Count Me Out: The Obama Craze by Matt Gonzalez

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Originally Posted by spook

powerful stance on such a hotbed issue. nice research you did, too. you had to dig for that. funny how none of it sounds like change at all.

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/foreignpolicy/

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Wow, I think I got an acknowledgment from Spook!

Fact is Spook, despite the creepiness of your avitar, you make some solid arguments in many of your posts. I tend to agree with many of them, and many more at least make me think. I don't think Obama (or anyone else for that matter) is going to be able to change all that much. But given what the current system (flawed as it is, I freely admit) presents to us as choices for leadership, Obama is the only one who comes close to what I think this country needs, and who actually has a chance to get into a position of power.

I voted for Nadar in 2000 (don't get mad folks, I live in Idaho, the most "red" state in the nation. Bush won Idaho like, 85%-15%. I worte Nadar in as a portest, but it didn't make a difference either way). I'm probably voting for Obama this time because I think he may be able to inspire others to do things differently. McCain can't do that. Hillary will be too polarizing. I think Obama present a chance of bringing a different flavor to things. If nothing else, at least he has a grasp of the english language for christsake.

Keep the post coming man; the revolution is getting closer!

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Originally Posted by DharmaBum

Obama is the only one who comes close to what I think this country needs

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You think what our country needs right now is to spend hundreds of billions of dollars more on social issues and idealism??? I can not believe that out of all these political threads not one person has identified the real reason there needs to be such urgency for the next president and it is not Iraq or healthcare or social security or handouts for students or tax cuts, it is the EXACT OPPOSITE OF ALL OF THOSE THINGS, it is spending cuts. We are going bankrupt, all that other shit as big and as important as they are are a joke of an issue compared to our need to reel in spending. The wars, the healthcare, the social security, the tax cuts all need to be REDUCED not expanded yet every candidate is running on expanding one or all of those things. The only candidate that has a proven record for spending cuts and a platform for it is McCain NOT Obama.

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Originally Posted by AlpineJunkie

This is what you'd do? Damn dude you are either a really fucked up terrible father or you are going to be a real fucked up terrible father.

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hey, alpine, finding a picture of a baby dressed up like a suicide bomber is not turning a baby into a bomb to blow up women and children. i wouldn't doubt it's happened somewhere, but i haven't heard about it. the western press is shocked when a adult woman does it. i'm sure we'd hear if it were a baby. and judging from your posts, i wouldn't so quick to reproduce yourself, bub.

here's the wiki entry about that pic, as much as i hate wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_Suicide_Bomber

for what it's worth, this entry suggests that the youngest recorded suicide bomber was 16. there are far younger children involved in armed conflict around the world. where's your outrage?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_s...inian_conflict

how many kids in the u.s. grew up playing with g.i. joe? how many played cowboys and indians? how many had toy guns? war-based video-games?

perhaps your shock is a result of having been free from being slaughtered in your homeland. or perhaps it's a different issue with your frame of reference:

CDF Gun Report: 2,827 Child, Teen Deaths by Firearms in One Year Exceed Total U.S. Combat Fatalities During Three Years in Iraq

http://www.commondreams.org/news2006/0613-01.htm

NEW YORK - June 13 - The Children's Defense Fund (CDF) releases its report on gun violence against children, "Protect Children, Not Guns," at a time when major U.S. cities are calling for strategies to combat illegal firearms. Citing the most recent data from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, the report reveals that 2,827 children and teens died as a result of gun violence in 2003 -- more than the number of American fighting men and women killed in hostile action in Iraq from 2003 to April 2006.

"Just as gruesome as incoming casualties from a battlefield, the bodies of young gunshot victims stream into urban hospital trauma centers on the frontlines of an undeclared war on America's children," said Marian Wright Edelman, president of the Children's Defense Fund. The children that die every year from gunshot wounds come from all racial groups and are all ages. Some of the children killed by guns are too young to start kindergarten.

"The deaths of thousands of children each year is morally obscene for the world's most powerful nation, which has more resources to address its social ills than any other nation," said Edelman.

