Praxis Protest..just how cool is it?

Now on their 4th mount... REBORN! 187 carbon/MAP. 13/14

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Originally Posted by Muggydude

Pains me but I think I’m going to sell my 192 Enduro Veneer 3+ Flex protests. Only used 4 days. I love them, but have too many powder skis and need to downsize my quiver for moving into a van.

Had a great last day on them today at A Basin, such a versatile powder ski.

Will post a for sale thread later. If anyone is interested message me.


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PM'd

^ Replied. FS thread if anyone is interested

https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...d.php?t=341285



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^^^Wow, those are pretty damn gorgeous
On the other end, I resurrected some OG protests by adding more BF insert holes to these things! Was able to harvest front toe holes, and most holes are in odd tele places. But still, these will be pow/soft day only skis as I think I'm pushing the swiss cheese limits
(Somehow this pic appears to being loading non-sideways... amazing)
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Originally Posted by eskido

Think there’s A LOT of variables that factor into a decision like that, personally, I see room in the quiver for both. Guess it depends where you ski more than anything, do you get a lot of pow days? Does the snow get cut up super quickly? Are you super stoked on your DD on all but the deep days? Are you trying to keep the quiver to a minimum?
If you live somewhere the pow turns to chop in a couple hours and the storms aren’t huge or often I’d certainly keep the Goat, their pow performance is not Protest stellar, but still stellar, their chop/crud busting ability is top notch, and they exceed the Protest’s versatility for sure.
I’ve owned and used both, and ended up selling my Goats (which I should’ve just kept) but, that spot is now filled by the Quixote, which IMPO is more versatile than the Goat so it fits better for me in that spot because I have the Protest. I will always have something in that soft snow charger spot (i.e. Goat, Q, Cohen... you get the point), but if I could only have one or the other, I’d keep the Goat. If I were in your spot and already owned the Goat, I’d just keep em and buy some Protests [emoji1591]

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I feel ya! Thanks everyone for the advice. As much as I'd love to own more, I try to stick to a two-ski quiver because I travel a good amount to chase the pow. As far as home mountains, I mainly ski Snowbird, Alta sometimes too. I absolutely loved the goats when I traveled to the PNW - they're easily the best heavy pow + tree ski I've ever been on. But in Utah, I found myself wondering if the weight/stiffness/mega-splay of the goat was really the best design for lighter snow. I love the goats and you'll never hear me complain about them, but in the quest for "new sensations on snow" I find myself wondering if a slightly lighter, poppier, even surfier pow ski would be more fun. Admittedly, Snowbird pow days get chopped up reallll quickly, so the ski has to have enough backbone to be fun skiing hard in that too. A big question for me is how the Protests handle these conditions? I've never been on a ski wider than 118cm, so I just don't know what that extra centimeter will equate to in chop.

Meanwhile, my 105mm daily driver (BMX 105HP) is fine (but not particularly exciting) in trenched up resort pow. They're stiff and pretty locked in. However, they really shine in crud, they're incredible on edge, and they're particularly fun skiing hard and fast in the chalkier wind-scoured conditions we get between storms.

My main question for all the Protest owners is how happy you are with them on a 8inch+ inbounds pow day at a busy resort like Snowbird? I'm thinking Great Scott, Silver Fox, Baldy Hike, Mach Schnell, South Chute for those who know the mountain. Overkill? Stick in the 116 category? Or how much does it have to snow for you to prefer them to a 116-ski like the goat?

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Originally Posted by VON

I feel ya! Thanks everyone for the advice. Yeah you're right, no sense getting rid of the goats, but I also like to think of the ideal two-ski quiver because I also travel a good amount to chase the pow. As far as home mountains, I mainly ski Snowbird, Alta sometimes too. I absolutely love the goats when I travel to the PNW - they're easily the best heavy pow + tree ski I've ever been on. But when I'm in Utah, I do find myself wondering if the weight/stiffness/mega-splay is really the best design for lighter snow. Plenty of warm heavy pow days in Utah too, for the record. I love the goats and you'll never hear me complain about them, but in the quest for "new sensations on snow" I find myself wondering if a slightly lighter, poppier, even surfier pow ski would be more fun. Admittedly, Snowbird pow days get chopped up reallll quickly, so the ski has to have enough backbone to be fun skiing hard in that too. A big question for me is how the Protests handle these conditions? I've never been on a ski wider than 118cm, so I just don't know what that extra centimeter will equate to in chop.

