Tammy Wynette cannot be reached for help-Divorce advice

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Originally Posted by Todd Zander

My biggest regret the last 7 months has not been taking good accurate notes on the days events and the things yelled/said. You never take that step until its too late and things have already begun to unravel, and those notes can be crucial if the other spouse comes unglued.

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+1.

Thankfully, the ex and I are getting along now and regularly doing stuff together with the kids, so it's mostly a moot point for me, but having a record of her treatment of me in the months prior to ending up in court would have likely made for a more sympathetic judge. Or, in a different universe, maybe it would've been helpful in counseling to resolve some of those issues without ending up in court, who knows. Either way, notes with quotes can be very helpful when the other party's memory of an event doesn't match yours.

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Originally Posted by tgapp

Regarding the woman I started seeing right after the ex left; things are better than I ever thought possible, and we're over a year in.
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It absolutely gets better.

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Great to hear. Congrats. And, yes, it does.

Advice sought from the collective and this seems like the right thread for it. My ex is freaking out over my new girlfriend and how I am introducing my tween daughter to her. I went camping this past weekend with my GF and daughter; my GF just bought a camper (I chose well!), and the camper has one double bed and one single. The ex is freaked out that I "slept with GF in front of daughter". The GF and I were fully clothed in case you were wondering, and all weekend we were consciously not being overly affectionate so as not to make my daughter uncomfortable (and especially at night, no spooning or cuddling, just sleeping).

We are all going to a wedding next month (me, daughter, GF), and the ex is freaked out that we are all staying in the same hotel room, and that once again I will be "sleeping with GF in front of daughter" (again fully clothed and minimal affection). She wants me to at minimum sleep with my daughter in one bed and have the GF sleep in the other. She thinks sharing a bed is modeling bad behavior to my daughter, teaching her that she can just jump in bed with guys.

Personally, I think a) the ex's concerns are more about her uncomfortableness and lack of control over the situation, and b) that we are not modeling bad behavior at all, and my daughter is old enough to see that, and will think it ridiculous if I make her sleep in a bed with me while the GF sleeps in the other bed.

But I am honestly open to what all y'all think, maybe I'm off base here.

tell her to go fuck herself.

The best part about being divorced is that you don’t have to pay much attention to the ex’s concerns.

Do your best to be a good dad. Deal with your daughter, not your ex.

A and B for sure.
C: none of her fucking business and you are telling her too much

She doesn’t get to leave and then somehow think she can still be in your life. That’s a lesson she clearly doesn’t understand.

She’s being jealous and using these daughter issues to try to control you. You are doing nothing wrong. Stay firm and strong my friend

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Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper

The best part about being divorced is that you don’t have to pay much attention to the ex’s concerns.

Do your best to be a good dad. Deal with your daughter, not your ex.

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Absolutely true, but co-parenting is a lot easier when we're getting along.

As for the second lines, I absolutely focus on that, on my daughter, and talk to her. But one thing the ex said that I do have to agree with is that my daughter might not express concerns to me -- even if asked point blank -- because she's going to want to give the answer that makes me happy. So I try to pay attention to her (and not just talk to her) but that only goes so far. Another concern of the ex's that is also valid is that in my daughter's eyes it's a pretty "new" relationship, she only met the GF 4 weeks ago, even though we have been together for ~6 months and I am very confident in this relationship.

So while I want to say "fuck that" to my ex, I want to be thoughtful about whether her concerns are valid.

Seems awkward for your daughter.

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Originally Posted by yeahman

Seems awkward for your daughter.

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What is? Me sleeping in one bed with the GF while my daughter sleeps in another? Or me making my daughter sleep with me in one bed and making the GF sleep in another?

I was going to ask how new is new. It's literally in my MDA that we wait to be dating someone at least 6 months before introducing them to the kids (this was actually my choice due to my ex's horrendous behavior immediately after I moved out). But anyway, yeah, you're being reasonable. On the other hand, I do get your ex's point a little bit about it being pretty new to your daughter to all be sharing a room together. I think that might be awkward for your daughter, personally. I just passed on this exact situation coming up next week with my 14 year old because I thought it would be awkward (but of course I'm extra sensitive to it because of what my ex did to her).

And ignore comments from anyone who hasn't had to actively engage in co-parenting - you can't just be like "fuck off I'll do what I want" or it will turn into a war.

Oh, big follow up question here: has your ex brought other guys around your daughter?

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Originally Posted by TahoeJ

Oh, big follow up question here: has your ex brought other guys around your daughter?

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No (at least that is what she said, but I believe her). She said she has dated a couple of people, but none seriously enough to introduce to my daughter. While we do not see eye to eye on a number of things, she is overall a good mom so even though I am defensive about the accusatory "you slept with the GF in front of our daughter" notion, I am trying to be open to the possibility that maybe I am not seeing the full picture.

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Originally Posted by Danno

What is? Me sleeping in one bed with the GF while my daughter sleeps in another? Or me making my daughter sleep with me in one bed and making the GF sleep in another?

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The whole thing. If it were me, I would just take my daughter camping. I wouldn't even consider bringing along the new girlfriend. I wouldn't even want to.

It’s going to be awkward at first no matter what and no matter how long you wait.

If the relationship is real, and it lasts, then it won’t be a big deal. If it turns into a parade, then that’s another story.

IMO (as someone with no kids, so take it for what it’s worth), a 14 year old kid is going to understand what adults do better than you probably know, so if she doesn’t seem weird about it I imagine it’s ok.

My parents divorced late in life, but even then meeting my dad’s new partner was awkward til we got used to it. Now we all love her.

How did your ex find out? How many times has your daughter interacted with the new gf? Did your daughter bring it up to your ex?