The "Protect Children, Not Guns" report comes as many U.S. mayors also are recognizing the toll that gun violence is taking on our country and are seeking solutions. At a recently convened mayoral summit that was cosponsored by New York City Mayor Michael R. Bloomberg and Boston Mayor Thomas M. Menino, 15 mayors from across the country called for national leadership in the war on gun violence. Since the summit in April, an additional 37 mayors have endorsed this urgent message and joined the Mayoral coalition.

"These calls for leadership are laudable," said Edelman, "On behalf of the tens of thousands of children and teens we have lost to senseless gun violence, CDF implores our leaders to seize this opportunity for taking a stand for common sense gun safety, which our country has tragically been lacking for far too long. The time for action is now before we lose thousands more children to senseless gun violence."

In addition to child and teen gun deaths exceeding the number of American military casualties in Iraq, here are some of the deadly facts detailed in the report about the toll gun violence is taking on America's children:

-- In 2003, 56 preschoolers were killed by firearms, compared to 52 law enforcement officers killed in the line of duty.

-- More 10- to 19-year-olds die from gunshot wounds than from any other cause except motor vehicle accidents.



http://images.jupiterimages.com/comm...3/22571377.jpg
http://www.samizdata.net/blog/~pdeh/...ld_gun_fun.jpg
http://www.jcfcc.vcn.com/kids_guns_small.jpg
http://3quarksdaily.blogs.com/3quark...machinegun.jpg
http://www.halloweenscene.com/mm5/gr...DUA%20Army.jpg
http://assets.spirithalloween.com/im...784.zoom.a.jpg
http://www.politicalmasks.com/fullsize/army16.jpg
http://www.nightmarefactory.com/UP296.jpg
http://www.phillyburbs.com/babycostumes/images/iraq.jpg
http://www1.istockphoto.com/file_thu...y_army_cap.jpg

You know what's really funny? You spend all this time preparing these long time consuming posts and you actually think anyone on these boards actually even reads them lol. Dumbass.

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Originally Posted by AlpineJunkie

You know what's really funny? You spend all this time preparing these long time consuming posts and you actually think anyone on these boards actually even reads them lol. Dumbass.

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i rarely spend more than 5 minutes on any of them, alpine. maybe i just read a lot more than you do. i think what you don't realize is that most of this is common knowledge. plus, i can google the shit out of anything. it's no skin off my nose. i enjoy looking for things. i also enjoy clarifying things to myself. i often actually learn something doing it. you're not the first of your type i've encountered. i'm sure i'll find more before it's over.

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Originally Posted by spook

i rarely spend more than 5 minutes on any of them, alpine. maybe i just read a lot more than you do. plus, i can google the shit out of anything. it's no skin off my nose. i enjoy looking for things. i also enjoy clarifying things to myself. i often actually learn something doing it. you're not the first of your type i've encountered. i'm sure i'll find more before it's over.

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So in other words what you are saying is that you are completely unoriginal and just copy and paste what others have to say uh? Well you might want to try other sources because you still sound like a moron.

I think I like this Alpine guy. Anybody who can ruffle the feathers of the peanut gallery is on the right track as far as I'm concerned.

edit: spook don't get all excited and think you're part of the peanut gallery now. It's funny how Jer's Narcissism link had you pegged on just about every symptom. Maybe Jer is trying to help you out??????????

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Originally Posted by AlpineJunkie

So in other words what you are saying is that you are completely unoriginal and just copy and paste what others have to say uh? Well you might want to try other sources because you still sound like a moron.

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why would i be concerned about being "original?"

i can see your propensity for making up shit in your head, but since i try to avoid that, why would i waste my time reinventing the wheel? there are plenty of experts who do the work for us. knowing which ones to give credence to takes time and trial and error, but that's a lot better than walking around with an uninformed answer, isn't it. it also helps never to be too sure.

What has been will be again, what has been done will be done again; there is nothing new under the sun. Is there anything of which one can say, "Look! This is something new"? It was here already, long ago; it was here before our time.

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Originally Posted by Crass3000

I think I like this Alpine guy. Anybody who can ruffle the feathers of the peanut gallery is on the right track as far as I'm concerned.

edit: spook don't get all excited and think you're part of the peanut gallery now. It's funny how Jer's Narcissism link had you pegged on just about every symptom. Maybe Jer is trying to help you out??????????

