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^ & the ‘admission width’ for being a Moment consumer is 98mm. The Commander 98 is a solid ride, but most intermediate/advancing skiers don’t want to work a ski that hard to ski the groomers & unfortunately that’s a ton of the market. FWIW - my Jaguar Sharks are one of my favorite skis when I’m not plotting to be in the trees/bumps.
That's interesting. For me, that's one of the last things I look for in a ski because I haven't found a ski with traditional sidecut that you can't carve up groomers on. That's one reason I ended up on my 116mm Bibbys... they can rip groomers pretty damn well. Does it carve like a GS ski? Of course not. But to me, groomers are mostly for a fun, quick, and leisurely run down to the lift... and pretty much any ski with traditional sidecut will do that for me.
Different strokes of course, I don't aspire to be a racer... but it makes me wonder how many people who are only in it for a leisurely day on the mountain actually benefit from skinny skis.
And tangentially... same with teaching beginners on cambered skis. I don't see why people aren't learning on flat bases or even slight reverse camber. It'd make catching an edge way less common and make it easier for them break out the tails and learn the muscle memory for a skate stop.
Plenty of skis coming out of China and Austria fit what those people are looking for. An easy going east coast groomer ski doesn’t seem to fit with Moment’s current philosophy, and most of us are very thankful for that.Quote:
Originally Posted by iriponsnow
Btw, it appears Moment had a record sales year with most skis selling out.
There have been multiple industry blog type internet posts pushing for narrow skis this year, setting the marketing stage for spring sales and sales for 19/20. It appears that some of the ski companies in coordination with some retailers (most specifically REI) are gonna push to sell skus for skis narrower than 90mm underfoot. Several of the posts are alluding to a “you’re doing wrong” tone, directed towards customers. Some ski companies have even stated that they are pushing on narrower skis this season and maybe next and will then push the pendulum back to wider skis....
Debating on whether to get a Wildcat Tour or a Wildcat 108 Tour. Already have a shit snow touring setup so this is more of a middle of winter touring setup. Anyone skied both and can elaborate more on the difference?
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I got the 190 DW this year, skiing interior BC/Colorado. Love' em, hold up awesome is almost all terrain, and carve really nice once I'm up to speed
If your thinking 'non shit snow' I don't see a lot of downsides to the regular Wildcat unless the weight really matters.
The 108 is a little lighter and will likely be 'very slightly' better in some snow conditions but worse in the soft stuff. The regular wildcat tour is already plenty light in my opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Skier206
Bibby tour (std wildcat tour) is incredibly good at skiing firm snow. I doubt the 108 is significantly better. I bet the 116 is significantly better in powQuote:
Originally Posted by Tailwind
That’s what I’m thinking. It would be < 5000 vert days so like 100-200 grams doesn’t matter that much
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Just to echo what was said, I own the 108 Tour but have never skied a full width Cat. I fucking love the 108 tour as a one ski quiver for touring and they’re a strong choice for a narrower travel ski.Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Skier206
That said, I think the 108, like most 108 skis, is a very good one ski quiver for softer snow conditions but not a great pow ski if you weigh more than a typical 15 year old girl. I think the biggest casualty of going wider is probably tight runs (trees and couloirs), not weight but I don’t really know.
Yep - gotta hype it one way or the other to keep moving product. And I *hate* that tone you're referring to, it bugs the shit out of me.Quote:
Originally Posted by bodywhomper
Word. Love it when you get comments on the lift w the same tone. Yet somehow it's never the guys on 'race room gs skis' skiing faster than me or my buddies...Quote:
Originally Posted by TahoeJ
Also x3 on getting the full on wildcat tour. Soft snow performance is worth the grams
Moment dominated as THE snowblade manufacturer for the Pain McShlonkey at Squaw on Saturday.
Per Moment's website:Quote:
Originally Posted by sruffian
W108 Tour in 190: 3.54 kg
W Tour in 190: 3.65 kg
Melee, is that right?? Seems odd that a ski ~10% smaller only weighs 3% less. Also, the W108 Tour copy says "The 108 version comes in at ten millimeters skinnier and almost a full pound lighter than its wider counterpart"
I am considering a W108 Tour for an everyday touring stick, but that weight differential has me curious.
Anyone have a review of the W108 Tour???
Hmm, I think the Govy has good amount of energy for being as wide as it is. Certainly more than a BG. Just need to load up that tail, takes a bit of speed or some mass.Quote:
Originally Posted by WhetherMan
Just gonna throw this out there.
WTB: longest Deathwish they make.
Okay, so loooooong time coming but just ordered my first pair of Moments... some Wildcat 108's. Mount them on the line? I'm generally a directional skier but I don't mind a healthy dose of tail rocker, so long as I can still drive the front of the skis. For perspective, my pow skis are Black Crows Nocta's and they're relatively forward mounted and I ski them on the line.
You get them at 184 or 190? I haven’t skied the 108s (not many people have) but I’ve skied OG Bibby’s in both 184 and 190 on the line and at +1 and I’ve always liked best on the line. Don’t think moving forward makes sense unless you spin and land switch and ton since they are already pretty quick as long as you have even a little speed.Quote:
Originally Posted by TahoeJ
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Got them in 184 so they’re a bit shorter for trees and bumps or whatever. My Noctas are 190. And yeah, if anything I’m wondering if I should mount behind the line, definitely not in front.Quote:
Originally Posted by PNW_Skier206
J - I skied some demo 108's in 190 and played around with the boot center. On the line was dialed. You can drive the tips old school style or ski neutral at that point - respond well to both
Thanks for that. More often than not I prefer to mount on the line as intended.Quote:
Originally Posted by sruffian
I mounted my OG Bibby's on the line and they ski just like sruffian says. Easy to drive the tips like a directional ski but they also work well in a more neutral body position. I think one of the greatest strengths of this ski is that it really lends itself to different skiing styles at the recommended line, which helps make it such a versatile ski. Just stay out of the backseat lol.
Been putting a lot of thought into this too, here's where Im at:Quote:
Originally Posted by meter-man
I have Bibby Tour 190s mounted with shifts as my deep snow or short tour ski. Are they kind of heavy? Yeah. Do I care? No. They are still way lighter inbounds bibby 190s mounted with pivot 18s, and Im a bigger dude so am able to carry the weight around. Ive done about 2000 -2500 vert days on these and havent felt worn out.
For longer tours, spring etc.., I would love to just ski the Bibby's but have them be lighter. Also would be nice to have them narrower for skin track and maneuvarability. They so freaking versatile and I feel so comfortable on them, I dont want to adjust to any other type of ski at this point. So I've decided on getting the Wildcat Tour 108 and mount them with some Zeds that I have.
Bibby Tour 190 + Shift: 1925 grams + 885 grams = 2810 grams
Wildcat 108 Tour 190 + Zed= 1770 grams +375 grams = 2145 grams
When you consider the weight of the whole combo, thats a savings 665 grams per foot, about 1.5 pounds per foot. Thats a fucking SOLID two ski touring quiver right there.
Jay mount them on the line. I mounted my tours +1 of line and like them better than -1 back of line.
Will do, especially since you know how I ski...Quote:
Originally Posted by roverdoc