Anyone have anything they'd like to rant about?

In Vermont the only reason builders mechanized was for profitability. Hand benched trail in these parts is considerably more expensive to build.

In addition it has been sold as more sustainable. Another bullshit buzz word land managers like. In truth, even the most impacted primitive trail, with no benching, represents day one of an excavated bench cut. The impact and soil disturbance of even the most well designed and executed excavator trail far exceeds that of even a poorly planned hand built trail.

Sustainability is a myth. By removing all the roots, builders remove nature's very affective soil stabilizers, and after every gully washer one can observe a lot of mineral dirt moving down trail and off trail.

These trails being the gateway to the flow state that we all seek to exist in while ripping is the final joke. The flow state is reached by over stimulating. When the cognitive functions are overwhelmed other parts of the brain are hijacked to crunch the data fast enough to stay in one piece. That is where the escape into the flow state happens. By dumbing down trails builders make it harder to achieve flow state.

Flow trails are about making mtb easy enough for posers to feel good about their latest purchase.

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Originally Posted by kidwoo

Well I don't really consider any right of way other than "what makes sense here" and "what's actually effective." I sure as fuck don't remember nominating IMBA lord of the woods or anything.

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Yes. I've stopped going downhill as well as going uphill. Every situation is different on a bike. Hiking the uphill has the row, just because they always have for some reason, but I've stopped in both scenarios as well hiking...and I was a quasi guide back in the day.

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Originally Posted by plugboots

^^^ Well Creeky, we had a good run, then.

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Yep, dropper posts at half-height, black wreath on my front wheel, singing dirges. I threw dirt on its coffin, it's time for the wake.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...53ff0fe7a8.jpg
Cows say:
“Moooooooove yer flow BS to somewhere else!”

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Originally Posted by gravitylover

Over the last few months I've noticed that more and more people step out of the way for me when I'm descending whether it's other riders or hikers. I've also had hikers be quite a bit more considerate in all situations than they used to be. Unfortunately the same doesn't hold true for equestrians and trail runners. Both of those groups are still as rude as ever.

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In my home town you used to see 2 or three people when you were out on your ride a decade ago. Many of the single tracks have been built out into the IMBA trails you speak of. One night while climbing Holly's a group was out building and I asked to be let through. One up tight dude says "you can at least say thank you for our work." I turned and said, " I wish you weren't here. Now on a trail I have to myself every evening I will have a ton of people, but thank you." It now is a four foot wide freeway seeing tons of traffic. It's easy to be considerate when you don't have to dismount every five minutes. Chair access, shuttle services and growth have changed the dynamic here. I always try to be nice, but sometimes I feel like I'm back in Boulder with the number of people out there.

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Originally Posted by Canada1

In my home town you used to see 2 or three people when you were out on your ride a decade ago. Many of the single tracks have been built out into the IMBA trails you speak of. One night while climbing Holly's a group was out building and I asked to be let through. One up tight dude says "you can at least say thank you for our work." I turned and said, " I wish you weren't here. Now on a trail I have to myself every evening I will have a ton of people, but thank you." It now is a four foot wide freeway seeing tons of traffic. It's easy to be considerate when you don't have to dismount every five minutes. Chair access, shuttle services and growth have changed the dynamic here. I always try to be nice, but sometimes I feel like I'm back in Boulder with the number of people out there.

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The solution in Park City is to make everything directional.

I don't have a problem with uphill ROW as a general guideline for obvious safety reasons. My real gripe is with douches like those in jm2e's story who insist on climbing de facto downhills when there's a nice climbing route nearby, or who descend obvious climbing routes. Not being an idiot solves many problems.

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Originally Posted by Canada1

I turned and said, " I wish you weren't here.

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This made my day. It's like doppelganger pink floyd.

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Originally Posted by gravitylover

Over the last few months I've noticed that more and more people step out of the way for me when I'm descending whether it's other riders or hikers. I've also had hikers be quite a bit more considerate in all situations than they used to be. Unfortunately the same doesn't hold true for equestrians and trail runners. Both of those groups are still as rude as ever.

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Do you actually expect equestrians to yield to you while you're descending? :confused:

I can't wait until someone figures out "taste prediction" software + cellphone connectivity + MTB boombox so that you could just blast down the hill and your music will change based upon whatever person you're about to encounter. Tuned accurately enough you could really affect the mindset of those who, otherwise, might see you as their Mechanical Grim Reaper. For some, music that makes them go all Zen. For others, party music. For others, something that scares them into running off-trail and hiding behind a tree or rock.

Imagine the Sport-GrowingTM opportunities.

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Originally Posted by Dantheman

The solution in Park City is to make everything directional.

