How close together can you drill binding holes?

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Originally Posted by DropCliffsNotBombs

Plug the old holes and use helicoils or inserts were there is overlap with the new holes. Then your boot will be in the correct position. Simple.

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So you're saying the wood plug and epoxy will bond to the ski well enough that it will hold the insert no prob right? How long/hard have you skied on the skis you've done this too? Thanks for your feedback Joebornstein

I think I'll only need to do this on the front two screws for the front piece of the Kingpins. I think I can get fresh holes everywhere else.

[QUOTE=XXX-er;4844995] I have used FG & 24hr epoxy to fix spinners with 100% success

Sorry I'm dumb. Like the stuff you'd use for a canoe repair... those FG woven sheets?

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Originally Posted by 1000-oaks

Model boat building supply websites have 4mm hardwood dowel if you want to cut your own tight-fitting plugs (I use a Dremel with a cutoff wheel). It is kind of time consuming though.

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Bamboo chopsticks, stick the end in a pencil sharpener for a second or two.

This might help visualize the process (use of super glue not withstanding). Some of this is a bit over the top for plugging a ski hole.

https://youtu.be/vgtgcIlFGrs

... Thom

[QUOTE=Ride_a_Yeti;4846965] .

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Originally Posted by XXX-er

I have used FG & 24hr epoxy to fix spinners with 100% success

Sorry I'm dumb. Like the stuff you'd use for a canoe repair... those FG woven sheets?

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yes I use the FG woven cloth you don't need much, cut it into 1/2 inch strands, I wet the FG out with 24hrs epoxy but make sure it is not too rich, some of these ideas are a race to the bottom as to how sketchy one can you go and not have a failure ... this^^ is as low as I am willing to go

Usually if I am plugging holes I just use the plastic plugs you hammer in, I have used golf tee's and the like to plug holes its just a pain in the ass making them the correct size, you can also just buy 3 ft of hardwood dowel from most HW stores for a few bucks
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I don't know if it did/will help, but doing a remount for a friend that wanted the binding where the new holes just touched the old ones I dropped helicoils in after plugging the holes with epoxy and wood, figuring those might give some extra holding power.

[QUOTE=Ride_a_Yeti;4846965]So you're saying the wood plug and epoxy will bond to the ski well enough that it will hold the insert no prob right? How long/hard have you skied on the skis you've done this too? Thanks for your feedback Joebornstein

I have skied skis with multiple overlapping holes in several world tour big mountain competitions. I'm only 145 lbs. though....

Thanks all. The youtube vid is helpful. All comments are helpful. I think I'm going to fill the old holes with epoxy as XXX-er suggests AND move forward a CM. Although watching through this youtube vid I'm still considering overlapping...

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Originally Posted by Ride_a_Yeti

Thanks all. The youtube vid is helpful. All comments are helpful. I think I'm going to fill the old holes with epoxy as XXX-er suggests AND move forward a CM. Although watching through this youtube vid I'm still considering overlapping...

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I think you're over thinking this. Fill holes with wood/fg and epoxy. Drill where you want and IF you get a spinner put in a helicoil.

That's what I did! Worked - thanks

BUMP!! for:

So I have some E98s, to mount the bindings where I want them, I'm going to get some overlap in two of the holes. The skis have a metal layer in them and require a tap. I want to try this method:

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Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn

I think you're over thinking this. Fill holes with wood/fg and epoxy. Drill where you want and IF you get a spinner put in a helicoil.

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Any special considerations or better technique for the metal or the tap? I'm going to be overlapping by maybe even more than 1/2 over, will a guide/press be mandatory? Will I die if I attempt this?

Thanks!

well you are American therefore I will offer thots and prayers which is good as anything for an app that may or may not work

I think it all depends on how low you think you can go, hell somebody on tech tips mounted a toe piece with 2 sided carpet tape for a season

This thread is old enough that I hadn't discovered using the Bamboo BBQ skewers to fill screw holes, available in most supermarkets

They're virtually impossible to find, but I started using aluminum #12AB screws epoxied into screw holes in situations where there's overlap and it's a high-stress screw location (like the front screws on toes). Epoxy in, hacksaw off, grind flush with topsheets. Basically you end up with threaded metal plugs that sure as hell won't be pulling out.

Drill new holes and be sure to tap, so your new binding screws mesh with the aluminum plugs.

Another vote for epoxy/pound in tapered hard wood plugs. Shave down flush. Hell you can even countersink them alittle and level top sheet with epoxy for water proofing and then overlap all day long. I have observed better bite than original core in this scenario.

