If I remember right, the a-star and 4frnt ehp’s are kinda clones of each other. I’ve hoarded enough ehp’s that I still ski em regularly. Stated radius is 40m. Low long rocker and flat cambered. The thing is a pivot machine in tight spaces!
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If I remember right, the a-star and 4frnt ehp’s are kinda clones of each other. I’ve hoarded enough ehp’s that I still ski em regularly. Stated radius is 40m. Low long rocker and flat cambered. The thing is a pivot machine in tight spaces!
That all makes a lot of sense and explains why the skis I like don't exist new, mostly.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZomblibulaX
I don't actually ski that fast through chopped up crap - but I like what I like, and it seems that the burly straighter skis are what I like.
I had a the original Dynastar LP in a 186, IIRC, and that ski was fun - - it was like a damp Explosiv. Never tried the 105. Hmm...
Hell, ski resorts are so crowded that there are not many places to let a charger ride. I blame the death of the charger on the high speed lift.
As a modern freeride ski the Blade Optic 114 can be pretty chargy. It has some metal, but is fairly soft. Long, flat section underfoot and a long radius. It is a ski that I find myself approaching traffic really quickly on, but can be shut down in a hurry.
The longer Moment Countach has a similar feel, but is a bit more turny and lighter. Still stiff enough to throttle down on.
As soft snow skis, the Hoji skis are missiles. Fuck I had a blast Monday on the big Ren. Not a charger, but man they go fast. A perfect example of a long radius ski that can drift and turn on a dime.
I really want the FL105. I'll have a few beers one night and order it.
Metal is not overrated, it’s just doesn’t sell. There is no substitute for power and torsional stability.
Umm… the vast majority of skis sold at retail (outside the boutiques like moment or on3p) have metal in them. K2, Rossi, Nordica, Dynastar, Armada, Head, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by tenB
The cambered Corvus (old generation) checks all of the boxes for me. It would punish poor form but would obliterate anything in its path. Is still my favorite ski.
@halliday I was chatting with Bird once at the loup and he said something along the lines of “they killed the Corvus when they took the camber out of it”. I wonder what he thinks of the new one.
FWIW I am firmly a younger generation of skier, and used to desire an easier going ski. Lots of ski lessons taught me the joy of givin’ er the beans, and now I want one of the skis that is mentioned in this thread. Borrowed a friends 2012ish Katana at JHMR last year, eye opening.
I agree though that faster lifts have increased on slope crowding, thus making missiles a little scarier to drive in the weekend crowds. BUT it seems like most days the queues aren’t as long thanks to those faster lifts. Doubled edged sword, eh?
Maybe the solution to shifting big company ski design back to more skill oriented skis is forcing everyone to take lessons like I did?
Maybe we should all be grateful that HL and 4frnt exist, accepting that the big spenders are cool with being bad at skiing, and therefore the conglomerates will make skis for them and not us?
Just because it’s my dream for four glorious turns down the King doesn’t mean it’s everyone’s.
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Some evolution data of “stated” side cut (in big boy length obviously)
XXL - 41m!
LP105 - 27m
MPro108 - 22m
OG Cochise - 28.5m
Carbon Tip Cochise - 28m
Carbon Tip Cochise v2 - 27m
Cochise 106 - 26m
Anomaly 102 - 22.5m
I feel like over the course of the evolution these skis got a 15% haircut in top end in shitfuck condition charging while gaining A LOT of capability throughout the rest of the mountain.
What does that really mean? The OG Cochise or LP105 was like a 3 turn ski down Chair 23 at Mammoth or Northbowl at Palisades… The new versions are what? A 4 turn ski? But in return they aren’t boat anchors in pow (OG Cochise was a fucking submarine) or ankle snappers in tight trees (LP105 with metal bindings is like 10lb per foot….)
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For whatever it's worth, if you plug the MPro108 into a ski radius calculator, it comes out at about 27.5m.Quote:
Originally Posted by nickwm21
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Practically: Manufacturers recognize an aging core demographic that doesn't want a missile for everyday use
prolly this my lotus have the date 2011 on them
I had the el Dictators which are 43m. Powder mag called them absurd. They were great for North Baldy at The Bird on pow days. I gave them away for free on this board and no one took them so I threw them in the garbage about 10 years ago. These skis don't exist anymore because newer skis are more versatile and pro skiers have evolved to flipping spinning everything and as a result ski designers changed the skis for these new pro skiers. What I do love about new skis is how easy they are to land anything. Before there was a lot of shitty skis that didn't have enough in the tails to support a big landing. Now tails are generally softer all around and somehow these skis are much better for landings. Chup, if you are buying big stiff skis but never get them to a speed they were made for, it seems like you are buying the wrong tool for job. A ski like the Hotshot would work better - 19m turning radius with metal and very damp. Does short and long turns well and they are fun on groomers.
