Sold to CaliBrit!
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Originally Posted by CaliBrit
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Sold to CaliBrit!
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Originally Posted by CaliBrit
Shit great deal
Am into getting back to more serious touring/mountaineering again and looking into a new lightweight tech binding for a light ski. After reading thru some stuff here and elsewhere I have narrowed it down to 2 bindings which seem plenty proven, least controversial with no major weakness and not much compromising features:
- Marker Alpinist 12
- Salomon MTN Pure
A bonus on the Marker seems the flat ramp angle, not sure how much that is on the MTN. Any pros and cons from experienced users on the one or the other before puling the trigger?
Thanks a bunch folks for your actual insight.
The disadvantage of the alpinist is that the risers do not go high enough for steep skinning.
The mtn is great, and you will never pre release, the toe springs are very strong
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Two things that turned me off Markers:Quote:
Originally Posted by Hicks
1. Too flat ramp, I consistently found myself on my heels and couldn't drive the skis the way I used to. Again, many folks prefer this delta.
2. Limited risers height. This one is quite individual and you might feel ok on longer and not so steep trails.
Went with ATK FR14 and I doubt that will ever want to use anything else.
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Both are good. I found the marker to ski better, more damp, and liked having adjustability of the lateral release. As my preferred RV was between the salomon expert and men’s springs. You can also get the marker for cheaper. The main downside is if you can’t get along with a lower riser height. If you want brakes the marker ones have much worse stopping power that the salomon. While I was skeptical of the durability of the markers plastic bits, I have one pair I’ve absolutely abused in the BC, no lifts, and are still going strong.
The Salomon’s have a good flat mode if you go brake less. The clamp force of the toes is strong and I felt like it inspired more confidence in sketchy firm skinning. The functionality of the heel risers is better that the markers but the binding was a little more harsh feeling on bumpy firm snow.
I’ve had to tighten the screws on the heel towers for both after a fair amount of use but that was easy enough to do on a workbench and only a mild pain to do in the field provided you have the correct screwdriver. Moderate advantage to the maker binding in the ease of doing this.
The Alpinist will ski better and will probably be safer because of the gapless heel and composite toe, but the various plastic parts in the heel are known to break occasionally. The MTN is proven but I don't think it provides any value over a skimo race binding besides offering an additional riser and an option for a very robust brake.
Atk Kular LT for $230 from TP.
The MTN tower will wobble and the risers with move when you don’t want to
The marker alpinist flap and tower will move while skinning and eventually leave you in flat mode or clicking into your pins while trying to skin
Thanks for the quick feedback guys, much appreciated. To explain the binding will be slapped on a fairly skinny ski for mountaineering and (multi day) hut trips involving less aggro skiing, for winter day touring I got a beefier setup already.
- Heel riser: that could indeed become an issue if too limited (especially with a heavier backpack)
- Brake: a good one could be useful in case I eat shit in remote back country on not so flat slopes
- Skiing performance: if the MTN just feels a tad harsher I think I could live with that given moderate speeds
- Release: how safe or reliable is the MTN here compared to the Alpinist? I know both don't really compare to a Tectron or a frame binding, but my bones are old now...
Thanks again, also for eventually adding another suitable one to the list I might have overlooked.
Edit: just noticed Kevino's post.
Ill 2nd the kular. Light, ez to flip the heel around for changeovers, light, skis well with the 4mm gap and added spring for heel elasticity. Good deal at alpinstore for these little elegant beauties. Durability remains to be seen but theyre working well. I added a diy 5mm toe riser
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I have about 60 days on the Trab Vario 2. They ski way better than I thought they would. The heels are starting to develop a bit of vertical slack between the turret and adjustment track. I did not hold back skiing them. Hero snow pillow drops, re-frozen steeps, exit trail jibbing. I did ski a few hard resort days with them. I know, stupid, but it was on an unplanned trip. Does anyone else have the same slack? Would the ATK spacer would be a good addition?