Meanwhile, my 105mm daily driver (BMX 105HP) is fine (but not particularly exciting) in trenched up resort pow. They're stiff and pretty locked in. However, they're great crud busters, incredible on edge, and are particularly fun skiing hard and fast in the chalkier wind-scoured conditions we get between storms.

My main question for all the Protest owners is how happy you are with them on a 10inch+ inbounds pow day at a busy resort like Snowbird? I'm thinking Great Scott, Silver Fox, Baldy Hike, Mach Schnell, South Chute for those who know the mountain. Overkill? Stick in the 116 category?

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Having put a few days on my protests now, with a little time in chopped up conditions, I feel qualified to speak on this. Former LCC skier with 100s of days at the Bird, FWIW.

I'd stick with something a little more narrower with more backbone if it were me. As you said, the Bird gets chopped up quick, and speed is the name of the game, so while the protests are okay in chop, give me something with metal and a more traditional shape to smooth things out.

This seems like a fair to screaming deal

https://rockies.craigslist.org/spo/d...286098067.html

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Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles

This seems like a fair to screaming deal

https://rockies.craigslist.org/spo/d...286098067.html

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Wonder if theyre custom -10 p tests or the 118 waist listed is a mistake. Base graphic together with that topsheet points to a custom build

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Originally Posted by grinch

Wonder if theyre custom -10 p tests or the 118 waist listed is a mistake. Base graphic together with that topsheet points to a custom build

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139 and 132 are correct for the standard width, I assume 118 is a typo.

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Originally Posted by HAB

139 and 132 are correct for the standard width, I assume 118 is a typo.

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Right, makes sense

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It hasn't been a good snow year in Northern CO this season. Yesterday while skinning up I was reflecting that I have personally had great skiing almost every time I've gone out. Lucky timing, I thought. Then I crossed paths with three groups. I asked a split boarder who was out earlier than me how the snow was. He told me it was so so. Wind affected. Then I passed a group of 4 on my second lap. They were one and done because the snow was "too punchy." A third guy who was skiing with his dog told me "it would have been better yesterday."

I thought the snow was great. Yeah, it was a bit wind affected at tree line and there was a hint of a sun crust a few inches down in places, but it was surfy and fun. Come to think of it, I had some similar conversations with strangers about snow quality last week...

But then it occurred to me that I was on Protests and they were just on... skis. This season I've been taking out my Protests every time I go on a tour and anticipate less than great snow. And as a result I've only skied great snow. When you're skiing mostly untracked snow that just isn't very good, the Protests make it good. When you have snow with different consistencies across small changes in aspect or in and out of the shade of trees, the Protests just don't care. Still surfy and smooth. It's all good.

I prefer to bring my UL GPO's when I know there is fresh, dry pow, as they are so much lighter. But after a big wind event, or warmth/sun that is likely to degrade the snow there is no comparison. Protests rule. Hoping to add some UL Protests next season because they sure aren't light on the up.

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Originally Posted by I've seen black diamonds!

It hasn't been a good snow year in Northern CO this season. Yesterday while skinning up I was reflecting that I have personally had great skiing almost every time I've gone out. Lucky timing, I thought. Then I crossed paths with three groups. I asked a split boarder who was out earlier than me how the snow was. He told me it was so so. Wind affected. Then I passed a group of 4 on my second lap. They were one and done because the snow was "too punchy." A third guy who was skiing with his dog told me "it would have been better yesterday."

I thought the snow was great. Yeah, it was a bit wind affected at tree line and there was a hint of a sun crust a few inches down in places, but it was surfy and fun. Come to think of it, I had some similar conversations with strangers about snow quality last week...

