Electric car thread

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Originally Posted by grskier

That first sentence/paragraph should be the point for most...

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For any electric car I'm going to presume it's not going to be ideal for any "long distance over passes in cold weather for ski trips."

After three years of owning an electric car I finally took it on a winter road trip last month. About 300 miles for a few days in Jackson. Temps were 5-15 degrees most days and below freezing overnight. It sucked and there aren't any tricks to make it easier and I don't think any other electric car would handle it significantly better. Charging stations were limited going up which was one sucky factor and also the hotel had no charging available. I was losing 25-50 miles just having it sit unplugged overnight.

Any EV (Tesla, VW, Mach-E, Ioniq ) owners or anyone thinking of buying one have any concerns that the car doesn’t come with a spare tire?

Yes, some ICE vehicles have ditched the spare, but it seems to be a more common practice for EVs.

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Originally Posted by spanky

Any EV (Tesla, VW, Mach-E, Ioniq ) owners or anyone thinking of buying one have any concerns that the car doesn’t come with a spare tire?

Yes, some ICE vehicles have ditched the spare, but it seems to be a more common practice for EVs.

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Considering one currently, but this wasn’t on my radar. Are they coming with run flats?

If so, that’s probably fine as a) I would use this primarily for city driving so close to service generally b) I can’t remember the last time I had a flat tire that was on pavement.

Pretty common, my last three BMWs were/are like that, and I carry a donut spare in the back.

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Originally Posted by spanky

Any EV (Tesla, VW, Mach-E, Ioniq ) owners or anyone thinking of buying one have any concerns that the car doesn’t come with a spare tire?

Yes, some ICE vehicles have ditched the spare, but it seems to be a more common practice for EVs.

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That's been the case for many ICE cars as manufacturers have been trying to shave every ounce possible to increase fleet mpg averages. SO many cars come with a can of fix-a-flat and call it good. Does not exactly instill confidence but it is what it is. At least tires are pretty damn resilient these days. Haven't had an actual blowout in ages come to think of it.

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My 2016 Hyundai Accent (ICE) didn't come with a spare. I buy two sets of wheels/tires for all my cars (summer/snows) so I just carried one of those around in the space for it.

My 2019 Bolt also didn't come with a spare, but did have a place for one if you wanted. The car came with liek 5 years of free roadside assistance so I just didn't worry about it, but would have just done the same thing if I had kept the car long enough to run that out. (FWIW I sold the car due to a change of life circumstances, not because of anything about the car. Really liked it)

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Originally Posted by oldnew_guy

Considering one currently, but this wasn’t on my radar. Are they coming with run flats?

If so, that’s probably fine as a) I would use this primarily for city driving so close to service generally b) I can’t remember the last time I had a flat tire that was on pavement.

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Tesla doesn’t come with run-flats. Their response is, “the car comes with roadside assistance”. But that’s only for 4 years and only for “up to 50 miles”.

I’m fine with manufacturers not including spare tires to increase “fuel economy”, but my beef, specifically with Tesla, is that there’s no logical place to put a spare if you wanted to get one.

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Originally Posted by spanky

there’s no logical place to put a spare if you wanted to get one.

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Exactly. I was a pretty regular poster on the two main BMW forums, and I railed about this all the time and basically nobody else on the forum gave a shit. It really pisses me off because there’s a space in the trunk under the flooring that has the same cubic footage as a donut spare just arranged in a way that a donut spare doesn’t fit. Now a lot of cars have the space, and they just offer the donut as an option.

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Originally Posted by muted reborn

For any electric car I'm going to presume it's not going to be ideal for any "long distance over passes in cold weather for ski trips."

After three years of owning an electric car I finally took it on a winter road trip last month. About 300 miles for a few days in Jackson. Temps were 5-15 degrees most days and below freezing overnight. It sucked and there aren't any tricks to make it easier and I don't think any other electric car would handle it significantly better. Charging stations were limited going up which was one sucky factor and also the hotel had no charging available. I was losing 25-50 miles just having it sit unplugged overnight.

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Bummer to hear this. I live 160 miles from Jackson with Togwotee Pass to get over, and I'm hoping to use my EV6 for ski trips there. Worst case I will have to stop in Dubois for an hour+ to add miles on a level 2 charger. More (any) fast chargers along the way would change the game.

We're trying to drive the EV to California later this month. The hard part is getting to Salt Lake City as charging infrastructure in Wyoming sucks. Along I-15 there are lots of options. A high speed charger is under construction in Evanston according to PlugShare and other apps (wtf does that mean). Whenever that thing gets completed the trip is totally doable with a short stop top tip off there. Until then it's a major hassle.

