College costs

I obviously grew up in a bubble (Montana) - but I'd bet that less than 50% of high school class (1983) went to college. Of those, maybe 20% have parents pay. I'm sure that the numbers in bigger cities would indicate a higher % of their class went to college, and a high % had help with college.

But, I'm still stunned at the number of parent now days that think they must pay for the kids college education. Yes, I run with a more educated and higher wage earner group than my parents, but most of these people are living on the edge as it is.

Add that the kids I knew in college that had parents paying didn't take it seriously and I have a real aversion to paying up front for an 18yr old to make a solid decision on a potential $100k decision.

What is driving your (everyone not just OP) decision to foot the bill for the kids? I'm genuinely curious.

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Originally Posted by Iowagriz

What is driving your (everyone not just OP) decision to foot the bill for the kids? I'm genuinely curious.

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A couple of principles. #1 that college is a gateway to finding something cool, to be interested in. #2 is that debt is super bad news for a couple of reasons, mostly being that I don't want to give those financial motherfuckers one cent if I can avoid it.


More so, I think it's completely ridiculous to have any kid, let alone mine, walk out into their world of responsibility with the yoke of hundreds of thousands of dollar debt around their neck.

So yeah, I've got one 2 years out and we'll foot the bill to the tune of 70-80k/year. I really can't think of a better investment. I've got another 4 years out who may choose a different path.

I agree Buster, but I’d also add that grad school is the ultimate goal.

I laugh at all the people around me dropping 20k a yr on catholic high schools, maybe because I went that route, but I’d rather my kid go public HS, community college, finish in state, and then spend it on Harvard med school.

Everyone gets all worked up on where they go their freshman yr., but there are smarter paths.


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My cousin went to a SUNY. Undergrad and grad school just under 60k. Accounting. She's now working at PWC. Not a bad deal for roughly 6 years of quality education.

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Originally Posted by Iowagriz

What is driving your (everyone not just OP) decision to foot the bill for the kids? I'm genuinely curious.

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The ability to do so, and a conviction that education is the most important thing that you can buy, the best thing you can spend money on.

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Originally Posted by Iowagriz

I obviously grew up in a bubble (Montana) - but I'd bet that less than 50% of high school class (1983) went to college. Of those, maybe 20% have parents pay. I'm sure that the numbers in bigger cities would indicate a higher % of their class went to college, and a high % had help with college.

But, I'm still stunned at the number of parent now days that think they must pay for the kids college education. Yes, I run with a more educated and higher wage earner group than my parents, but most of these people are living on the edge as it is.

Add that the kids I knew in college that had parents paying didn't take it seriously and I have a real aversion to paying up front for an 18yr old to make a solid decision on a potential $100k decision.

What is driving your (everyone not just OP) decision to foot the bill for the kids? I'm genuinely curious.

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I can't speak for anyone else, but education as a means of getting ahead has been a core values of my family since we came to this country. So I figure I need to keep that going for another generation, to the extent I can.

Another issue is that I don't want my kids' college and early career choices to be limited by debt or cash flow concerns. If they want to take a Fulbright, take a risk on a challenging or lengthy grad school program, or work for a startup, I don't want them to say no to that kind of opportunity in order to work for Sallie Mae. Supporting yourself and going to undergrad full time is a tougher row to hoe than it was back in the '80s, so we will step in to make sure they get out of undergrad debt-free, even if that means living at home and commuting for a few years. That doesn't mean that we are saving $200k per kid for a degree in underwater basket weaving from Pepperdine.

Yeah, I don't know why a parent wouldn't if resources are available.

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Originally Posted by Mazderati

Yeah, I don't know why a parent wouldn't if resources are available.

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I agree with much of the other responses to my question, but this is probably the root of why I am helping.

My wife had her education paid for (and didn't get the degree), I had 0 help. Thus, even though we both value education, we had plenty of discussion before telling the kids of what we would pay for. This was the plan since they were about 5yrs old.

Fast forward to us being better off financially and we will eventually pay the equivalent of 100% of in state schooling. They don't know that yet, but it will be the surprise and graduation gift upon completion. Until then, I want them to have some skin in the game.

While I do value education and believe that without it life will be harder, the true way to get ahead in life is luck, hard work and hustle. No debt after graduation will definitely help them going forward.

What’s motivating us is the yoke of debt. Missus D and I came out roughly 500k in debt. We’re lucky that we can pay it off but it is a REAL amount w real monthly payments.

If my kids can embark on a career without the debt they will have a huge leg up on success and much less stress.

