Printable View
Not the standard wildcat, but the tourQuote:
Originally Posted by whereiscarlos
the 121 in the 185cm is a much stiffer, and center mounted ski than the Bibby Tour/Wildcat Tour in the 184cm.
I would also argue it tracks a bit better in mixed, but its also a much heavier layup
That's aligned with my thinking. I loved the Volkl Two/Revolt 124 in the 196-cm length but it was a pure pow tool and fell apart when the snow got heavy. The Revolt 121 seems like an evolution of that ski with a better inbounds demeanor. I don't need more skis over 120-mm, but I love the idea of how these could perform at a place like Whistler-Blackcomb.Quote:
Originally Posted by SnakeMagnet
Bandit - I have the 184cm Revolt 121, and you always seem to ski longer lengths than me. Go with the 191cm. The centerish mount on the Revolt, and the massive tip/tail rocker + taper means these will ski short. And yes will be awesome inbounds at WB or Whitewater.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bandit Man
As for too many wide skis….I have Renegades, Bentchetler 120s and Nomad 115s….but am most excited to ski the Revolts. Likely selling the Nomad 115s.
Shameless gear pic…..unmounted, just to to show the Forza 2.0 Pivot 15 colors on the Revolt 121s
Attachment 427190
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
Attachment 427205
121s with Forza 1.0
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
Nice! Where’d ya mount? On the line (-2.75cm)?Quote:
Originally Posted by tharmor
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
I snagged them second hand from someone who had mounted them with pivots on the “team” line which is extremely forward of what I was used to. Hasn’t bothered me one bit. Also, these are the 184cm. I wouldn’t be afraid of stepping up to the 191cm at all.
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
Lots of deals on last season’s 184’s. 191’s on the other hand, are just hard to find, let alone for a nice price.
This deal isn’t horrible plus the pivots are purdy:
Volkl Revot 121 with Look Pivot 18s https://classifieds.ksl.com/listing/69030851
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
I’m on a wildcat tour as well, so this is super helpful. Did you find the 121’s mount point pretty intuitive coming off the wildcat or was it a big adjustment? I assume you mounted both on the recommended line?Quote:
Originally Posted by rfconroy
Quote:
Originally Posted by whereiscarlos
the 121 is more surfy than the Bibby/Wildcat, and did take a tad more time to get used to. If you look at how Marcus skis on the 121...its kind-of how you need to ski it: drive hard, break the tails free to shut down speed, with very stiff tails for supportive landings. I only have a handful of days on each and it wasn't directly back to back. I will say that I am far more comfortable on a slightly softer skis like the reckoner 122, BO118/Gamer, and 2nd gen Atomic BC - I felt that as a non-pro skier, I was able to get into the flex pattern of those skis easier.
The 104 Revolts arrived today.
The minimal 2-3mm camber, combined with the amount of long rocker is fucking beautiful. Like the Sickle reincarnated but with 2mm of camber.
Last pic shows the length of the rocker when skis decambered.
Decided on Gold Pivot 15s on these.
Attachment 427302
Attachment 427303
Attachment 427304
Attachment 427305
Attachment 427307
Attachment 427308
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
I've thought of those. Much prefer that graphic to the current yellow ones.Quote:
Originally Posted by tharmor
Those look sweet.Quote:
Originally Posted by kc_7777
https://www.snowcountry.eu/23-volkl-...4aAiNWEALw_wcB
im even tempted at that price. $513 for this years. And that topsheet is way better. BM, buy those so I can buy them from you.
Dang, dude. Why'd you have to find those? May not be able to resist at that price and the ability to test mount points. This one is still the best topsheet though this year's is a significant improvement from the yellow ones. Very curious how these would compare to a Kartel 118 or MFree 118.Quote:
Originally Posted by SoVT Joey
While I love my older Billy Goat 191s for mobbing PNW powder, but I always have fond memories of how fun my '12 Bent Chetlers were. Those skis were a blast but were missing the backbone needed for the PNW. These sound like they could be the needed upgrade.
wow that is a smoking deal, more so when you could probably get $60 for the clamps...Quote:
Originally Posted by SoVT Joey
My top sheets on that graphic/year ski has not held up with. Tends to splinter quite a bit, rather than chip like most. Figured I'd offer my two center before someone gets fully in-bed with these.
You should by these and let me try them at Alpy.Quote:
Originally Posted by phatty
... What's your BSL... more than welcome to borrow mine for a dayQuote:
Originally Posted by Bandit Man
So has anyone come to a conclusion concerning a rocker 2 122 (2013-2017) comparison?