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Originally Posted by spanky

Any EV (Tesla, VW, Mach-E, Ioniq ) owners or anyone thinking of buying one have any concerns that the car doesn’t come with a spare tire?

Yes, some ICE vehicles have ditched the spare, but it seems to be a more common practice for EVs.

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I wouldn't worry on a car. In my 20+ years of driving, I've used the the spare once (when I clipped a curb under slush). At that rate of incidence, I'm happy to try fix a flat and wait for roadside assistance if it doesn't work.

On a truck/SUV I feel differently as I'm both more likely to flat and more likely to be pretty far from easy roadside assistance. There I want a spare (ideally full sized).

I'm curious if on vehicles with four individual motors (like the Rivian), they could institute a mode that let you use a smaller than stock spare and have the motor turn faster. There is no differential, so if you knew the size of the original tires/spare it seems to me that you could get around some of the standard difficulties with smaller spares.

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Originally Posted by MarcusBrody

I'm curious if on vehicles with four individual motors (like the Rivian), they could institute a mode that let you use a smaller than stock spare and have the motor turn faster. There is no differential, so if you knew the size of the original tires/spare it seems to me that you could get around some of the standard difficulties with smaller spares.

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They certainly could, the motor speeds are controlled by software.

Rivian almost certainly won't, I mean, they put the spare under the truck bed so that you have to unload the bed to access it so they clearly aren't thinking about real world scenarios. Oops I got a flat, lemme unload my truck camper or snowmobile or 20 sheets of drywall real quick.
Or maybe they are thinking about the real world, I doubt many $80-100k Rivian buyers are going to be doing actual pickup truck shit with them.

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Originally Posted by adrenalated

They certainly could, the motor speeds are controlled by software.

Rivian almost certainly won't, I mean, they put the spare under the truck bed so that you have to unload the bed to access it so they clearly aren't thinking about real world scenarios. Oops I got a flat, lemme unload my truck camper or snowmobile or 20 sheets of drywall real quick.
Or maybe they are thinking about the real world, I doubt many $80-100k Rivian buyers are going to be doing actual pickup truck shit with them.

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Yeah I was more thinking "would" than "could" I guess, though I wasn't sure if I was overlooking something.

I agree that under the bed isn't optimal, but like you I don't think the Rivian will often be used for the types of things you're describing. I can't really imagine getting a truck with a 4.5 foot bed for hauling a truck camper or snowmobile (maybe something like a GFC, but then you can still access under the bed). Hauling drywall (or similar) is more possible, but also wouldn't worry me that much as I feel less worried about tire damage and am much less likely to be in the middle of nowhere with 20 sheets of drywall.

On the other hand, just driving/exploring rocky dirt desert roads are where I worry about tire damage the most and the Rivian seems fine for that. If I have to yank a couple of coolers, bikes, or paddle boards out to get to the spare once every couple of years I would be cursing while I do it, but still glad the option is there.

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AWD sienna is on run flats, no middle row flipup seat either.

Hadn't thought about spare tires yet for work trucks but definitely worth thinking about! Seems you guys are right. Rivian spare is accessed from the bed side, which would be a total PITA if loaded. F-150 is underneath like it is on most trucks. For rural construction sites or field work this is going to be something to consider for sure.

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Originally Posted by adrenalated

They certainly could, the motor speeds are controlled by software.

Rivian almost certainly won't, I mean, they put the spare under the truck bed so that you have to unload the bed to access it so they clearly aren't thinking about real world scenarios. Oops I got a flat, lemme unload my truck camper or snowmobile or 20 sheets of drywall real quick.
Or maybe they are thinking about the real world, I doubt many $80-100k Rivian buyers are going to be doing actual pickup truck shit with them.

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Have you seen all their marketing on offroading them?

:p

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Originally Posted by WMD

Bummer to hear this. I live 160 miles from Jackson with Togwotee Pass to get over, and I'm hoping to use my EV6 for ski trips there. Worst case I will have to stop in Dubois for an hour+ to add miles on a level 2 charger. More (any) fast chargers along the way would change the game.

We're trying to drive the EV to California later this month. The hard part is getting to Salt Lake City as charging infrastructure in Wyoming sucks. Along I-15 there are lots of options. A high speed charger is under construction in Evanston according to PlugShare and other apps (wtf does that mean). Whenever that thing gets completed the trip is totally doable with a short stop top tip off there. Until then it's a major hassle.

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man, that's going to be difficult for you on both trips with that car.

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Originally Posted by grskier

Have you seen all their marketing on offroading them?