That said. There will be a certain performance/grade needed to continue funding. No D’s in basket weaving.


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Originally Posted by flowing alpy

how does this help op with the question?

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well its the "zero cost let them figure it out on their own" method,

the concept being if you tell them they better hustle ... they will hustle

if you tell them you are gona pay for everything ... you will hustle

But if you been helicoptering around kids for 18 yars when are they gona learn to hustle ?

So at age 27 & 28 both kids were making the same $$$$$ one with an engineering degree and one with a high end specialty trade so that answers the money question

the older kid is probably smarter than the younger kid but didn't have the same focus or want to go to uni, so that asks & answers the question ... why do they have to go to uni any how?


and besides everybody here is projecting their own thots and experiences, they don't actually give a fuck about the OP

It’s hard for me to remember how much the total was because there were so many student loans. Just finished paying off the last one which was $40K. I’d guess my total was around $80K. My daughter was on an athletic scholarship which paid 50% of her tuition for the first two years, so that helped some, and my wife conned her into taking out some of the loans in her own name. I think she still owes about $20K. So maybe $100K total. This was at SDSU. A lot of that was for living expenses.

Sure was a lot more than when I went to school!

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Originally Posted by Buster Highmen

#1 that college is a gateway to finding something cool, to be interested in.

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Man, that is one expensive way for them to find something cool to be interested in! If you got the funds to let them do that then more power to ya, but personally I'd almost rather my kids take a couple years off between high school and college to "find themselves." Whether that be from doing volunteer work abroad, the military, maybe peace corp, or just hustling and struggling for a bit in the working world, it's up to them. I would not be opposed to them getting some world travel in for far less money than even a semester at community college. Haha. Would love for them to go see some of the 3rd world places I've been to, and hopefully do some positive things out there. Then hopefully after some time doing whatever they did, they'll have a better understanding of who they are, or who they'd like to be, and what they'd like to do. I'll be every bit as proud of them whether they choose to be a skilled blue collar worker, an engineer, or a doctor. I just want them to be happy with what they do, and be the best they can be at whatever that may be.

We agreed with Mrs C's ex (we were all on the same page, years prior to the kids going to college) that we would pay for the kids' undergrad, shared equally between the households. Beyond that, further degrees etc would be their responsibility. As noted above, Mrs C's ex decided to cut off a big chunk of his funding of the kids while in college, because he's a liar and asshole. We've explained to the kids that we are supporting their half, as promised, and those funds are already set aside in 529 accounts.

Reasoning for supporting the kids through undergrad for me was that my parents paid for my undergrad and I funded post grad via loans. For Mrs C it was that she got some family $ help for undergrad but it was difficult making ends meet, and post grad even more so. We also have the ability to pay without it being a large burden on us, so that's certainly a factor.

My view on post grad degrees is that those are ones that should lead to professions (medicine, law, research, whatever), and students entering those schools should have a solid understanding of what it's going to cost and what benefit they are going to receive as a result. Unfocused pursuit of doctoral degrees or in unemployable fields is simply the student's problem. No sympathy here for those.

Both our kids seem to have understood well that they have to support themselves after undergrad, both are working part time in college. One saves well, the other spends a lot but seems to be improving on that.

Every time one of my kids is in danger of getting any grade below an A, I say good, the worse your grades, the less likely it is you'll get into an expensive school. They act disgusted and dig in harder. Actually they are great students, fully self-motivated. I feel really lucky about that.

But do colleges even give out pure academic scholarships anymore? Seems like with grade inflation 4.0's are a dime a dozen coming out of high school these days. You probably have to join ten clubs and be editor of the yearbook and cure cancer and then maybe they give you some money.

The Ivies can be a sweet deal for a middle-class family. Tell the kids to study harder.

Hell Harvard was right on the verge of eliminating tuition altogether right before the last big market downturn but they backed off at the last minute.

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Originally Posted by iceman

The Ivies can be a sweet deal for a middle-class family. Tell the kids to study harder.

Hell Harvard was right on the verge of eliminating tuition altogether right before the last big market downturn but they backed off at the last minute.

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Yep. If you can get into one of the top 25 or so schools that have need-blind admissions and no-loan financial aid, you get a big discount off MSRP unless mom and dad are loaded.

