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Racing does give you, in my opinion, the best fundamentals for skiing, period. I can't go past a course without feeling nostalgic and wanting to bash gates. I'm actually hoping to run some gates next year, gotta look into whether or not there's a casual race thing at whis. I haven't skied a real course in 7 years now, goddamn...
All the best with racing man, enjoy!
Barring some serious promotion for Loveland/bashing of Copper's program, it's gonna be Copper for training. Thanks a million to Indy for the suggestion. You'll have saved me a LOOOOT of money, I do believe (and if it's of the caliber that you say--which I don't doubt--it will also be without sacrifice!). Thanks, man.
Bring it on!!!!! (Think I'll have the P40's at the mini just to go fast and get pumped for next season, AND to avoid breaking my neck jumping off something. Unless it's blower [/anti-jinx])
According to a ski coach I cliniced with, it takes 10000 repitions to develop muscle memory...so race, train,race,train.....
I have 0 regrets from racing other than I didn't take it as serious for a few years as I would have liked. 90% of the good to great skiers i ski with now have raced in the past. It is probably one of the best ways to really understand what you are doing with your body/angles/skis, etc.
$.02:
The argument's for racing sound exactly like the arguments tele-nerds trot out for leaning on low-cut soft leather boots.
IMO it is total BS. Sure it'll make you a better skier but it isn't the best path for everyone to reach their specific goals. If you want to be a racer then get into racing. If you want to be a freeskier then work on that.
Other observations:
1. 10 years of race training won't do for your skiing what just ONE spring semester spent living in the mountains will (DO IT). Take summer classes to partially make up for the lost credit hours (summer at CU is totally chill) and then you don't have to move back to LA for the summer either. Sure you might have to sell your folks hard but it doesn't have to put you behind schedule at all (LB = 1 spring off + 1BS + 1MS = 5yrs)
2. Competitive bump skiing = better for your freeskiing than gate racing
I have to disagree with both of your points. Having a coach critique your technique is the fastest way to get better. As with every sport, a coach is the fastest way to improve.Quote:
Originally Posted by lemon boy
Bump skiers...are really good at skiing bumps. The "turn" you make in bump skiing does not transfer well to terrain outside of a mogul field. That's not to say that bump skiers aren't good skiers outside of the moguls, however their bump skills don't transfer well to maching down steep shit. But look at the guys charging in the movies-their technique is pretty much the same as a racer.
Hey Max, doesn't CU have a club racing team associated with their A and B teams? I would recommend that route, since the Masters at Copper is going to be the Epic Ski crowd. You might have more fun with the CU folk, and the skiers will be much better.
Sorry, Lemon Boy - you wrong. Even at my advanced and decrepit age, working with race coaches this year has done more for my skiing than years of freeskiing ever did. Including making me a better freeskier.
I'm not wrong I just have a different opinion :)
Regardless, you both have focused on my dicta observations not my central point, which is:
At this stage getting into racing is attempting to learn some applicable skills by heading not in the direction of his goal but somewhere else only somewhat related. There are plenty of avenues for instruction in the arena that Max actually wants. So many in fact that for him to take up masters racing is learning how to tele in leather boots: yeah, you do end up with bomber technique but it takes forever and is heading in a direction other than your goals. Yes, folks who grew up racing have great foundations and I'm a better skier for having learned on leather boots. Unlike the racers who're blinded by their own BS, I don't tell people to learn on floppy leather boots. Max can get good fundamentals w/o racing much faster, just like people now learn to tele way faster than on leathers.Quote:
Sure it'll make you a better skier but it isn't the best path for everyone to reach their specific goals. If you want to be a racer then get into racing. If you want to be a freeskier then work on that.
your different opinion is wrong :biggrin:
and the real bomb is to train both. Show me the skier who can do reasonably well in 4 alpine events and moguls and I'll show you a freeskier. period.
The cool thing about where I grew up was that the citizen's DH and the pro/am mogul comp were on the same day...DH on spring ice in the morning and bumps on spring corn in the afternoon.
Dudes, what you are missing is that I want to do it ALL. There is no reason why I can't spend a shitload of time freeskiing in 07-08 (when it will probably actually be worth it because I'll have much bigger balls then, I hope). I BADLY wanted (and still want) to do a bump clinic (note to self... talk to MBSchick) to get better in that respect, and now I'm really excited about racing because I think that will give me a different set of skills that will be much better developed when I am through with this stuff. Hell, if I hadn't broken my neck, I'd probably try to get to a summer camp to work on spins and shit on tabletops. (Fuck the park). And I'll STILL probably spend some early-season days sessioning boxes all day. I want to develop my skiing from ALL sides, and I think race training IN ADDITION TO freeskiing and other kinds of training can be only beneficial.