The spacer might help, but you might need new heels if there’s a wiggleQuote:
Originally Posted by Cocximus
The play could potentially be from the heel track rather than the turret itself, which would be a simple replacement.
The play is between turret plate and track. The track seems to be flush with the ski, no volcanoes or anything like that. Is everyone else's heel tight?
I was always a bit wary of the plastic track on light bindings. CNCd aluminum track would be cool. If not stronger at least it can be anodized for that extra lift line steeze.
Curious if anyone has gotten their hands on the new Salomon Summit 12.
Is it replacing the MTN or just another addition to the lineup?
Was planning on getting the MTNs to use over the spring/summer.
It's just another addition. It's on a Salomon 106 Echo for a review. Performs as well as the MTN therefore It's goodQuote:
Originally Posted by tupp_
That's good to hear, in the case I get the OG MTN! Interesting from a product perspective, given they are in the same weight category.
Any reason to wait for the Summit that you have heard/seen? Going brakeless w/ an ATK spacer.
I'd say only if you need the 50mm bsl adjustment vs 30mm. Otherwise it's a tie.Quote:
Originally Posted by tupp_
Did they make the ramp flat?Quote:
Originally Posted by tupp_
Edit. No they didn’t.Quote:
Originally Posted by SupreChicken
Yup. Still 8mm deltaQuote:
Originally Posted by SupreChicken
Need some input on finding a 300 gram-ish touring binding. I've been touring for a few years but have been using hybrid bindings as I venture into the resort a decent amount. Looking to pair this binding with an alpine binding (probably pivot) and a 2000g ski for a travel ski. I'm not super sensitive to ramp angle but I'd prefer something relatively flat and I'd prefer not to deal with spacers esp while traveling. I don't think these will get a ton of use, maybe 3-5 days a year, but I am larger at 6'3 200lbs. And I'd prefer not buy the most expensive binding.
Alpinist, MTN, and Raider seem to fit this criteria, maybe Trab has something in there. I'm new to this world so correct me if I'm wrong. Alpinist brakes are finicky? MTN has kind of a high ramp. And Raider is kind of expensive. Thoughts?
Also I usually ride ~11 din on my alpine clamps. Most pin clamps have a 10 or 12 offering, do you generally run higher or lower on pins?
I’ve been thinking about this a lot lately too. Three other travel options I’ve been rolling around with less fiddle factor:
1) CAST system - could also modify your resort boots with tech toe fittings. Particularly attractive if you’re married to pivots. Can use any boot if not touring.
2) Duke PT/Shift - gives you “real” downhill binding with a pin touring option. Can use any boot if not touring.
3) Vipec or Tecton. Gives you comparatively really good elasticity and lateral release but mandates a touring compatible boot for any trip.
Have you ruled these out for any reason? Just curious for my own thinking as well.
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Yep, muddled over these quite a bit. I think these would be great setups if you were thinking of doing sidecountry or the tours were going to be small when traveling. I rarely do sidecountry and my tours are usually lots of elevation with people that are slightly fitter than me so the substantial weight savings is worth it for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by enginerd
Also these hybrid binding setups are spendy. Almost the same price to buy a simple 300g binding and alpine binding
FWIW I have given up on hybrid setups. They don't do anything well and are expensive.
After skiing Kingpins (>100 days), Shifts (5 days) and Tectons (~20 days) I just can't get over the fiddle factor for resort. I think its important to think critically about what kind of travel you are doing and either run binding inserts or bring dedicated setups.
For travel, I would consider only CAST/Duke PT on a pow ski. Then have a dedicated <300gm binding on a touring rig for huts/high alpine/etc. Hence why I'm looking at MTNs.
For MTN Summit - does anyone know if there is heel "forward pressure"?
^^What is the fiddle factor with Tectons? Curious, I’ve probably got over a hundred days on my pair with a combination of straight touring, sidecountry laps and just lift served. I don’t see what would be the fiddle factor.
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i'm struggling to identify the benefits of this new Summit 12 binding over the MTN.
