Just picked up a pair of 2018 193s. Gonna slap a Forza P15 on em and find out if they're the wide, versatile, metal laminate, variable conditions charger I seek. They look fun at the very least.Quote:
Originally Posted by SoVT Joey
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Just picked up a pair of 2018 193s. Gonna slap a Forza P15 on em and find out if they're the wide, versatile, metal laminate, variable conditions charger I seek. They look fun at the very least.Quote:
Originally Posted by SoVT Joey
Anybody know what the factory tune on the Mantra 102s is?
Pretty sure all non-race volkls are 2/1 side/baseQuote:
Originally Posted by sf
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cross post from the spring touring ski thread:
Quote:
Originally Posted by kid-kapow
Crazy that Volkl dumbed down the BMT94 with the 90. Now both have been discontinued. Would be interested in a rocker comparison since I may have to settle for a BMT90 if I see them available
BMT90s+109s return unchanged for 22/23 besides a new graphic (black with red/green lettering), as do KVWs and MVWs according to the local Völkl rep (same guy that said that they are working on a wider Blaze and mid-11x Revolt). Or, I've seen the various V Werks skis in next year's catalogue (I do not have it, looked at it in a store), so no ambiguity there.
But yes, it is crazy that they stopped making BMT94s. They are freaking magical.
BMT90s 177
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Mantra V Werks 178
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BMT90s have some slight camber underfoot. More or less identical to MVWs, or MVWs are rather the same as BMT90s ;)
BBMT94 186
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BMT122 176
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BMT94s have less rocker than 109s and 122s especially (which of course makes a ton of sense), and are pretty flat throughout. They are stiffer throughout than BMT90s too.
To post these again:
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Good to hear at least there are some BMTs coming back next year. I talked to a Volkl rep a few weeks ago who said no more BMTs at all next year but maybe that is just for the US market. The 90s are just so sad looking next to the 94s, so much more sidecut.. why.
They take yet another price hike though, so that could be why if they are not sold over yonder.Quote:
Originally Posted by Benneke10
BMT90s and MVWs are just a tad different skis than BMT94s. All are great, if for slightly different skiers. The most noticable difference is in their flex patterns though, not how their shapes make the behave as such - or at least, that is my experience thus far.
The general consensus is that BMT90s and MVWs should tour better for most users than BMT94s, though I do not think there is a lot of difference on the skin track between them to be honest. Especially BMT90s caters to a larger audience though, with people taking the step up from VTA/Rizes. BMT94s and MVWs are more niche.
Got to see an early pair of next year's Faction La Machine Mini. Why am I posting here? Well they are a directional, fully rockered lightweight touring ski, and our only hope for a BMT successor. Wasn't able to get a specific weight, and the 19m radius seems short but I'm still excited to try them next season.
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Good looking ski but lots of tip rocker, very very different than the BMT-94Quote:
Originally Posted by Benneke10
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Sharing some rocker profiles of the Blaze 94 in 186cm. Minimal camber and gradual tip and tail rocker. Weighed in at 1719g and 1714g.
I saw new BMT 94's for sale cheap back in 2019, wish I had grabbed them. I remember not finding much info about them online or IRL. Also the recommendation that they only be mounted with marker bindings...Wish I hadn't of worried about that BS. I remember reading to that the BMT's had voids in the core as part of the construction. I ran into similar voids when mounting my Blazes. There's probably better info about that on the web.
Mounted these up as a spring time tele ski for 50/50 inbounds/outtabounds.
@völkl How the hell is it possible to discontinue a ski such as the BMT94? Please bring it back! Yeah, you will probably sell relatively few at retail (because who the hell can afford BMTs at retail), but it will do wonders for generating hype ;)
edit: I'll even explain what I like so much about them: their relatively straight shape and stiffish flex pattern (most importantly in the shovels / in front of the bindings) mean that you can really pressure the skis without them initiating an abrupt turn (by the shovels bending a lot). That way, the harder you pressure the mid part, the more the skis turns. And with the tails being fairly supportive as well, the back half finishes the turn nicely (though, admittedly - without much pop when I ski them). As such, one can do massive GS turns where one carves soft snow at speed, without fear of the ski folding in half / launch you into a sudden, abrupt turn. As such #2, one can ski them with a centered, athletic stance just fine - one does not need to pressure the hell of of the shovels / ski them traditionally for them to turn.
BMT90s facilitate some of the same stance, but are a bit more prone to turn with their less supportive tails and wider shovels. Both are great skis though, but BMT94s are just fantastic.
Can someone who has skied both tell me what the difference is between the BMT series and the Blaze series? Because the look and sound and seem to spec pretty damn close except the blaze series seems to be cheaper?
I.e the rocker profiles posted above of the BMT 94 look remarkably similar to what I've seen posted for the blaze 94.
Found some new 184cm Volkl 121 Revolts for $549CDN….so $420US.
Got some lonely white Pivot 18s with 115mm brake that would work on these.
Got a $16k tax refund cause I dumped a ton into RRSPs….
Give me a good reason not to….
If I get to 10 valid reasons I won’t buy them.
Reason:
1. I have two other skis >120mm (Rens and BC120s),
2. ?
3. ?
PS the -2.8cm mount is perfect for me.
Lol... just buy them already. [emoji2957]Quote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
BMT 94 are true reverse camber, have more tip/tail taper, and a lot less sidecut.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty_J
The construction is also crazy damp for the weight. When I first bought mine I chose them over a M4 Mantra for resort use as the M4 had a very annoying tinny feel.
But Blaze 94 probably ski pretty close.
