If only there was something we could do...

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Originally Posted by leroy jenkins

it seems like the hundreds of millions of dead at the hands of authoritarian governments probably aren't winners.

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Let’s talk about why authoritarians gain and maintain power…. Can you provide some evidence that taking away guns is a part of that? And some other examples where people who managed to retain their guns used them to overthrow their government?

I suspect you have very little knowledge of how authoritarian regimes work and what it takes to overthrow them. Let me tell you, it ain’t a scrappy bunch of rebels. When they’re overthrown, it’s ‘cause the military changes sides and uses the state’s monopoly on violence against the autocrat. Or because the people rise up en masse and unarmed. No goddamn militia is going to overturn a government with any level of sophistication. Even in haiti, where the state is about as powerless as any state can be, coups involve the military or very large very well-organized criminal gangs.

So, yeah…. The idea that you and a bunch of Boy Scouts who go to the range on weekends is the last thing standing between us and tyranny makes you sound pretty infantile.


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Leroy, I’m curious if you could be honest for a moment answering the following. Your reference to 100s of millions dead via authoritarian governments, obviously as an argument for an armed public.

Do you honestly think that you and a bunch of dudes in walmart tactical gear are going to ward off the us military and all their planes, tanks, drones and other machinery when this very likely scenario of government genocide begins?

Or maybe you want to let that little chestnut go and stay focused on personal protection instead.


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Originally Posted by leroy jenkins

I guess you don't care about women's safety at all. Firearms are the great equalizer.

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Damn, Leroy. You’ve made an impress array of really stupid points in this thread. Do you think there are more women that saved themselves from violence by shooting their attacker, or women who were themselves victims of gun violence? I think even you’d admit that many more women are killed by guns than are saved by guns each year. I won’t bother sharing research of rates of gun violence against women by their intimate partners, but I will say confidently that it’s a fucking lot. A lot more than the maybe 10? cases a year of a woman holding the bad guys at bay with the handgun in her purse.

So how do women feel about gun safety? Maybe we should ask them how it should be handled rather than state that it’s good for their self defense? I’m pretty sure the vast majority will say they’d feel much safer in a world with fewer guns and where they do not have to be prepared to use a gun for their own defense. All the polling and research suggests that’s how they feel. I’m sure you know that too.


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Originally Posted by leroy jenkins

And this "i never said' is bullshit. You are saying people who disagree with you do so because the media tells them to. The media is anti gun too, and you can't describe how they aren't.

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OK, I'll bite, Leroy.
For the third time, I am trying to understand your point of view. You're throwing around the same big word, that shows your response to me trying to understand is to be defensive of your position. And believe it or not, this is just the way I communicate usually, so if you feel "infantilized", that's on you mate.
The losers perspective does not necessarily support gun control, that wasn't the point of my statement. It was just that we should always treat history as being seen through a lens, and not believe it to be the whole truth.
I'm saying I don't understand why the people who have a different view point from me hold it, and I would like to. I'm putting forward a theory that it's the media, and other in this thread are sharing their thoughts on it. You, on the other hand are about as much use to my wanting to understand as a chocolate teapot, so I'm just going to pick my popcorn back up and watch as you slowly descend into madness, gibbering and frothing at the mouth as you pound on the keyboard.

Thanks Ted Striker, that's helped with my understanding, I'll look up DC v Heller. The police not being held responsible for their actions seems like something that could lead to people feeling like they would need to level the playing field by being armed in the same fashion. As does the wealth disparity, and lack of opportunities.

Look up rural urban divide too
Part of the gun intractability is a tribal us v them perceived attack on lifestyle/culture
Go read a fishing or hunting forum and see the enthusiasm for pro 2a there

spent the week in florida and the people here celebrate guns as part of their culture. it’s almost like the celebration of the celebration of guns is what’s important. but no, i don’t feel much safer when Mr 2A larper comes into the coffee shop to let us know how passionate he is about his “freedom” to be a jackass.

then i realized there was another coffee shop that had a huge line next door with “gun ball” machine that dispensed casings and a replica of the oval office with life size cutouts of drumpf and melania for pictures in the back and this guy was overflow.

every single stat proves that these guys are complete fucking morons.

worse for kids

worse for cops

worse for women

worse for depressed dudes

better for criminals


confederacy of dunces indeed

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Originally Posted by leroy jenkins

Probably RFK.

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LOL.

RFK Junior says right on his website that if Congress passes gun control he will sign it and implement it.

It will be hilarious when the guy Leroy is voting for ends up taking away Leroy’s guns.


https://www.kennedy24.com/position-o...-amendment-faq




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Leroy’s posts are like a case study in a textbook about gaslighting


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Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn

Leroy’s posts are like a case study in a textbook about attempted gaslighting

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There we go.