But then it occurred to me that I was on Protests and they were just on... skis. This season I've been taking out my Protests every time I go on a tour and anticipate less than great snow. And as a result I've only skied great snow. When you're skiing mostly untracked snow that just isn't very good, the Protests make it good. When you have snow with different consistencies across small changes in aspect or in and out of the shade of trees, the Protests just don't care. Still surfy and smooth. It's all good.

I prefer to bring my UL GPO's when I know there is fresh, dry pow, as they are so much lighter. But after a big wind event, or warmth/sun that is likely to degrade the snow there is no comparison. Protests rule. Hoping to add some UL Protests next season because they sure aren't light on the up.

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Thats awesome and i can see that happening for sure

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Originally Posted by I've seen black diamonds!

It hasn't been a good snow year in Northern CO this season. Yesterday while skinning up I was reflecting that I have personally had great skiing almost every time I've gone out. Lucky timing, I thought. Then I crossed paths with three groups. I asked a split boarder who was out earlier than me how the snow was. He told me it was so so. Wind affected. Then I passed a group of 4 on my second lap. They were one and done because the snow was "too punchy." A third guy who was skiing with his dog told me "it would have been better yesterday."

I thought the snow was great. Yeah, it was a bit wind affected at tree line and there was a hint of a sun crust a few inches down in places, but it was surfy and fun. Come to think of it, I had some similar conversations with strangers about snow quality last week...

But then it occurred to me that I was on Protests and they were just on... skis. This season I've been taking out my Protests every time I go on a tour and anticipate less than great snow. And as a result I've only skied great snow. When you're skiing mostly untracked snow that just isn't very good, the Protests make it good. When you have snow with different consistencies across small changes in aspect or in and out of the shade of trees, the Protests just don't care. Still surfy and smooth. It's all good.

I prefer to bring my UL GPO's when I know there is fresh, dry pow, as they are so much lighter. But after a big wind event, or warmth/sun that is likely to degrade the snow there is no comparison. Protests rule. Hoping to add some UL Protests next season because they sure aren't light on the up.

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This has been exactly my experience. You will not regret getting them in an UL. I've said it before but I'll say it again.

Cold. Dead. Hands.

I've only skied mine a couple days but after skiing some funky upside down snow at Silverton a few weeks ago I'm planning to CAST-ify mine. I kept saying I'd swap out skis as things got funky but they just kept getting better. They almost make zipper crust invisible. Pretty wild.

Yep, these things still rule.

Triple protest day today at Stevens pass.

So good.

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Originally Posted by grinch

They can take a few days to really click and use the yuge sweet spot. I really really prefer them mounted back 1.5 from the dimple, if you haven't or considered that.

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Guys, help a jong out. we are talking 1.5cm or about .60 inches back from the dimple correct. Just received my new 187's from Keith, as the close out deal was to good for me to say no to. Leaning against the wall of my office, they look so fun. Praying Winter comes back to Mammoth for a few days in the next few weeks or it will be a long summer and fall for me.

I can confirm from prior that tgr consensus is 1.5 cm back from rec. I did same. Helped that that also let me re-use some holes. I only have one day on them, was pretty deep day and they were great.

Thanks Tang

I've skied mine on the line, and then remounted at about -1.2. 192s, FWIW. Didn't totally click for me on the line, moving back was a revelation.

I can't say that all the -1.5 talk hasn't gotten my attention, so yes I'm curious.

I've owned, skied and loved my Protests for 8 years or so. Always on the line, and never had tip dive. Two mounts - STH and Sollyfit.

Tell me I'd be a right idiot to mess with that - or should I add another set of holes.