I just don't see how race training could hurt... I would say it would only help in my opinion. And you're not gonna win me over with the "it'll be a waste of money" because $200-400 spent with a coach couldn't possibly be that. And I'm a bit frivilous anyway. :D
About the CU team: seems more cost efficient to do the Masters stuff (if I'm eligible). Besides, I can't make all the sessions for CU training. I saw their schedule, and it doesn't fit mine for the fall. Copper's training starts around Nov. 19, which is a good month before the end of semester. Plus it costs probably $500 more...
Heh. Told my mom I was doing some race training next year and she GASPED. "Huuuuuuuuuh!!!!!" "Is that less dangerous than the park, Maxi?!" Think that woman will be scared sick every time I click in from now on. (And it's cuz she loves me, I know. Bless her.)
Racing helped me work on my stance and notch up the speed, but it didn't improve my freeskiing -- putting a shitload of time @ Alta is what brought my game up.
Eh, you'll get something out of it, but $1500 worth? I doubt it.
Jay Peak?Quote:
Originally Posted by YetiMan
My thoughts. But it looks like it's gonna end up costing more like $600 or $700 than $1500 (if I can train at Copper). I'm stoked for next season either way. The more I think about it, the less I care... I just want to SKI!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by 13
Might be nice to get back home away from mountains constantly taunting me.
What money I spend is up to me. Period.
Dude I suck at mogulsQuote:
Originally Posted by YetiMan
Aside from giving you strong skiing fundementals I'm not seeing how wearing skinsuits and training to go fast on icey harpack with stiff gear is gonna make you a good bc skier.
Bc skiing is about snowpack/conditions asessment, avvy safety, terrain management, skinning tecnique, beacon drills ,etc
Oh yeah and finding a shredin the pow.
You know The POWDER.
I heard of one guy that didn't make level one because he simply refused to bend his knees.Quote:
Originally Posted by INDY GS
I'll be looking for GS skis around that time.Quote:
Originally Posted by nick > jesus
Keystone has Wednesday night leagues made up of four man teams. When the time comes next season, I'll post more info about it. It's a GS course, but with a little of the edge taken off the pitch - that's what I hear anyway. I'm gonna race with other instructors and hopefully beat lift ops. :D
As for why I want to race, I think it'll be a ton of fun...
Chimps, zey have zee bendy knees, no.Quote:
Originally Posted by SheRa
Let me rephrase the first post. Any chimp who can listen can pass a level 1.
Yeah, it was more of a clinic than anything else when I did it this year. I did get scored on a lot of teaching techniques and on my freeskiing on groomers and a very easy bump run. I went to ski powder instead of training and did fine. Here's what my examiner had to say in his comments:Quote:
Originally Posted by INDY GS
Thanks for making good changes! Continue to develop a feel for releasing the edge of your downhill ski with tipping rather than twisting, especially at the low speed maneuvers. Great job moving downhill.
He really taught me something about turn initiation. I could tell that he really liked my overall stance and the way I stayed in the fall line, especially on the bump run. But he didn't even look at pole plants, which I ain't got. I scored almost perfect in my carved turns and my fall line sideslip and the bump run, but I didn't do well in the wedge turns. Honestly it is hard to do they way they want and I don't make a lot of wedge turns on my own time ;) but I can practice while I'm teaching...
They are putting the hammer down on level twos. I just had a bunch of friends go through it and it was tough, both the skiing and the teaching analysis, and plenty of people didn't make it. You can't succeed if you don't train and study. I'm gonna get after that next season.
Well in reference to the program, it's $350 for 10 sessions and $40 for each session after that (or $500 for 20 and then $175 for a pass).
I'm willing to drop that kind of coin... Only problem is being late after o-chem on wed/fri. And the best part is I can choose a morning OR afternoon session (or both) on both sunday AND saturday. So if I want to do BP DP and then go race in the afternoon when the pow is douched at copper, that's not a problem.
The way it stands now, if I can manage the "eat, sleep (some), ski, study, class" routine, I'm looking at 6 days a week on snow. Tuesday and Thursday morning, Wednesday and Friday afternoon, and all day Saturday and Sunday. [anti-jinx]
I'm excited. I think it will be a lot of fun, and I hope to learn a lot. The program that is. And freeskiing! :D
But I'm wondering if I'll ever learn how to rail in the snow going slow... i always tend to fall over doing that. Maybe racing (going fast) will teach me how to crawl too. ;)
(Going slow is for traverses. Only reason to learn to do it right is to avoid falling over and looking like a moron/slowing down a group.)
As with most things, I agree with LB.
This is a colossal waste of time and money. Just go skiing for fucks sake.
Absofucking lootly. And get a snowboard cause this shits about the pow pow and the pow pow is about a fat ride, Fuck everything else, cept 2 day old crust softening at noon, cause thats money.Quote:
Originally Posted by homerjay