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Originally Posted by Harry

LOL.

RFK Junior says right on his website that if Congress passes gun control he will sign it and implement it.

It will be hilarious when the guy Leroy is voting for ends up taking away Leroy’s guns.


https://www.kennedy24.com/position-o...-amendment-faq




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Speaking of fascists.

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Originally Posted by leroy jenkins

Oh we've done this before. You're taking a single year high during the pandemic, when lockdowns prevented people from driving as much, and auto deaths went down, and you're also including 19 year old gang bangers as children.

You're allowed to have your views without distorting reality.

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My apologies. I wasn’t clear on the point I was trying to make. You’re shifting views and changing hearts and minds around here.

If we want to take child deaths related to firearms out of the top two or three causes nationally, we need to get more guns into those kids’ hands. First, they can protect themselves in the short term. Long term, they’ll be the torch bearers protecting my freedoms when I’m too old to be of much use to society.

How do we do this? Instead of a buy back to reduce the number of guns circulating or any type of storage requirements or wait periods to buy, we dedicate a day every year to give a kid a gun.

They have a right to defend themselves just like women. Some of them might even be future women.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

My apologies. I wasn’t clear on the point I was trying to make. You’re shifting views and changing hearts and minds around here.

If we want to take child deaths related to firearms out of the top two or three causes nationally, we need to get more guns into those kids’ hands. First, they can protect themselves in the short term. Long term, they’ll be the torch bearers protecting my freedoms when I’m too old to be of much use to society.

How do we do this? Instead of a buy back to reduce the number of guns circulating or any type of storage requirements or wait periods to buy, we dedicate a day every year to give a kid a gun.

They have a right to defend themselves just like women. Some of them might even be future women.

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Well said.

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Originally Posted by mrkbrnblm

This is such a stupid argument. Yes, all imperfect. But not all the same or equally bad. I know you know that… you’re just making excuses for the ass hole you like.




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No, you've got it ALL wrong.

First, incidentally, I don't like or am defending any of these assholes.

Second, its not about some cop out that there all the same so it doesnt matter, cus hey at least someone horrible isn't the other sides version of horrible.. They're all Unacceptably bad, and it matters very much. They're all bad enough we should not accept any of them.

Seems this coming election, the two parties are basically going to tell us who our candidates are. Primaries are silly. Just vote for the person they tell you to.

It also wasn't an argument. It was a question. Which you didn't answer.

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Originally Posted by Harry

LOL.

RFK Junior says right on his website that if Congress passes gun control he will sign it and implement it.

It will be hilarious when the guy Leroy is voting for ends up taking away Leroy’s guns.


https://www.kennedy24.com/position-o...-amendment-faq




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Why exactly is it hilarious the american people cannot vote for people who actually represent their interests? Hardly limited to gun rights.

Congrats, your post is emblematic of the toxicity that fills this thread. This is what its all about for you guys. just fart sniffing about other peoples guns getting taken away cus you think its just so hilarious.



Good thing in a post bruen world, gun control cannot meet the historical basis standard, and most people don't support gun control these days, even liberals are sick of this stupidity and emotionally exhausted by the constant crying wolf that every spike in gun sales is going to result in an existential threat level jump in violence that just never seems to arrive no matter how many guns get sold.

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Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper

Well said.

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Absurd hyperbole is a refuge for those without wit reason or logic or honesty. Its nothing to applaud.



Do you guys get together and actually suck the farts directly out of each others asses?

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Originally Posted by leroy jenkins

… most people don't support gun control these days,

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https://www.pewresearch.org/short-re...cans-and-guns/
Read number 8, then go back to 7. And then tell us why you’re not full of shit.

And say fart sniffing again. It never gets old.

Just further proof in a long line of examples that Leroy is full of shit.

Problem here is that narcissists can’t admit it. That behavior is ingrained through earlier development. It’s not going anywhere.

He’ll pivot to crying about ad hominem attacks but we’re talking about a trait that prevents him from honestly participating in this discussion - only a special snowflake would demand that this barrier be ignored like they have some right to be impossible to reason with.

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Originally Posted by bennymac

Just further proof in a long line of examples that Leroy is full of shit.

Problem here is that narcissists can’t admit it. That behavior is ingrained through earlier development. It’s not going anywhere.

He’ll pivot to crying about ad hominem attacks but we’re talking about a trait that prevents him from honestly participating in this discussion - only a special snowflake would demand that this barrier be ignored like they have some right to be impossible to reason with.

