White Rim Advice

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Originally Posted by Danno

Looks like they changed the permit system for this upcoming year. Anyone got the lowdown on the new system?

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Originally Posted by Danno

So I did some researching. Looks like they will be releasing in 3 month blocks, all at the same time/date, 8am MT. The previous system was annoying AF because you had to stay up till midnight on 3 consecutive nights (if you needed 3 nights of camping) but if you did that, it was pretty easy to get reservations. This seems like it will be easy to get locked out of anything.

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So, all the Fall dates were just released this morning. Was trying to get a permit for middle of October, 3 nights. Within seconds everything was gone, I am not even sure how one could have clicked three separate spots in the amount of time they all disappeared. The new system sucks and may mean I won't do another White Rim multi-day trip. It sucked having to stay up till midnight 3 nights running, but at least it meant you could actually, you know, get a trip.

Edit: So one glitch in the system that would have been great to know, is when you click on an available date, the system assumes that is your first night, and everything before that night disappears. So I made the mistake of clicking on the last night of my (hoped for) trip; I was trying to work backwards because of itinerary issues. Then it seemed like everything was taken. When I unclicked that choice (too late, unfortunately) some other dates showed up. So my doom and gloom post may not be entirely correct. I tried to get as much info as possible about the new system, but nobody told me this piece.

We practiced with the system a bit in preparation for this morning. Fortunately, we were successful in booking a trip. But it was over quickly. All the spots were gone in a few short seconds.
It was better than staying up till midnight three nights in a row with the old system.

One thing we did observe last year, is campsites opened back up a couple of weeks later. That may happen again this year. I don't know if it is commercial operators giving back unfilled trips or people who overbooked to get the campsite they wanted.

We have seen in past years campsites sitting empty even though everything is booked. Either way we are grateful to get to go again this year. Our cycling season feels incomplete without several annual rides, particularly the White Rim.

jummo

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Originally Posted by jummo

We practiced with the system a bit in preparation for this morning. Fortunately, we were successful in booking a trip. But it was over quickly. All the spots were gone in a few short seconds.
It was better than staying up till midnight three nights in a row with the old system.

One thing we did observe last year, is campsites opened back up a couple of weeks later. That may happen again this year. I don't know if it is commercial operators giving back unfilled trips or people who overbooked to get the campsite they wanted.

We have seen in past years campsites sitting empty even though everything is booked. Either way we are grateful to get to go again this year. Our cycling season feels incomplete without several annual rides, particularly the White Rim.

jummo

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I practiced too, as best I could, but I guess in my practice I didn't see that picking a night makes all the nights before it disappear.

Personally, I was able to get what I wanted more or less in the old system, so IMO the new system sucks balls. But I guess it's all perspective.

I will check back in to see if things open up.

I just tried for around Nov 1. There is pretty much nothing between Potato Bottom and Schafer. I am new to this reservation crap. Missed out on the San Juan earlier. I guess the way to go is get in shape ride it in a day. Never would of thought that there would be that many people wanting to float the san juan in March or ride the White Rim in November.

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Originally Posted by Danno

I practiced too, as best I could, but I guess in my practice I didn't see that picking a night makes all the nights before it disappear.

Personally, I was able to get what I wanted more or less in the old system, so IMO the new system sucks balls. But I guess it's all perspective.

I will check back in to see if things open up.

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I'm curious if the easy answer is hiring a tour guide who has dates reserved but no customers yet for dates you want. Bonus is no one has to drive and maybe they cook for you?

Anyone look into prices doing this?

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Originally Posted by muted reborn

I'm curious if the easy answer is hiring a tour guide who has dates reserved but no customers yet for dates you want. Bonus is no one has to drive and maybe they cook for you?

Anyone look into prices doing this?

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$975/pp with Western Spirit. Rim Tours is similar.

Oooofff, that's not an option at all.

I'm wondering if all the Overlanders are now taking up a ton of spots bikers normally would use up.

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Originally Posted by bagtagley

$975/pp with Western Spirit. Rim Tours is similar.

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That's about 10 times the cost of a self-supported trip.

And call me weird, but I like the driving. I mean, I like the biking too but I have driven Murphy and Hardscrabble every time I have done the trip (because not many people like the 4 wheeling parts and I would prefer to drive my truck through those sections anyway). Sure, it would be great to have someone do all the cooking and cleaning, but not hundreds and hundreds of dollars great.