I've never seen or skied the blaze 94 but the 106 is as close to full reverse as you can get without being truly reverse... 1mm or less of camber and only directly under the bindings.Quote:
Originally Posted by turnfarmer
They really feel full reverse while I'm skiing them. And a lot cheaper.
And not katana damp, but not bad for the weight.
I would not expect the blazes and BMTs to ski THAT similarly, especially for heavier / stronger skiers or in denser snow. Like, they will both be directional skis from Völkl, so have a similar feel.
But, there are a few important design differences that I would assume would overplay the rocker line similarities
- shovel differences: blazes are a lot wider in the extremities, so the engage faster. This matters because of
- flex pattern differences: BMTs are stiffer in the extremeties, while Blazes (like newer Mantras) have this flex zone ahead of the toe. It is noticable.
But, will most skiers be able to tell that big of a difference? Probably not. This is probably me wanting something specific out of a ski in order to ski it how I would like to. From a theoretical standpoint the reverse camber, carbon heavy yet damp, relatively straight shape of the BMT seems like a better solution than the pintail, very wide shovels with flex zone Blazes - at least for how I ski.
If one understands how these differences will affect how a ski skis, then I would think that one could extrapolate how they would feel similar, yet be quite different. So def same family, but not twins.
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and yes, I know that those graphics are representative of a ski within a range, but still informative.
^^^ thanks for your feedback on this... appreciate it.
I mounted my blaze +2cm... maybe that somewhat accounts for the wider tip? I actually kind of see that as a benefit in how I ski... but I see what you are saying.
Either way... they never felt hooky to me at all. But I've also never skied anything BMT. I did buy some really cheap BMT 122s recently but they won't see snow until next winter.
Get them already - they and you should be a great fit. And besides, it seems like a tall order to sell them at a loss if you decide to move them along after trying them, so no real downside here :)Quote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
yeah, I do not want to come across as too sure of the analysis here - it is just a take on two very good lines of skis.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty_J
I agree in that that they are more similar than different, but where a few of the differences make for quite the potential difference in how they sk in certain conditions (the differences that makes a difference, #cognitivepsychology ;) ).
Congrats on getting a pair of BMT122s - those are freaking great imho annd should compliment your Blazes super well. Lots and lots more rocker than the narrower versions, but oh so fun in deep soft snow. The faster you go the funner they become imho.
These arrived today…..new 184cm 121 Revolts. So much rocker and tip/tail splay. I know I’m gonna love these! Basically as un-M102/K108 like as you can get. Perfect.Quote:
Originally Posted by kid-kapow
PS - now have 3 skis >120mm in the quiver:
184cm 4FRNT Renegades with Duke PTs, 184cm Bentchetlers with Shifts, and now these 184cm Revolts (which I’ll be mounting with white Pivot 18s).
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Rad! That graphic sorta reminds me of the old SL Racetigers mixed w/ somthing from the mighty boosh. The 22/23 r121 graphic reminds me of the whole theme the Volkl freeride line had going around the mid-late aughts. I'd like it if they brought top sheet art back to the Katana/Mantra/Kendo.
While they have way more splay, the M102 and K108 have a lot of rockerQuote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
I hear ya….I meant tip/tail splay.Quote:
Originally Posted by Benneke10
My point is (for me) I’m gonna go “Hell yeah” when I go to grab the Revolts.
Never felt that with the M102 or K108. I’m not sure I would ever feel that way on a -11cm mounted ski. So am glad I have the Revolts.
PS I think I’m going with this combo:
Attachment 415823
^^^ any camber on those or mostly dead flat?
Yes to camber. A healthy amount. Def not flat. Which I’m happy about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty_J
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^ I love the profile & tapered tip on those!
Yeah... I guess you've got full reverse covered in the fat part of your quiver.Quote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
Will be very curious to hear your thoughts on these. Have 193 Shiros in the quiver and enjoy those on deep days. Had some 196 Two's a few years back. Loved them in blower, but they fell apart when it got heavy/dense. Something between the two of those skis might be worth a look for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
Bandit - I’ll let you know on the Revolt 121s next December….who knows what my ski quiver will look like by then!Quote:
Originally Posted by Bandit Man
Where ya'll mounting the revolt 121? Mount point looks pretty center
Good question. Will be researching that. Rec appears to be around -2 to -3 cm per the Blister measurement?Quote:
Originally Posted by PeachesNCream
I’m going there or -1 cm back. I think anything further back than -3.8cm would mean you’re on the wrong ski.
They have deeper rocker than my BC 120’s.
Yeah, I think it's technically 2.8 cm back. Will be curious to hear what you end up with. Surprised more people haven't been on this skiQuote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
Not a screamer, but hard to find these on sale. I picked up my pair of 184 with demo bindings from a local seller recently :)
2022 M6 Mantra - 191 cm, $500 (Lone Pine): https://lonepinegearx.com/collection...6-mantra-882cf
Ian Mac skis them 1.5 back. I haven't skied them but anybody at our shop much prefers them 2-3cm back. We've even had customers ask for remounts back from recommended.
Ruby Mountain Heli skiing getting rid of a bunch of volkls:
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...2111112l%22%7D
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Thanks for the thread. Enjoying hearing the reviews and learning from the discussion. I have the ONE & 100Eights both mounted with Shifts and love both. Resort & toured both with great enjoyment. I don't get out a ton being a flat lander in the midwest but love learning from those that get out much more!! Im addicted and keep adding to the quiver!
Or K118 (with traditional mount), sign me up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sylvan
Isn't that the volkl confession that never really took off?Quote:
Originally Posted by 1000-oaks
https://blisterreview.com/gear-revie...lkl-confession
Interesting, for some reason I thought those had a progressive mount and ignored them. Will keep an eye on Craigslist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty_J