Not sure why you're plugging numbers into a calculator when SoothSki exists. They measured the M-Pro at 22.5m.Quote:
Originally Posted by toast2266
https://soothski.com/compare/?_value...=%22Compare%22
How is the calculator even calculating? Does it have inputs for taper length of the tips and tails?
Should I track down a Rossi RC112? I've never skied it. Were any of the narrower Phantom skis similar? I see there was a Phantom 108, which is ballpark the width I'm looking for.
I had the original Squads, which were a big improvement over the S7 / Super 7, but always felt a little short.
Trying to justify the HL purchase...
Seriously though, if you’re looking for a true modern charger, I’m not sure there’s a better ski out there right now than the FL105 in the big boy length.
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If you decide to go the RC112 route, shoot me a PM. I have a pair I've been trying to sell for a while. They're sitting at our local gear consignment shop but so far as I know I can grab them to sell myself. Here's the TGR Gear Trade link and SkiTalk link for pictures.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Chupacabra
That said, the HL stuff is fucking amazing. I'm skiing an R105 as my DD and it rips. I've also skied v1 of the FL105 and my recollection is it easily rivals the RC112 and in some ways is burlier than the 2011 Mantra I have for groomer zoomer days. Don't know how older Mantras slot in your personal charger ski taxonomy, but they're fairly high in mine.
Find some rc one twelves . Those things absolutely rip. I always liked them mounted +2. The phantom was an absolute garbage ski. It is stiff as fuck and has no tip rocker if that’s what you want.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Chupacabra
There is a 192cm 19/20 Legend Pro in the HL Outlet for $175. No idea if that is chargey enough for what you are after.Quote:
Originally Posted by El Chupacabra
https://heritagelabskis.com/products...44503961043132
188 R99 Comps there too as well as 194cm FL113s…..
Never skied them but I was about to post that they’re fully cambered I-beams. Lol’d when I hand flexed them a few years back.Quote:
Originally Posted by altacoup
And very traditional. Flat old school tail and like a -14.5 mount point
Tried to give away my xxls in the euro thread for a beer and no takers. Was going to drop them at the local thrift shop, but after reading this thread I might just keep them around for rock skis and fun days. The speed needed to get them to plain is hilarious, the shovels are as near to 90° as I've ever seen on skis. They like uboots with just the tips sticking out of snow. They are perfect for high alpine glacier terrain where you can just let them run.
At least we can all agree the Phatom SC108 was a terrible ski. It had like 10mm of camber. I had a pair of 195s given to me and promptly gave them away again.
Somebody mentioned up thread (can't quote because trgz is broke) that newer chargey skis have a 15% haircut on the top end of monster trucking chop at Mach Jesus and are more versatile everywhere else, but it is not true. That 15% reduction in performance feels like a hell of a lot more when you really need it, and the extra versatility most often leads to a ski that is overly turny, skittish at highway speeds, and vague to mushy when being hammered on.
Being an oversized human fond of big dumb skis, I still think the biggest problem is that there are no frontside skis of reasonable length with a longer radius. ~190/85-95mm/25m range. I think it is a crime. Just because there is no new snow does not mean I want to wiggle around and make a million turns. I want to push on a ski, force it in to shape and make turns count. Race skis have zero versatility, wide skis suck on hardpack.
Yeah, getting off topic, but it's crazy that >20m and <95mm skis basically don't exist. (Yes, HL).
My sister was just looking for an east coast all mountain ski, but she's small so needs a short ski, but she wanted a longer radius than the ~14m she currently had, and they just don't exists. She got Volkl Secret 88s, is stuck with a turn radius closer to a slalom ski than GS.
Totally. And the end result of that is she will angulate less and put less input in to the ski because otherwise it's going back uphill. Just shmarve around with the unwashed masses.
I want a bumper sticker that says Skiing Is Supposed To Be Hard.
God Damn kids these days and their windshield wiper turns!
Exactly, and she raced a little, nothing high level, but she can carve a GS turn.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZomblibulaX
Dude, heritage labs RC85 and RC95 are literally what you seek.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZomblibulaX
The 187 RC95 is the exception that proves the point. The reason HL exists is because no one was making the skis Marshal wanted anymore.I've got skis hoarded out the wazoo, but if there was a fire in my ski storage, I'd have one option to cover 80% of my skiing. That's sad. (But I'd snap up that R99 in the outlet in a heartbeat if I was waiting on an insurance check)
Kinda did a loop there.
Nobody makes these skis.
Except this guy who makes them.
But I don’t need them because I hoarded.
It's the lack of choice he's got a (valid) complaint about.
I have a pair of red tip one-eighty-four Kastle MX ninety-eights (R twenty-seven) I’m moving with Pivots. PM me
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Right, and for my sister I did head over to the HL site, but nothing for her. For myself, I bought the R87 Comp when it came out.Quote:
Originally Posted by McDee
This thread made me pick up a set of near mint a-stars for 170€ just to give them a try. Needs a remount to fit my clown shoes, so probably will have to wait till next season to get on them.