:p

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Is underbed spare placement really a problem for offroading though? You're not going to be carrying 20 sheets of drywall while doing it and the spare tire under the bed let's you put keep the battery (and so CoG) as low as possible. If you need to access the spare, well then moving the whatever is a mild but doable inconvenience. It's not as if under the vehicle placement is really the most convenient for off roading anyway, so in both cases you would probably just want to strap the tire in the bed if you foresee high use potential.

I actually think the Rivian is pretty well thought out. It's just that it's thought out as a lifestyle vehicle, not a work truck. it's something you toss coolers, mountain bikes, dirtbikes, tents in, maybe tow your boat to the nearby lake. It's not something for hauling gravel everyday (though you can use it for that every so often). Even with it's bed, it's closer to the Wrangler/Bronco/Defender/4Runner group than against full sized work trucks (with the Tacoma/Gladiator being the actual obvious comps).

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Originally Posted by muted reborn

man, that's going to be difficult for you on both trips with that car.

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Both will definitely require more planning and take longer than in an ICE vehicle but I think they are doable. At least I hope so.

Skiing Jackson will require a charge on a high speed charger in town before heading home.

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Originally Posted by WMD

Both will definitely require more planning and take longer than in an ICE vehicle but I think they are doable. At least I hope so.

Skiing Jackson will require a charge on a high speed charger in town before heading home.

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but there is only one spot AFAIK that's 'fast' on Millward street. i didn't know about this spot on my trip which would have helped me. I suppose you park there in the morning, take a bus to ski, and then a bus back and hope it's fully charged before heading home? Or get it fully charged overnight at Millward and top it off in the Ranch Lot as you ski? i think the Ranch lot charger is well under 10w which sucks.

How many of you have changed a tire off-roading? I’ve done it once (in a minivan). It sucked. Getting the vehicle out-ish of the way to a flattish location, jacking it using the OEM jack on sketchy-ish and flattish and a solid surface was kinda sketch. I’d likely be offloading big extra weight anyway

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Originally Posted by muted reborn

but there is only one spot AFAIK that's 'fast' on Millward street. i didn't know about this spot on my trip which would have helped me. I suppose you park there in the morning, take a bus to ski, and then a bus back and hope it's fully charged before heading home? Or get it fully charged overnight at Millward and top it off in the Ranch Lot as you ski? i think the Ranch lot charger is well under 10w which sucks.

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There are two 2 50kW CCS chargers (what I need) and 2 50kW CHADeMO chargers at the garage on Millward (supposedly). I'd either take the bus from there to ski or charge while getting dinner after skiing after hopefully charging a little at the Village while skiing. It looks like there are chargers in the Ranch lot and in the Village lot, but both are <10kW chargers. Still good to add at least some miles during the day.

Charging at 7kW should give me 26 miles per hour of charging. Ski for 6-8 hours and I'm looking pretty good. 50kW should do 20-80% in an hour, so that could work too.

It will take effort but I think I can make it work. At least I hope I can.

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Originally Posted by WMD

There are two 2 50kW CCS chargers (what I need) and 2 50kW CHADeMO chargers at the garage on Millward (supposedly). I'd either take the bus from there to ski or charge while getting dinner after skiing after hopefully charging a little at the Village while skiing. It looks like there are chargers in the Ranch lot and in the Village lot, but both are <10kW chargers. Still good to add at least some miles during the day.

Charging at 7kW should give me 26 miles per hour of charging. Ski for 6-8 hours and I'm looking pretty good. 50kW should do 20-80% in an hour, so that could work too.

It will take effort but I think I can make it work. At least I hope I can.

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Ah, they added 2 fast DC chargers in January to the two other ones (reviews say one of the old ones is broken), I didn't know that. Thanks.

The 10kw chargers suck, but without them you'd lose 10-30 miles if it's cold, instead you will gain - I dunno - 10-20 miles? so it's a bigger difference than you'd think so it's worth it. Good luck!

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a3...buzz-revealed/

So the actual VW Buzz looks ok compared to that weirdly wrapped version last week. At least the short WB version Europe gets. But

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American Buzz buyers will also miss the innovative option of vehicle-to-home charging that Volkswagen is planning for Europe, allowing the minibus to act as what is basically a power bank when connected to a compatible two-way wallbox.

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Bizarre decision by VW.

I have been a VW guy from way back. Best memories ever of our gutless 1983 camper van. Today I saw the pictures and write up for a 2024 VW Van. Looked cool and maybe in a few years I will be able to deal with the 300 mile range issue.
https://www.caranddriver.com/volkswa...-buzz-microbus

No bus love here.

But about time someone made an EV minivan.