Seems it's just a couple of mm higher overall (no delta change) and has subbed in plastic for some of the aluminum?
Yeah, exactly what I was thinking. Definitely a quiver setup.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeachesNCream
Totally agree. This is definitely the realm of dedicated lightweight setup.Quote:
Originally Posted by PeachesNCream
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Dupe
https://wildsnow.com/33691/salomons-...-a-first-look/Quote:
Originally Posted by sweatypowderpig
The chart shows the addition of "autoflex" aka elastic travel.
I find they make a lot of noise (perhaps just my specific boot) while skiing, and are very sensitive to snow in the heel piece.Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn
Out of the 3 bindings I mentioned they are the best of the bunch.
Yes, this is the feature I am wondering about.Quote:
Originally Posted by EricB
Alpinist brakes are actually fine. They deploy and stow away. They're quite flat when mounted brakeless and even with a brake they don't have much ramp. Can't recall ramp off top of head but believe it's 2mm delta. MTN has 8mm ramp which is in the middle. Don't know anything about ATKQuote:
Originally Posted by PeachesNCream
At 200lbs and touring 3 -5 days a year (and no offence but I bet these are short tours) just get CAST.
There isn't. It's set up as a 4mm heel gap.Quote:
Originally Posted by tupp_
It's the same as with any tech setup. Getting into the pins is the fiddle factor. I agree with you but that;s what people struggle withQuote:
Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn
6 mm higher front and rear on top of ski. Some plastic at toe mount vs alu to save weight. 50mm bsl adjustment over 30mm adjustment. No replaceable heel prongs for RV setup. Not really much material substantive changeQuote:
Originally Posted by sweatypowderpig
Can't figure that out. From Evo (https://www.evo.com/en-ca/discover/ski/gear-preview) :while Salomon’s Autoflex system moves the binding with your ski, creating dynamic response on the snow suited to freeriding pursuits.:. I'm guessing it's the way the brake is mounted perhaps to allow the ski to flex more naturally?Quote:
Originally Posted by tupp_
Using the Summit vs the Pure I can't tell the difference whether on hardpack or pow
^^The Tecton and Vipec are the easiest tech bindings to step into but I can see why some might struggle [emoji849]
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Day-um ... my Vipecs are the Blacks, from several years ago. They're so difficult to get into that I even have problems engaging a boot when the skis are on the bench. I remember everyone saying that the Blacks had a much improved entry.Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn
Plums & ATKs I can get into blindfolded ;-)
... Thom
No difference getting into Tectons and Vipec Evo. Touch the stopper and step on the pedal. I don’t even look sometimes
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Atk standard delta is something like 11 if i remember right. Personally i like the alpinist a lot, they ski great, reasonably light, and consistently very cheap from europe. I’m planning on adding a freeride spacer to mine soon and imagine they’ll be even better for it.
I run 11 in an alpine binding and the same for my heavier at setups: with the alpinist 12 that means i have 11 lateral and 12 vertical, had an over the handlebars fall and still released fine earlier this year fwiw.
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Thanks LeeLau. So confusing.. I was certain there was elasticity in the heel to compensate for ski flex given the size of the tower. I'm going to try to order some but will likely end up with MTNs.Quote:
Originally Posted by LeeLau
Thanks. I'm leaning alpinist at this point maybe MTN, seem to hit all the boxesQuote:
Originally Posted by LeeLau
No offense taken. Most of the tours will be in the Cascades, tours are in the 3-8k vertical range. So not the big volcano attempts but not small in my book. Keep in mind I'm pairing this with a 2000 gram ski. 2000 gram ski + CAST = pretty heavy. 2000g gram ski + 300g binding = reasonable weight. At least that was my thought when someone suggested itQuote:
Originally Posted by LeeLau
Do you add a freeride spacer with brakes or do the brakes function as a freeride spacer?Quote:
Originally Posted by ezgzy
Thanks for the info on din. That seems reasonable. I was thinking of going to a 10 but then was wondering if the lack of elasticity would make it function less than that which had me thinking of going with the 12.