My kid was Ivy. Makes shy of $200k wearing Carharts and thinks he knows more about the world than god. I recall you doing a cost v $benefit analysis on your kids Ice. Would you pay for a degree in Ancient Religions or basket weaving if that's what the kids wane? OTOH, you have girls so an Ivy husbands is a smart move financially.

apparently tuition in Quebec is very cheap but you gotta probably be Canadian, establish a 6month quebec residence, probably speak french and your body has to handle all that poutine

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Originally Posted by XXX-er

well its the "zero cost let them figure it out on their own" method,

the concept being if you tell them they better hustle ... they will hustle.


and besides everybody here is projecting their own thots and experiences, they don't actually give a fuck about the OP

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i give you gredit for owning the fail right off the bat
and once again youre wrong i know the op and while i havent yet skied or floated a river with his kids
id be super stoked too and wish them the best and that they acquire life skills to lead happy productive lives
reguardless if dads gotta thin his carbon fibered quiver or miss somes japows:wink:
much like im super stoked the icecrotchfruits were afforded the ops to attain quality edjumacations and appear to be using it well
or any others of my friends who post here

I didn't spend any money on basket weaving degrees or any money at all actualy ... so thats not a fail

and both kids are financially well off, learned how to hustle ... so thats not a fail

I'm still pretty sure everybody who wastes time here is just projecting their own thots

if you know and love the OP ... thats beautiful man!

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Originally Posted by Iowagriz

I agree with much of the other responses to my question, but this is probably the root of why I am helping.

My wife had her education paid for (and didn't get the degree), I had 0 help. Thus, even though we both value education, we had plenty of discussion before telling the kids of what we would pay for. This was the plan since they were about 5yrs old.

Fast forward to us being better off financially and we will eventually pay the equivalent of 100% of in state schooling. They don't know that yet, but it will be the surprise and graduation gift upon completion. Until then, I want them to have some skin in the game.

While I do value education and believe that without it life will be harder, the true way to get ahead in life is luck, hard work and hustle. No debt after graduation will definitely help them going forward.

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Best response I have seen yet. IME, the kids with their own money on the line take things a lot more seriously than those who have mom and dad footing the bill.

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Originally Posted by XXX-er

I didn't spend any money on basket weaving degrees or any money at all actualy ... so thats not a fail

and both kids are financially well off, learned how to hustle ... so thats not a fail

I'm still pretty sure everybody who wastes time here is just projecting their own thots

if you know and love the OP ... thats beautiful man!

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I'm pretty sure sfb has even volunteered his time at detrusor's kids' elementary school.

FWIW, I know both of those characters and think we are overdue for some fishing.

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Originally Posted by farmer

Best response I have seen yet. IME, the kids with their own money on the line take things a lot more seriously than those who have mom and dad footing the bill.

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That ^^ IME wanking about in the great outdoors I have met a number of usually much younger skiing/paddling/ biking silver spoon in mouth helicoptered kids who have wasted the money a proffesional type parent finding themselves or traveling or switching degrees or doing a 4 yr program in 6 yrs,

OTOH them parents gots too much money and so its only money man !

but OTOH what are you teaching them, i have seen a number of the little darlings get fucked up in the head and have no concept of money or taking care of business ?


I never discussed education with my parents until at 17 my mom said "we think you should become an electrician" which always reminded me of Jimmie Walker on all in the family telling Archie he was gona become an elect-tricin, partied my way into the lifetime IBM gig which seemed to satisfy their ideas of sucess and never actualy had to make a career start or decision

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Originally Posted by gravitylover

I have twins in college now. This first year that just ended was kind of rough, the first school they went to (Lyndon St in VT) they hated and only stayed one semester, total cost for two kids for one semester was $34k. This was out of state tuition, books, room and food. They transferred to a NY State school (community college with dorms) for second semester and it was ~$25k but the dining hall was closed on the weekends so no food from late afternoon Friday until breakfast Monday so we had to pick them up and take them back every weekend. That sucked! Now it looks like they're going to go to a CT State school that's close to home and they'll get in-state rates because we don't have a community college in our county so the school offers this to the local kids. It's still going to run ~$30k/yr per kid. This college thing is such a fuckin' ugly racket it makes me sick.

If anyone has any free lift tix I'm all ears otherwise I probably won't be skiing for another few years :(

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Well at least they got out before it became Northern Vermont University at Lyndon. Vermont's public higher education system is a mess. In an effort to reduce administrative costs, Lyndon State and Johnson State have merged to create the above mention NVU. Amd UVM is still one of the most expensive in state tuition schools to attend.

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Originally Posted by farmer

Best response I have seen yet. IME, the kids with their own money on the line take things a lot more seriously than those who have mom and dad footing the bill.

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So, given that even a state school is over 20k/year, you're in favor of kids going into debt to go to college?

The post you quoted also supported parents paying.