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i'm afraid alpine isn't sufficiently equipped to do too much ruffling. angry dullards are a dime a dozen. speaking of which, i thought YOU were the peanut gallery, crass.

i know jer means well, but i'm thinking his narcissism link has everybody pegged to one degree or another. i don't take it personally, but i appreciate the thought.

i,i,i,i,i,i,i,i......

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Originally Posted by spook

i'm afraid alpine isn't sufficiently equipped to do too much ruffling.

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Yes apparently I must be equiped with many links to the ever wise "experts". Appparently "experts" are the only ones qualified to think in Spooks mind. Perhaps when Spook aquires a greater education then that which can be attained in a hippie filled hut on the side of the ski slope then maybe one day Spook will start thinking for himself and stop preaching the word of his ministers.... I mean his "experts".

Spook +1

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Originally Posted by Rooster

Spook +1

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As you will see Spook the only advantage you can ever have with me is that everyone else is automatically against me no matter how stupid you sound. But don't think for a second that just because you have the masses of morons in this forum on your side that that is any great intellectual accomplishment. If anything I believe that is testament to how much of a moron you are yourself.

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Originally Posted by AlpineJunkie

driveldrivel

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weak

....

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Originally Posted by AlpineJunkie

You think what our country needs right now is to spend hundreds of billions of dollars more on social issues and idealism??? I can not believe that out of all these political threads not one person has identified the real reason there needs to be such urgency for the next president and it is not Iraq or healthcare or social security or handouts for students or tax cuts, it is the EXACT OPPOSITE OF ALL OF THOSE THINGS, it is spending cuts. We are going bankrupt, all that other shit as big and as important as they are are a joke of an issue compared to our need to reel in spending. The wars, the healthcare, the social security, the tax cuts all need to be REDUCED not expanded yet every candidate is running on expanding one or all of those things. The only candidate that has a proven record for spending cuts and a platform for it is McCain NOT Obama.

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Nobody can change the fact that the government is going to spend money. I just want them to spend it on things I like. And why the hell not handouts for students, or spending on the country's infrastructure? Beats the hell out of tax breaks for corporations that cut jobs here and move to India. Or subsidies for automakers who just can't seem to find the technology to produce a decent, low mpg engine. Or subsidies and tax breaks for oil companies to pay for their exploration endeavors (because hey, that $30billion is profit, and we sure wouldn't want to use our profit on expanded our business now would we?). Or obsolete military weaponry. Or building prisons instead of funding drug rehabilitation, and calling it a "war on drugs." Or printing more money for the banks because they were stupid enough to make $350,000 loans to burger flippers making $16,000 a year.

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Originally Posted by spook

if you're done being such an astonishingly simplistic nimrod, you might enjoy these stats.


Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (OCHA)
http://domino.un.org/UNISPAL.NSF/d9d...2!OpenDocument

http://www.ifamericansknew.org/

and, of course, these are just a shell of the actual suffering inflicted by the israelis on the palestinians. i wonder what you would do under similar circumstances. good thing for those vague interpretations of the second amendment, eh? give me liberty or give me death, eh?

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You're an idiot that types too much.

Palestinians attack, and Israel retaliates with superior firepower. That's why more Palestinians get killed. Moron.

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Originally Posted by AlpineJunkie

As you will see Spook the only advantage you can ever have with me is that everyone else is automatically against me no matter how stupid you sound. But don't think for a second that just because you have the masses of morons in this forum on your side that that is any great intellectual accomplishment. If anything I believe that is testament to how much of a moron you are yourself.

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If I didn't already have so much shit in my sig, this would be there too.

Really good shit AJ, rings of truth.

if hillary wins I'm voting for Nader.

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Originally Posted by ak_powder_monkey

if hillary wins I'm voting for Nader.

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it's not going down that way.

fuck.... if hillary wins I may have to go to the desert and think really hard for a few days about continuing to live in this country.

Spook, your leaving a few minor details out.