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What exactly is it that prevents this? Be specific. Criticize behavior, not like, vibe or something. if you criticize someone's vibe, all you're really saying is waaah I don't like you, and really, thats no ones business but your own. An adult does not suffer the delusion others care who they like or especially that their personal likes or dislikes of a person are very relevant to any discussion. Keeping it strictly to behavior empowers the one doing the critiquing, being more grounded in fact and less just generally being whiny.


Yes anyone who disagrees with you is just a narcissist who can't admit they're wrong and clearly can't see just how special of a snowflake you are that you have everything all figured out to the point there is only one viewpoint that could possibly have any validity because the world is not a place of nuance, but one where only you and people just like you are sane. Yep and i'm the narcissist. You know who calls other people out for being a narc the most often? Covert narcs, Because they can't conceptualize of any reason for anyone to do anything other than ego, and can't recognize people outside themselves as individuals separate from themselves. This is classic. you guys are beautiful I love you.

Funny thing is, i have acknowledged many times even in this thread there is validity to the things people who disagree with me say. I also just disagree about other things. I don't need to try to paint people as crazy just so I don't have to look at their arguments. Really, you guys hardly even have any arguments. Mostly its just fat meadow skipper sucking farts directly out of everyones ass.

This single thread is honestly one of the wackiest corners of the interwebs. Its great. You guys are nuts I fucking love you. I know so many liberals and not a single one is rabidly pro disarmament like you clowns think all liberals are. You nuts are alone on this.

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Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper

https://www.pewresearch.org/short-re...cans-and-guns/
Read number 8, then go back to 7. And then tell us why you’re not full of shit.

And say fart sniffing again. It never gets old.

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OMG like, a POLL? that proves it totally completely.

Thank god reality is in fact, quite different .bruens going to fuck gun control. And the best part is going to be that it won't lead to some huge spike in violence. You guys will be so disappointed at that.

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Originally Posted by leroy jenkins

Absurd hyperbole

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Why absurd hyperbole? If you argue that children can't serve in a well regulated militia, then to own guns, you would have to be part of a well regulated militia based on that stance. If you are arguing "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." Are children not people? If you are saying the best way to defend oneself is a firearm and children do face threats of violence (as shown by data that it is a leading cause of death for them), logically protecting themselves with guns would be appropriate. If you are saying that children are not responsible enough to own guns, I would say we either need to go with they need to be part of a well regulated militia or that the second amendment protects their rights to own them.

Wait, did the government evolve laws after the second amendment was written to address some form of gun control that children can't own them? 2a supporters should be up in arms. Get it? Ha.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

Why absurd hyperbole? If you argue that children can't serve in a well regulated militia, then to own guns, you would have to be part of a well regulated based on that stance. If you are arguing "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." Are children not people? If you are saying the best way to defend oneself is a firearm and children do face threats of violence (as shown by data that it is a leading cause of death for them), logically protecting themselves with guns would be appropriate. If you are saying that children are not responsible enough to own guns, I would say we either need to go with they need to be part of a well regulated militia or that the second amendment protects their rights to own them.

Wait, did the government evolve laws after the second amendment was written to address some form of gun control that children can't own them? 2a supporters should be up in arms. Get it? Ha.

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So you have no response to your cherry-picking starts not being representative of reality in general? What you're mostly interested in here is just being smug? Sweet me too!

Guys, I really want to know, people have been buying guns in record numbers for the past few years. We were promised an absolutely apocalyptic surge in violence.

Where is it?


Are you guys really that mad that women of color want to buy and carry guns now? Why does that bother you so much? They've been the fastest expanding group of gun owners for the past few years, and seemingly, are not very likely to engage in mass shootings. Why do you fear women of color having a right to self defense? Seems like most of you have way too much privilege to be dictating how people in less safe places who don't have the strength to defend themselves physically should be living their lives. But its about that control right? You know better than them right? From the safety of your Priuses?

Cherry picking? It's been in the top three causes of death for at least the last 20 years. Maybe more.

https://www.kff.org/mental-health/is...eer-countries/

So do kids have the right to defend themselves or not? What if it's a female child of color? They will turn into a woman of color someday and will have more time to practice for game time.

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Originally Posted by Conundrum

Cherry picking? It's been in the top three causes of death for at least the last 20 years. Maybe more.

https://www.kff.org/mental-health/is...eer-countries/

So do kids have the right to defend themselves or not? What if it's a female child of color? They will turn into a woman of color someday and will have more time to practice for game time.

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So you are just incapable of responding to the points I made about your data?

Women of color have been the fastest expanding group of gun owners for the past few years. Your absurd hyperbole of arming children isn't something even the most rabid pro gun people say. You think its satire but its just stupid. You should be embarrassed.

yawn