Sounds like the reservation system has gone the way of most places now. We've been going to Yosemite every year almost my whole life and it is now almost impossible to get a campsite. Same goes for wilderness permits for popular trailheads in the sierra. Pretty sure there are bots that swoop them up for companies to turn around and sell them later. It's a hot mess.

bummer too, cause as I was reading through this thread I was thinking it would be cool to get a group together and found myself hoping the reservation system wasn't like most others these days. Oh well, I'll just try to get back to ride in Moab in general.

I'm amazed the White Crack campsite is booked every single day now through December. That must be a sweet campsite.

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Originally Posted by muted reborn

I'm amazed the White Crack campsite is booked every single day now through December. That must be a sweet campsite.

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It is

Anyone get a permit for the Fall?

I got one, but not what I was looking for, tried to get 3 nights but could only get 2. The system is annoying AF because it will show the available sites, you click on them and get a whole 3 night itinerary, but when you click "book now" you get an error message that some of your sites aren't available, then you have to backtrack, refresh the page and start over from scratch, see some different sites, click on them and get a 3 night itinerary, click book now, and have the same thing happen. Lather, rinse, repeat. On my fourth attempt all that was available was a 2 night itinerary, and that one went through.

Yup. We wanted and got 2 nights. I don't think I've ever done it in three nights.

I prefer the booze cruise method. And the distance between our 2 campsites is 50 miles, which is way more than I would enjoy biking. But will just do a different kind of trip, probably a much smaller group, and probably more of a "bike as much as you feel like, but biking not required trip" (ie have enough space in the cars for everyone if nobody wants to bike). So instead of 3 cars and 15 people, more like 3 cars and 6 people.

The last two years, we have been on our way back to Colorado from Mammoth on White Rim Lottery morning.
We stayed in the same hotel as last year and used the same strategy. Two devices, same itinerary, staggered a day apart.
We were really fortunate to get the trip we were after. It is ridiculous how quickly it is all gone. Each year we go into this fully prepared that we may have to spend our wedding anniversary somewhere else.
In the mid 80's you could just show up at the Ranger Station and pick your camp sites from the available spots on the grease board and head out.
Hopefully, some dates will open back up in the next few weeks for people who missed out today.

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Originally Posted by Danno

I prefer the booze cruise method. And the distance between our 2 campsites is 50 miles, which is way more than I would enjoy biking. But will just do a different kind of trip, probably a much smaller group, and probably more of a "bike as much as you feel like, but biking not required trip" (ie have enough space in the cars for everyone if nobody wants to bike). So instead of 3 cars and 15 people, more like 3 cars and 6 people.

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which two campsites did you score? Some stretches of the WR are riding pretty easy right now so 50 might not be too bad .. car/people ratio sounds perfect.

Hardscrabble and Airport. So the day would include the Hardscrabble and Murphy climbs (though I will be driving my truck for those).

ouch, no that's not much of a pedestrian booze cruise day.
that long steady pitch murphy-hardscrabble has more sand than usual, but conditions will change before fall.

Just found out that this is happening during my trip: https://stateparks.utah.gov/activiti...tober-14-2023/

That should be cool AF.

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Originally Posted by Danno

Just found out that this is happening during my trip: https://stateparks.utah.gov/activiti...tober-14-2023/

That should be cool AF.

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That'll be about as good of a spot as any to see it. Got room lol.

Heading out to do it again next week. Question - has anyone done it with a hitch mount bike rack? I’ve always put the bikes up top, but we have a smaller vehicle and 8 people, so I’d like to use the top for other overflow.

Not sure how a hitch mount rack would fair. We’ve got a Kuat so it’s solid, but worried a bit about bikes shaking around and clearance. Thoughts?

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Originally Posted by EWG

Heading out to do it again next week. Question - has anyone done it with a hitch mount bike rack? I’ve always put the bikes up top, but we have a smaller vehicle and 8 people, so I’d like to use the top for other overflow.

Not sure how a hitch mount rack would fair. We’ve got a Kuat so it’s solid, but worried a bit about bikes shaking around and clearance. Thoughts?

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I brought my North Shore Rack on the White Rim. No issues, but I never had more than one bike hanging on it during the trail though.

We’ve taken our Rocky Mounts Split Rail on two trips. I think both times it was on a Tacoma. It was fine and only took one or two hits


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I've done it 3 times with my 1up, and will be doing it a 4th time in 3 weeks. No issues.

Just returned from the White Rim. Road is in best shape in years, maybe ever.
Saw more bighorns than ever and pedaled into the wind most of the time.
Always a highlight of our mtb season.