I don't have a problem with uphill ROW as a general guideline for obvious safety reasons. My real gripe is with douches like those in jm2e's story who insist on climbing de facto downhills when there's a nice climbing route nearby, or who descend obvious climbing routes. Not being an idiot solves many problems.

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We have a trail in town that is marked at each end with a sign saying "This is a Mountain Bike Descent Trail." The great majority of people I encounter on that trail are coming uphill, and most of them are on foot. One time a couple years back a walker glared at & made a snarky remark as I passed. I stopped, said "you saw the signs saying this is a MTB descent trail?", exchanged two futile sentences, and went about my way. You can't fix someone else's smug ignorance and insistence they're always in the right. The problem is when that view dominates among the trail users.

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Originally Posted by creaky fossil

I can't wait until someone figures out "taste prediction" software + cellphone connectivity + MTB boombox so that you could just blast down the hill and your music will change based upon whatever person you're about to encounter. Tuned accurately enough you could really affect the mindset of those who, otherwise, might see you as their Mechanical Grim Reaper. For some, music that makes them go all Zen. For others, party music. For others, something that scares them into running off-trail and hiding behind a tree or rock.

Imagine the Sport-GrowingTM opportunities.

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I'm seriously considering getting a REALLY loud bluetooth speaker and blaring at all times on the way down:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGU1P6lBW6Q

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Originally Posted by gravitylover

Over the last few months I've noticed that more and more people step out of the way for me when I'm descending whether it's other riders or hikers. I've also had hikers be quite a bit more considerate in all situations than they used to be. Unfortunately the same doesn't hold true for equestrians and trail runners. Both of those groups are still as rude as ever.

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I don't know about trail runners (I'm pretty considerate when I'm trail-running), but most multi-use trails I've been on give equestrians the right of way over all users. But local areas can have differing ethos.

Equestrians and Santa Cruz bikes ALWAYS have the right of way.

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Originally Posted by Dantheman

Not being an idiot solves many problems.

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This

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Originally Posted by creaky fossil

We have a trail in town that is marked at each end with a sign saying "This is a Mountain Bike Descent Trail." The great majority of people I encounter on that trail are coming uphill, and most of them are on foot. One time a couple years back a walker glared at & made a snarky remark as I passed. I stopped, said "you saw the signs saying this is a MTB descent trail?", exchanged two futile sentences, and went about my way. You can't fix someone else's smug ignorance and insistence they're always in the right. The problem is when that view dominates among the trail users.

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That is lame, but around here directional trail designations tend to be very well respected.

Not sure if this is a Bozeman problem or widespread.

Fatbikes/snowbikes are getting more and more popular.

Around here, most set track/groomed track is closed to us.

A friend was down at Grand Targhee and showed some awesome pictures of the trail system down there. Traditional, skate and snowbikes all sharing and getting along just fine.

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Originally Posted by Dantheman

That is lame, but around here directional trail designations tend to be very well respected.

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Around here there are NO directional trails. There are some "well known" descent trails, but to be honest, there are SO many n00Bs that on any give day you can expect a bunch of clueless people to be climbing on them...

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Originally Posted by creaky fossil

We have a trail in town that is marked at each end with a sign saying "This is a Mountain Bike Descent Trail."

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We don't have any directional trails where I ride (other than being logical and doing so because it's obvious), but I'd like to print up a bunch of stickers saying that and post them anyway! Would definitely get some panties in a bunch.

Hmm. May have to do that. Group buy?

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Originally Posted by skaredshtles

Do you actually expect equestrians to yield to you while you're descending? :confused:

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Originally Posted by Alaskan Rover

I don't know about trail runners (I'm pretty considerate when I'm trail-running), but most multi-use trails I've been on give equestrians the right of way over all users. But local areas can have differing ethos.

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I didn't say I expect equestrians to yield I said that they are more rude than they've ever been. I can't stand the fact that it's ok for them to leave piles of shit everywhere but after my episode a few years ago I realize that I have no choice but to accept it or go buy a huge piece of land to call my own and make my own rules. When a rider tells me to turn around and find a place well off the trail where my horse can't see you it pisses me off and it has happened a few times in the last year. I refuse to do that and recently had it explained to me that I'm obligated to by a park ranger and if I don't like it I should just stay out of his parks. I told him to arrest me because I was going to cause a problem the next time it happened and stuck my wrists out, he wouldn't do it. I accept that I will get a faceful of shit when I roll through a pile at speed, I accept that I have to stop no matter what the situation is and step off to the side even if it's a cliff or poison ivy patch but I refuse to turn around and hide, fuck I don't even think I should have to take my eyewear and helmet off when an uncontrolled dog loses its shit on me like yesterday.