Hard for me to say where someone else should mount them. I thinks its important to find the right spot for the individual though. I think with more splay itd be possible to move the mount for/aft , atleast a bit, but they would lose some precision which isnt all bad. Just such a great ski that i see some people having tip dive on the line and give up on an outstanding ski when, most likely, they could drill a few more holes at -1.5 and have their mind blown. Ftr i ski fairly centered/neutral but not super progressive. I like to shift from racer to forward pivoty as called for. I like my gpo at -1 , rx close to dimple, piste jib -1, bc/yeti/exp at dimple, concept at -1. Ive tried the gpo, protest on the dimple and the tip dive sucked and my rx at -1.2 work well but i want to move those forward for more tail support. I like fairly centered, or atleast more centered than skis of the past. Better balanced edge pressure and easier to pivot but tip dive throws all the advantages out the window. Find your spot and theyre the best. Whats a few more holes? Maybe im mistaken but i feel i could move the mount a touch either forward or backward on my bg without a problem and i think its because of the added splay. Ive gone on the line and -.5 on the bg and adapted right away Nd i think i could go +.5 too. Not a big move but just to give an example . The 1 cm variance would be no issue. Im glad i found my spot on the gpo and protests. I cant do without a gpo and i really miss my protest.

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Originally Posted by grinch

... Im glad i found my spot on the gpo and protests.

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Careful there, big feller ... we might have to flag this thread as NSFW :cool:

In all seriousness, I may have uncovered why I didn't bond with my Protests. They are customs, that I didn't spec out, and these 187s weighed 10.4 Lbs, which is heavy for a MAP/Enduro layup in this size.

I strongly suspect that they have a heavy core. I checked in with the mag I sold them too, and he had a similar reaction to them (a planky feel). We both bond nicely with 187 GPOs (my GPOs actually found their way to him through a subsequent intermediate sale, after I decided to down size to 182).

I've had too many misfires with customs, and this Spring, I'm leaning heavily toward an Ullr, with a standard camber (UL/Veneer/#3 for powder touring). I'll stay away from the compound camber, in order to play it safe.

... Thom

i've never tried concepts, but my first pair of Praxis were the original BPS ski that had compound camber, wasn't a fan.
Sold the ski.

KISS method might be best here.

My 187 Protest are at -2. It was love at first turn, but I'm still learning some of the things they're capable of. I'm 5'10" 170 and would definitely size up for a resort ski, but I like 187 for touring. Also the flex is spot on. I'd go longer before going stiffer for sure. I think 192 would be spot on for me, but 196's would probably be fine too. I think stiffer would just be less fun without gaining much. I say this as someone who typically doesn't like soft or "playful" skis, and usually prefers the second longest available length.

I’ve had 3 pairs of protests (ha!). -1.75 is money, wasn’t a fan of the line. Had one pair with demo binders so got to play around with it


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Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un

Careful there, big feller ... we might have to flag this thread as NSFW :cool:

In all seriousness, I may have uncovered why I didn't bond with my Protests. They are customs, that I didn't spec out, and these 187s weighed 10.4 Lbs, which is heavy for a MAP/Enduro layup in this size.

I strongly suspect that they have a heavy core. I checked in with the mag I sold them too, and he had a similar reaction to them (a planky feel). We both bond nicely with 187 GPOs (my GPOs actually found their way to him through a subsequent intermediate sale, after I decided to down size to 182).

I've had too many misfires with customs, and this Spring, I'm leaning heavily toward an Ullr, with a standard camber (UL/Veneer/#3 for powder touring). I'll stay away from the compound camber, in order to play it safe.

... Thom

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The ones you got from me? I thought they were map. They were pre heavy hitter core availibility i think.
Ive had some misfires too. Didnt care for concepts or 9d8's or the effects of carbon. I prefered my 177 ptests over the 187 and id want 4 flex and heavy hitter. If there was a 182 option thatd be perfect. Like mount point , the task is finding whats right for the individual, i think. I agree on the kiss method. The custom option/sale is awesome but im going to not stray to far from where im at now, apart from adding veneer and hh core(gpo/protest). Veneer and hh seems to fit what i like in a ski.
Wish there was a 104 waisted 178 pistejib. Miss that ski but id need a tweener length. 184 was too long for that usage and 102-104 would be preferable. Thats a ski that could have a 94/104/114 option. That design was capable everywhere

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Originally Posted by grinch

The ones you got from me? I thought they were map. They were pre heavy hitter core availibility i think.

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I got 'em off ebay. They had STH12s on them. I'm not sure of the year, but they were 187s (not the earlier 188s), with nylon top, stained glass trees graphics.