I have seen the light concerning central Stance and the mixture of playful yet stable and was wondering if this could be the next ski I could be hoarding. Although the 191 is hard to get and vökl is not a Partner of my gear access point.
I’ve had a hard time liking the 121 in a 191 mounted at -1. Tip dive for me. Which is an unpardonable sin for a ski this wide. Gonna remount with pivots slightly rearward for a flatter ramp and another shot.
Call me crazy, I actually dig the yellow fox topsheet[emoji7].
But for deep days, billy goat, C&D and sgn urrakkar were all way more fun last season.
Still interested in a revolt 104. Honestly think I would mount that on the line and use it for park and firm days.
Just had way too much fun on moment frankenskis last year.
hm, interesting. I must admit to be particularly interested in how they compare to the urRakkars :)Quote:
Originally Posted by SupreChicken
Weird that the tips won't plane given the flex pattern/rocker lines, but then again -3.8 isn't exactly traditionally mounted. The other two skis are -6 and -9 or so no?
Yes. And I don’t eff with the mount on an RES ski.Quote:
Originally Posted by kid-kapow
The rocker lines are fairly steep and abrupt. I’m becoming a fan of longer more subtle rocker for deep snow.
Urrakkar are recommended -7. I’ve found -5.5 to be perfect. I was hoping the volkl would be the similar feeling but more versatile version of that ski.
For me, nothing compares to that in deep snow. C and D has its moments, but I’m most comfortable and brazen on the urrakkar.
hm, thanks for the info - perhaps I should try some urRakkers then. I sold my pair before trying them, but most people seem to get on well with them.Quote:
Originally Posted by SupreChicken
The 185s are soft though - especially in the shovels (something I am not a big fan of usually), so I can't really see them replacing BGs for coastal snow / variable. I did buy a pair of lotus124s (catch, try, release was the plan there) that are fairly damn soft in the shovels as well, though their tails are a fairly supportive.
Sure, I'll chime in on that.Quote:
Originally Posted by subtle plague
I've gotta pair of the Rocker 2 122 184 for my early season rock pow skis that I picked up to replace my thrashed and worn out 2013 183 Chetlers.
I got a pair of the 1st year Revolt 121 184 to use as my main pow skis. I'm not sure exactly where I mounted but it's more back and traditional than a new school center mount.
Had a great time on 'em up in BC & Colorado in Jan 2020 but don't think I used 'em once in the crappy 20-21 Tahoe winter.
Last year in the big Christmas storm cycle, for me they ski'd great in the untracked but found I didn't really like 'em once it was tracked. I started grabbing the Rocker 2s, found them to be easier, more versatile and preferred them to the Revolts. I'm not a big guy and will be 60 next year so some of this might be my lazy old man preferences.
Well, there goes my desire for a 191 Revolt 121. Appreciate the inputs, SC. Hope to see you out on the hill this season.Quote:
Originally Posted by SupreChicken
To me, the only explanation for a ski that wide and with that much rocker having tip dive, is progressive mount point.
Or not enough speed maybe.
Sent from my SM-A536W using Tapatalk
If you're that far forward on a mount i think anything resembling forward pressure is going to cause dive. The revolts sound like they need a neutral stance, you just have so much tail staying afloat, basically anti-pintail.
I’ve skied with SupreChicken. We ski the same home mountain. He’s pretty skilled and skis faster than I do. But our mountain has a lot of tight quarters so maybe there isn’t room to get them up to “planing speed”? 🤷
Reading this with interest.
I skied the Faction Candide 5.0 at -4.7cm. No tip dive.
Have mounted my 2022 Bentchetler 120s at -2cm, or -4.9cm as I will mostly use those in untracked backcountry pow.
Most of my other wide skis are at -6cm (Renegades, Nomad 115s, Hojis)….
Leaning to -1cm to - 2cm on my Revolt 121s. They have more rocker than BentChetler 120s?
Anyone else wanna chime in. Mounting soon.
Attachment 428340
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
Yeah I really didn't doubt his speed... I think central mounts are more the problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bandit Man
I really like my rocker2s but sometimes get tip dive in certain snow despite all the rocker and width.
I honestly felt like I had less tip dive on mildly rockered and stiffer K108 last year when I got them in powder. -10cm vs -5cm.