Yeah dogs are another problem that's getting worse. We had one yesterday that chased me and nipped at my heels until it just couldn't run fast enough so it turned around and went for my daughter so I turned around and dealt with it. All the owner did was tell the dog to stop from 100 feet away and come back to him and when it bit my daughter I grabbed it by the neck and dragged it back to him and threw it in his face. He started crying :smile: It's a good thing my daughter was wearing shin pads because that thing punctured them, had it been her leg that guy would have done more than cry.

What do we have to do to have a quiet couple of hours in the woods anymore? People suck :nonono2:

You are such a bullshit liar, gravylover.
I don't believe you even ride a bike.
Take a lap. Gravygut.

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Originally Posted by gravitylover

I didn't say I expect equestrians to yield I said that they are more rude than they've ever been. I can't stand the fact that it's ok for them to leave piles of shit everywhere but after my episode a few years ago I realize that I have no choice but to accept it or go buy a huge piece of land to call my own and make my own rules. When a rider tells me to turn around and find a place well off the trail where my horse can't see you it pisses me off and it has happened a few times in the last year. I refuse to do that and recently had it explained to me that I'm obligated to by a park ranger and if I don't like it I should just stay out of his parks. I told him to arrest me because I was going to cause a problem the next time it happened and stuck my wrists out, he wouldn't do it. I accept that I will get a faceful of shit when I roll through a pile at speed, I accept that I have to stop no matter what the situation is and step off to the side even if it's a cliff or poison ivy patch but I refuse to turn around and hide, fuck I don't even think I should have to take my eyewear and helmet off when an uncontrolled dog loses its shit on me like yesterday.

Yeah dogs are another problem that's getting worse. We had one yesterday that chased me and nipped at my heels until it just couldn't run fast enough so it turned around and went for my daughter so I turned around and dealt with it. All the owner did was tell the dog to stop from 100 feet away and come back to him and when it bit my daughter I grabbed it by the neck and dragged it back to him and threw it in his face. He started crying :smile: It's a good thing my daughter was wearing shin pads because that thing punctured them, had it been her leg that guy would have done more than cry.

What do we have to do to have a quiet couple of hours in the woods anymore? People suck :nonono2:

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That rant escalated quickly. Well done! :D

I can help you with the "quiet couple hours in the woods" though - just go between 6am and 3pm any weekday. It works around here, at least.

I always tell people with off-leash dogs in the county parks here that there is a ranger "just around the corner" - they are always very appreciative and put their dogs immediately on leash.

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Originally Posted by skaredshtles

That rant escalated quickly. Well done! :D

I can help you with the "quiet couple hours in the woods" though - just go between 6am and 3pm any weekday. It works around here, at least.

I always tell people with off-leash dogs in the county parks here that there is a ranger "just around the corner" - they are always very appreciative and put their dogs immediately on leash.

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Thanks :)

Night riding usually solves the problem I just haven't had anyone to go with recently.

That means stopping to communicate with them and they're not worth the time usually.

Yo mybutthurts - That's good, I love gravy. And Cheese. And cookies with ice cream. Did a rippin' fast rail trail ride this afternoon Attachment 216884

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Originally Posted by Dantheman

The solution in Park City is to make everything directional.

I don't have a problem with uphill ROW as a general guideline for obvious safety reasons. My real gripe is with douches like those in jm2e's story who insist on climbing de facto downhills when there's a nice climbing route nearby, or who descend obvious climbing routes. Not being an idiot solves many problems.

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There's sooooo much of that shit in Corner Canyon recently. Lycra fuckers who are climbing up Ghost Falls and continue up the Jacob's Ladder DH just so they can brag about it on Straaaaaaaaaaava.

I want an app that causes people’s fucking boomboxes to explode. Fuck those fucking things right in the fucking keister.
Also, if you’re descending a multi use trail, you gotta be able to stop within your sight line or be ready to stuff it in the bushes. That’s just common sense.

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Originally Posted by joetron

I stuff it in the bushes. That’s just common sense.

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I’m always ready to stuff it. That’s why I always wear a helmet

And DaveVT deserves a hand for his very VT post.

Fatbikes will never outnumber ski sales in dollars in the US. E bikes...

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Originally Posted by YourMomJustCalled

There's sooooo much of that shit in Corner Canyon recently. Lycra fuckers who are climbing up Ghost Falls and continue up the Jacob's Ladder DH just so they can brag about it on Straaaaaaaaaaava.

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I've ranted about people who climb Ghost Falls before. That annoys me, but if I encounter anyone climbing Jacob's who isn't obviously a clueless noob I would have a hard time not being openly hostile.