... Thom

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Originally Posted by galibier_numero_un

I got 'em off ebay. They had STH12s on them. I'm not sure of the year, but they were 187s (not the earlier 188s), with nylon top, stained glass trees graphics.

... Thom

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Oh ok, copy that. Vaguely recall them now

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These are the exact conditions I am most curious how the Protest handles.
Are people wishing for a narrower ski, or are they licking their lips getting ready to mob that kinda snow on the Protests?

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Originally Posted by jmills

192 4 flex

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Originally Posted by VON

These are the exact conditions I am most curious how the Protest handles.
Are people wishing for a narrower ski, or are they licking their lips getting ready to mob that kinda snow on the Protests?

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^what he said

I got an email yesterday about Praxis closeouts.

They have some Protests available, among a number of other options.

I just picked up some MVPs in a 183. I'm fascinated by the RX, I think that in a 184 might be perfect for me, but I have several skis around 116, a pair around 100 and nothing around 108, which seems like it would be a good sweet spot.

The sale is up on their website.

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Originally Posted by VON

These are the exact conditions I am most curious how the Protest handles.
Are people wishing for a narrower ski, or are they licking their lips getting ready to mob that kinda snow on the Protests?

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Originally Posted by JackS4958

^what he said

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You guys serious?

Looking at 192's as my Whistler inbounds deep day ski and possibly w/CAST. Curious to how I will get along with this ski, currently on JJ Zero 2.0's (-2.5cm from center w/CAST), faction 3.0's (-2.5 as well) and Corvus Freebirds (-7.5 from center). Other pow skis have been 2 other sets of OG JJ's, OG Hellbents and Obsethed's. Good skier with neutral stance.

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Originally Posted by tuco

You guys serious?

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yes. not all of us can spend our lives and money reading every single review that has ever been written in the history of the internet or afford to buy every ski ever. i've never skied a 128mm underfoot ski. so we ask questions to people who can before we spend money, so we know what we're getting. blister makes it sound like they are still decent in softer lower-tide conditions, but i would like to know from someone who owns protests how they'd deal with those conditions. if the answer is "no dumbass they wouldn't handle it well they're basically reverse camber and 128mm underfoot with a fuckton of tip and tail rocker and taper" then say that. if the answer is "yeah they are stable and fun in anything soft" then say something like that. but i want to hear it from someone who has skied protests in those conditions

they are stable, and fun in anything soft! Seeing those pics, I'd take mine out in that, just maybe not all day.
I've skied mine in fresh pow, chop, and yes even groomers back to the lift. They aren't for crushing gates, but they still mob down anything soft. Fresh snow and some room to go fast? Yes. Please.

If the chop in those photos is soft, they’re awesome. If it’s not, they’re not

Going off those photos as the snow looks gud n soft, I be Protesting with a big shit eatin grin on my face.
Edit to add, plus they rule if it warms up or starts to rain turning pow into schmoo. Everyone else packs it up and goes home while I shred likes it’s killer pow.

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Originally Posted by JackS4958

yes. not all of us can spend our lives and money reading every single review that has ever been written in the history of the internet or afford to buy every ski ever. i've never skied a 128mm underfoot ski. so we ask questions to people who can before we spend money, so we know what we're getting. blister makes it sound like they are still decent in softer lower-tide conditions, but i would like to know from someone who owns protests how they'd deal with those conditions. if the answer is "no dumbass they wouldn't handle it well they're basically reverse camber and 128mm underfoot with a fuckton of tip and tail rocker and taper" then say that. if the answer is "yeah they are stable and fun in anything soft" then say something like that. but i want to hear it from someone who has skied protests in those conditions

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Protests are powder skis.
Sometimes pictures can be misleading, but seeing how that's Alta and pow gets skied out there in about 37 minutes, I'm going to surmise that the snow is soft, powder in fact. Therefore, pow on ground means pow skis on feet.

Just sayin.

P.S. You're only going to glean so much info from a review(or answers from the collective). Lots of variables there

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Originally Posted by JackS4958

i've never skied a 128mm underfoot ski.

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you haven't lived