Try putting "Balfour, jordan, United Nations, 1947" in your google search before blaming yourself for everything. Hint hint

And when your done, I would appreciate you explaining to me why after the multiple attempts of neighboring arabs states attacking Israel and the UN partition plan, they themselves have treated the palestinians even worse than the israelis. After all Eygpt occupied much of thier territory and did even less for them. ANd while your at it, you could add that eygpt, jordan etc... recieves as much aide from us as israle does. But dont go into your usual distribe about why, just an awkknowledgement that were not trying to completely tip the balance of power over there would be fine.

And a little euro bashing would fit nicely as well, or maybe a little forsight into what the Ottomans would have done with the place of they had kept it. Thats always fun.

keep up your self serving, delusional work.

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Originally Posted by spook

i,i,i,i,i,i,i,i......

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This is probably the most telling part of any of your posts - the conscious effort of using lower case "i" when referring to yourself. It's like you're saying, "Hey - look everybody - i'm not really a complete delusional narcissist! In fact, i'm so self-effacing that i use a lower case "i"! Does everybody catch that?!"

And Alpine - spook doesn't live in a hut filled with hippies on the side of a ski hill. Or at least not on the side of a ski hill. He's posted in maybe 3 SR threads the whole time he's been here. Besides, pathalogical narcissists almost always live alone.

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Originally Posted by Cono Este

Spook, your leaving a few minor details out.

Try putting "Balfour, jordan, United Nations, 1947" in your google search before blaming yourself for everything. Hint hint

And when your done, I would appreciate you explaining to me why after the multiple attempts of neighboring arabs states attacking Israel and the UN partition plan, they themselves have treated the palestinians even worse than the israelis. After all Eygpt occupied much of thier territory and did even less for them. ANd while your at it, you could add that eygpt, jordan etc... recieves as much aide from us as israle does. But dont go into your usual distribe about why, just an awkknowledgement that were not trying to completely tip the balance of power over there would be fine.

And a little euro bashing would fit nicely as well, or maybe a little forsight into what the Ottomans would have done with the place of they had kept it. Thats always fun.

keep up your self serving, delusional work.

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These annoying facts do not fit the narrative, and will therefore be rejected out of hand.

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Originally Posted by Cono Este

Spook, your leaving a few minor details out.

Try putting "Balfour, jordan, United Nations, 1947" in your google search before blaming yourself for everything. Hint hint

And when your done, I would appreciate you explaining to me why after the multiple attempts of neighboring arabs states attacking Israel and the UN partition plan, they themselves have treated the palestinians even worse than the israelis. After all Eygpt occupied much of thier territory and did even less for them. ANd while your at it, you could add that eygpt, jordan etc... recieves as much aide from us as israle does. But dont go into your usual distribe about why, just an awkknowledgement that were not trying to completely tip the balance of power over there would be fine.

And a little euro bashing would fit nicely as well, or maybe a little forsight into what the Ottomans would have done with the place of they had kept it. Thats always fun.

keep up your self serving, delusional work.

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since we're talking about obama, and obama's stance on israel and u.s. policy with regard to israel and the palestinian territories in the context of the 2008 u.s. presidential election, i opted not to get into a discussion of balfour, eurobashing, or the rest of it (and, of course, obama has opted not to do so as well). i don't see that as unreasonable all things considered.

the u.s., its citizens and its press have shown little hesitation to place blame on others, so i leave the self-serving, delusional work to those well-practiced in the art.

of course, one could question the establishment of israel or why the u.s. plays all sides and why they have any business doing so, or who wields power in the u.n. and yes, i would suggest that the u.s. is trying to tip the balance of power--to suit it's purposes. that would be consistent with its intervention anywhere else in the world unless you actually accept the ideology of spreading democracy. i'm sure you aren't trying to equate u.s. policy toward egypt, jordan, etc. with u.s. policy on israel other than on terms of profit and influence.

the u.s. has never considered itself dependent on others to enforce its will, set an example or intervene in an impossible situation as long as it suits the purposes of those who control it's policy. the issue is u.s. responsibility for u.s. actions now, particularly in the context of empire, and, despite the complexities of the conflict, the current situation, which is overwhelmingly endorsed by the u.s. political class, is unacceptable.

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Originally Posted by Jer

This is probably the most telling part of any of your posts - the conscious effort of using lower case "i" when referring to yourself. It's like you're saying, "Hey - look everybody - i'm not really a complete delusional narcissist! In fact, i'm so self-effacing that i use a lower case "i"! Does everybody catch that?!"