KC might be appalled to hear that I'm going to remount the Pro-tos I bought from him on the line.... -9cm. [emoji6][emoji38]
Sent from my SM-A536W using Tapatalk
Maybe a bit of column a and b here. Central mount for sure. I feel like I’m really backseat before they plane. Speed/steep slope was pretty fun, but that was just all slash and turn. Pointing them was difficult. And demanded less speed because I couldn’t ride in the front seat.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty_J
I dig the bent chetler in soft snow. But it’s definitely better when the snow is dry and light. I’m at -4.4cm from the line and would move them back if I had another shot at it. Heavy snow needs heavier skis. For PNW I thought the revolt 121 would be the sweet spot for mass in a jibby ski and the mount with my skiing style just wasn’t quite right at -1 on wardens.
So…if the ramp is totally flat (pivots) and I’m back another cm…they’ll be awesome…right??
Quote:
Originally Posted by SupreChicken
i wonder if your tip dive is caused by being to flat on the ski and using upper body mass to start your turn. I had tip dive issues because I couldn’t get forward on a flat delta angle binding to initiate a turn, so I would make up by getting more forward with my body position, which in turn would take the ski out of balance and submarine the tips.
i did grow up racing on pivots, all the way through the academy. I have more control, better feel, better turn initiation, and a damper ride on markers. They work for me physiologically better due to the delta and with the ramp of a lange it’s perfect for me. I am 100% balanced standing in bindings on skis with knees flexed.
Wow. That was an eye-opening read.
I’ve always been an STH/driver guy with Lange. Only kinda hate marker bulk/mass. Just bought my first pivots. (I’m 46.)
And now am incredibly curious.
It’s amazing that we can spend our lives in a routine only to potentially be up-ended with another perspective.
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
The main takeaway for me last season was how much better I ski with pivots / low delta bindings and upright stance boots.Quote:
Originally Posted by SoVT Joey
I remounted a pair of woodsman116s from shifts to pivots to sth16s, and with the former and latter it was like I could not ski the ski - the tails felt overly stiff, while they were easy as can be with pivots. I had the same experiene with Woodsman102/110s, Tectons and Hawx XTDs -> I couldn't make them work for the life of me. The Tecton/Hawx combo worked well for me when I primarily skied Shifts on my resort skis with the same boots, but the difference was too big after moving to Lange/Pivots.
I remember mr Ellsworth somewhat smugly harping on about how nobody in the binding round table discussion at the Blister Summit mentioned binding delta as something they were even mindful of - supposedly proving what I assume to be his point of delta being something people whine about on forums, but not something that factors into how people are able to ski. What utter fucking nonsense. And glasses are only for people who are not trying hard enough eh?
So, I would not be terribly surprised if moving back a cm and shifting to Pivots will transform how they ski. It would for me, at my short bsl at 293 (aka short bsl, delta matters more = larger angle change).
Interesting. I’m 306mm and sensitive enough to binding ramp that I shim my tecton toes.
Also my urrakkar’s have pivots
All of this is making me feel even better about skiing demo bindings. I think I could probably get used to various binding deltas of different bindings, but if different delta affects the ideal mount location, why would I confine myself to my first guess of mount location?
And I can feel the difference in 0.5cm of mount point.
Sent from my SM-A536W using Tapatalk
All of you guys are spot on with what I was driving at. Physiology is the main factor when choosing boots and bindings. The best tell for me was, as insane as this sounds, was putting my boots on, clicking into my bindings on my carpet in the living room with a mirror to my side. I stood in position that my setup was putting me in and took notes on my athletic stance. While in that stance you should be the most balanced, if you feel off balance it’s time to start tweaking. You can change you ramp with strips of duck tape on the toe/heel to start to drive your stance. A strip of regular duck tape is about 1mm. You should also be able to be pushed by someone while you are in your skis on flat ground and barely be effected or have the ability to catch your balance quickly.
yeah, I have been putting off shiming the skis I have mounted with vipecs / tectons :)Quote:
Originally Posted by SupreChicken
and to be clear - I am thinking the main factor that can change how they feel is ramp angle, not the mount point - though going back a cm can't hurt.
To be fair, I am an old football / soccer player, so about as flexible and nimble as a 2x4. My relative lack of mobility is rather pathetic really. If you are more able to bend your joints from your hips down then ramp angle might not be as big of a factor as it is for me.
Thanks. I like the rocker 2 versatility and yet they are stable at speed. My favorite ski so far.Quote:
Originally Posted by powpig