If it has been six months of skiing, eating and other such fun together it seems like a logical next step. If it’s like the 5th or 6th time meeting her maybe a bit to fast. If your daughter brought it up to your ex and not you I think that would imply she feels something about it she might not be telling you.

But yeah, if it was just you and your ex talking openly about a now steady relationship, and not your daughter driving the conversation I’d chalk it up to jealousy and keep on keeping on assuming your daughter has a comfortable relationship with her.

This is clearly way too nuanced a situation to litigate on the internet. If the daughter is the one bringing it up I don’t know how much meaning I’d really assign to that. Kids in these (all?) situations will often push buttons just to see things go boom.

If the kid IS driving it I can’t imagine how the actions prescribed by the ex (weird bed sharing arrangements) would be coming from a place of actual concern. You want to worry about whether or not she feels safe in her own space. Whether she feels like she still has a dad that loves her and prioritizes her and show her how to develop healthy and lasting relationships that provide stability to those that depend on them. None of that is served by who sleeps in what bed.

I’d respectfully acknowledge the concern and move on. Neither your ex nor your daughter get to decide who sleeps in any bed they aren’t in when you go camping or sleep in a hotel room. That’s not a healthy boundary to allow either to set.

If it doesn’t seem awkward for your daughter Danno I would just acknowledge your ex’s concerns and do your own thing. Maybe you, your daughter and ex can sit down and discuss it. Some kids roll with this stuff and others get anxious etc. there’s no right answer for everyone


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One thing I will say with certainty: the argument that it's modeling bad behavior is goofy. The overwhelming majority of kids whose parents have gone through a divorce have already been exposed to plenty of bad behavior as far as relationships are concerned. Not to mention by the time kids are teenagers they're way more resilient than we give them credit for and especially these days are more familiar with the "adult world" than previous generations (I think social media plays a huge role).

You mean our kids know we’re fucking?

Danno’s ex is just frustrated and jealous because he has moved on and is thriving after divorce. Maybe she hasn’t moved on. This is her way of trying to maintain control with some goofy line about it being inappropriate.


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Originally Posted by Mustonen

You mean our kids know we’re fucking?

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I laft.

Trying to address a few posts, questions, and corrections:

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Originally Posted by yeahman

The whole thing. If it were me, I would just take my daughter camping. I wouldn't even consider bringing along the new girlfriend. I wouldn't even want to.

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That's a weird take to me, you'd never want to take your GF camping with your kid? Aren't you supposed to try to integrate a partner that you love into your life with your kid?

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Originally Posted by Supermoon

If the relationship is real, and it lasts, then it won’t be a big deal. If it turns into a parade, then that’s another story.

IMO (as someone with no kids, so take it for what it’s worth), a 14 year old kid is going to understand what adults do better than you probably know, so if she doesn’t seem weird about it I imagine it’s ok.

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FWIW, she's 12, not 14 (not sure where 14 came from unless I mistyped before). And I would not have dreamed of introducing her to my kid if I wasn't pretty darn sure the relationship was real and would last; I have no interest in a parade. Of course, nobody can ever predict the future, but I feel pretty confident in this.

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Originally Posted by AdironRider

How did your ex find out? How many times has your daughter interacted with the new gf? Did your daughter bring it up to your ex?

If it has been six months of skiing, eating and other such fun together it seems like a logical next step. If it’s like the 5th or 6th time meeting her maybe a bit to fast. If your daughter brought it up to your ex and not you I think that would imply she feels something about it she might not be telling you.

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My ex found out because she knew we were camping together (which includes unknown sleeping arrangements) and addressed it directly with me, so I told her. She did not ask my daughter and didn't find it out from her; the only thing she asked my daughter was if she had fun and if my GF was nice to her (and my daughter said "yes" to both and that she liked my GF).

As for the "how long" question, I have been dating the GF for 6 months and we have done all those things, spent a TON of time together on the off weeks, but my daughter has only known her for a few weeks. But again, my daughter didn't express (or project) anything negative about it. But maybe it was objectively too soon, I don't know.

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Originally Posted by TahoeJ

One thing I will say with certainty: the argument that it's modeling bad behavior is goofy. The overwhelming majority of kids whose parents have gone through a divorce have already been exposed to plenty of bad behavior as far as relationships are concerned. Not to mention by the time kids are teenagers they're way more resilient than we give them credit for and especially these days are more familiar with the "adult world" than previous generations (I think social media plays a huge role).

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This is what I think. We tried to keep our fights and unhappiness out of her eye, and I think we did a decent job at it but certainly not perfect, and we certainly didn't model a loving couple. And we had the ultimate in bad modeling, divorce. I just don't see how sleeping fully clothed in the same bed without even any spooning/cuddling on a trip (camping or vacation) models bad behavior to my daughter or encourages teenage sex.

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Originally Posted by Danno

My ex found out because she knew we were camping together (which includes unknown sleeping arrangements) and addressed it directly with me, so I told her. She did not ask my daughter and didn't find it out from her; the only thing she asked my daughter was if she had fun and if my GF was nice to her (and my daughter said "yes" to both and that she liked my GF).

As for the "how long" question, I have been dating the GF for 6 months and we have done all those things, spent a TON of time together on the off weeks, but my daughter has only known her for a few weeks. But again, my daughter didn't express (or project) anything negative about it. But maybe it was objectively too soon, I don't know.

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Sounds like your ex is just a little jealous then, which is probably natural. If the roles were reversed it would probably feel a little weird for you, I mean you did love this woman at one point right?

I think as long as your daughter is responding positively to the arrangement you should keep doing you. As others have said, there is probably no realistic way to avoid the inherent awkwardness but it sounds like your daughter and your GF have a solid foundation already and that is a good thing. That really is the driver on it being too soon or not.