And Alpine - spook doesn't live in a hut filled with hippies on the side of a ski hill. Or at least not on the side of a ski hill. He's posted in maybe 3 SR threads the whole time he's been here. Besides, pathalogical narcissists almost always live alone.

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you know, jer, you've said this before about the lower case "i" and i didn't say anything because it's so absurd.

have you not noticed that i don't use ANY CAPITALS? you do realize that the words at the beginning of sentences and proper nouns are also supposed to be capitalized don't you? the "i" is not unique. it is not a conscious effort. it is a LAZY effort. i hate to point it out now since that's what you're hanging your narcissist argument on, but i don't want you to continue looking like a complete idiot.

also, this pathological narcissist has been married for 9 years to a college professor from south america and does not live alone or with hippies.

and i've told you this before but, just like i don't go around trying to be original, if i don't have a contribution to make to a SR thread--say with a picture--because i'm not inclined to stop in the middle of the life-changing activity that i found only 2 years ago to take a picture of WHERE I'VE BEEN for posterity's sake so i can post it on a message board to say LOOK AT ME--or with a comment other than a question--because at this point in my sliding career i have more questions than answers (consider TGR my GoogleSliding)--i think that would go further to undermine your obsessive need to label me a pathological narcissist, wouldn't it.

perhaps you would find it more acceptable if i posted 9000 times, 8500 of which were detritus and 500 were somehow tangentially sliding-related rather than just lurking for the most part on SR-issues so that i can learn and making honest attempts at offering apparently divergent opinions on political issues that affect all of us.

if this site spoke only to sliding, you might have a reason to be upset about my "contributions." but since it doesn't, i don't see the justification for your problem other than you don't care for my tone or my perspective and you have some issues of your own.

in the harsh world of reality, i believe the correct response to that is "Tough Shit."

try another diagnosis. i know some that will fit, but you're painting with a very wide brush that clearly applies as much to many others in here as it does to me.

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Originally Posted by spook

you know, jer, you've said this before about the lower case "i" and i didn't say anything because it's so absurd.

have you not noticed that i don't use ANY CAPITALS? you do realize that the words at the beginning of sentences and proper nouns are also supposed to be capitalized don't you? the "i" is not unique. it is not a conscious effort. it is a LAZY effort. i hate to point it out now since that's what you're hanging your narcissist argument on, but i don't want you to continue looking like a complete idiot.

also, this pathological narcissist has been married for 9 years to a college professor from south america and does not live alone or with hippies.

and i've told you this before but, just like i don't go around trying to be original, if i don't have a contribution to make to a SR thread--say with a picture--because i'm not inclined to stop in the middle of the life-changing activity that i found only 2 years ago to take a picture of WHERE I'VE BEEN for posterity's sake so i can post it on a message board to say LOOK AT ME--or with a comment other than a question--because at this point in my sliding career i have more questions than answers (consider TGR my GoogleSliding)--i think that would go further to undermine your obsessive need to label me a pathological narcissist, wouldn't it.

perhaps you would find it more acceptable if i posted 9000 times, 8500 of which were detritus and 500 were somehow tangentially sliding-related rather than just lurking for the most part on SR-issues so that i can learn and making honest attempts at offering apparently divergent opinions on political issues that affect all of us.

if this site spoke only to sliding, you might have a reason to be upset about my "contributions." but since it doesn't, i don't see the justification for your problem other than you don't care for my tone or my perspective and you have some issues of your own.

in the harsh world of reality, i believe the correct response to that is "Tough Shit."

try another diagnosis. i know some that will fit, but you're painting with a very wide brush that clearly applies as much to many others in here as it does to me.

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Sorry, dude - I only made it through the middle of the second paragraph.

Nobody's interested in your long, wordy solilloquies. Sorry to be the one to break it to you.

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Originally Posted by Jer

Sorry, dude - I only made it through the middle of the second paragraph.

Nobody's interested in your long, wordy solilloquies. Sorry to be the one to break it to you.

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I keep telling him this but he seems to be so into his narcissism to care if anybody is even reading his diatribes.