/AviPack?

I found the Wary O ring kit available at SnowBigDeal.com. I believe they are selling through remaining Wary stock. But good idea for the future.

It came with quite a few rings so even if I pull it to test once a year, this should last until hopefully we have a retrofit solution from MR as Scralph suggested.

Absolutely Love the pack, hope to keep using for a long time

Driver I used to test every 2-3 weeks due to ski travel to SLC, Jackson, etc. Your kit comes with like 10 rings, I wouldn't sweat it.

I now have an empty canister for travel and a full canister for home use, so I don't test quite as often anymore.

The only really funny thing I have to say about the pack is how obnoxiously big it looks on me ... I'm such a small guy, and with this thing loaded up with avy gear, SWAG kit, 30m rope + harness, extra layers, first aid kit, skins food water etc ... the thing is bigger than my entire torso :)

HALP! Tested my blackjack today and now I cant remove the red threaded connector from the canister - just spins and spins. I remember this being a problem in the past but don't remember how I solved it. Any ideas?

Doesnt that thing have a tiny set screw on the thumbwheel? Mine is packed up downstairs so I can’t verify anything yet.

Not clear on what piece of the rig has a thumbwheel. Mine has a gauge, pull pin for the hose that goes to the bag, and a threaded connector that goes to the trigger handle.

Anyways I managed to solve my problem by pulling the trigger to max travel while unthreading the red anodized barrel connector.

Whos still using these packs? I love mine. Rarely use with the canister tho.

I still have mine! I bought an extra cylinder and O rings from that snomo shop in Utah that got all of WARI’s inventory about 10 years ago. Also bought that Crossman hand pump for air guns. But, also have two young kids and rarely tour midwinter anymore, sigh.

I still have mine as well but have moved on to a fan pack. Would love to buy the nonairbag lid if anyone has one lying around.

Still have mine too, and still use it. For most/all of my in-US touring. I fly with my old beloved Osprey ski pack.

I haven't checked the air pressure in the canister yet this year though -- it may have finally made its way into the "insufficient" zone.

Rudy, I'm curious what fan pack you're using? I've been on the lookout, though not too aggressively, and haven't seen a lot of options that have anywhere near the volume of the Blackjack.

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Originally Posted by Ignatius

Still have mine too, and still use it. For most/all of my in-US touring. I fly with my old beloved Osprey ski pack.

I haven't checked the air pressure in the canister yet this year though -- it may have finally made its way into the "insufficient" zone.

Rudy, I'm curious what fan pack you're using? I've been on the lookout, though not too aggressively, and haven't seen a lot of options that have anywhere near the volume of the Blackjack.

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I'm using a Black Diamond Saga 40 which they no longer make any longer but volume is similiar if not slightly larger than the Blackjack.

Thanks. That tracks with my not-at-all-thorough market research...