Have used golf tees in the past but they need sanding thinner which is a pain.
Found these today. 4mm thick which should be perfect in a binding hole. I assume its a fairly soft wood but could be better than bamboo. Figured for 2.99 I'd give them a try next time I'm plugging holes.
Attachment 253883

Good info in this thread.

https://www.tognar.com/binding-hole-plugs-wood/

Get these. super easy. super hard and pretty cheap. It will compress the core around them when tapped in and make for a bomber mount

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Originally Posted by 1000-oaks

They're virtually impossible to find, but I started using aluminum #12AB screws epoxied into screw holes in situations where there's overlap and it's a high-stress screw location (like the front screws on toes). Epoxy in, hacksaw off, grind flush with topsheets. Basically you end up with threaded metal plugs that sure as hell won't be pulling out.

Drill new holes and be sure to tap, so your new binding screws mesh with the aluminum plugs.

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Nice!

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So, to sum things up.. How close together can you drill binding holes? Depends on how solidly you plug the old holes and how good your jig and drilling skills are.

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Originally Posted by SumJongGuy

Depends on how solidly you plug the old holes and how good your jig and drilling skills are.

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That's what she said...

best practises is 1 cm or 1/2 inch but then somebody always posts something they did that wasn't best practises and it worked altho we don't really hear about things that don't work

so what we really need is a thread titled "fucked things I done on my ski mount "

Years ago I bought some Praxis freerides of of someone here. I mounted them way back from the recommended line and had an overlap on two of the four screws. Can’t remember if they were in the heels or toes. I used BF inserts on those 4 screws and they worked fine. There was the tiniest portion of the original holes which fell outside of the inserts diameter

wow that ^^ there is a Gem, the depth of technical info is a game changer, I feel like I should pay pal you my first born male child

Is there anything really technical going on here? I read about 10mm, or 7mm of hole separation being ideal. I read about using bamboo squewers as plugs. Bs about chopped fg strands helping. Please. The only really good tip so far is using aluminum screws and then using a tap to cut that screw. . I used a short, stiff machine bit in a drill press to slightly overlap a hole for an insert and you come up with that response? My point was that the greater area of the insert probably gave comparable or greater pull out strength than the original mount despite the ever so slight overlap

probably, I can't remember, could you repeat the question ?

😀. No

So : these metal inserts are going to be bomber right ? ;-)

Attachment 254280

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Originally Posted by Scottish_Skier

So : these metal inserts are going to be bomber right ? ;-)

Attachment 254280

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If you'd have done the remount a few mm further forward then the brass insert could have emcompassed the plugged hole.

I'd never trust one of those knock-in inserts, especially in a light Movement core and when it's cutting in to a plastic plug.

^^ pound in insert? Think I may trust a heli-coil more... and a drilled, tapped amd screwed in insert even more than that. Although thats an opinion based purely on speculation with no real data.

Appears to be slightly in, but bumping a .5cm forward may have helped with placement there, especially in a ski with no metal?

Seems like it would be just a whole lot easier to use the same binding and boot size as the previous owner. Boots too big? 2 pairs of socks. Boots too small and hurt? Suck it up buttercup!

^ yip : above photo is certainly far from ideal.
however given it is front screws and on heel (rather than toe) think I am happy to take a punt on them...
agree that with benefit of hindsight that encompassing front hole would have been good option.

How close together measured from hole center to hole center can inserts be installed?

necro bump... but seemed appropriate instead of starting a new thread. I don't think this specific question was answered.

7 mm

Black Diamond tested this. Their results show up in a Google search.

Attachment 509660

I’ve used 7 mm with no issue.

That test didn’t include plugging/epoxying the abandoned holes. I have never had an issue with pullout even when the new hole touches a properly plugged abandoned hole.


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Originally Posted by MyNameIsAugustWest

That test didn’t include plugging/epoxying the abandoned holes. I have never had an issue with pullout even when the new hole touches a properly plugged abandoned hole.


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Same. G Flex epoxy and hard wood plugs for the win. I’m still skiing on some Swiss cheesed skis with hole over lap to be right on the recommended line, no issues.


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Dude, I've drilled holes sooo close together that it looked like there was only one hole!

I'm cool with overlapping holes after plugging with wood and epoxy... Been there done that.

My question is how close together can binding freedom or quiver killer inserts be installed?

Perhaps that's been answered and I missed it

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I think inserts could be touching with no problems.


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Originally Posted by MyNameIsAugustWest

That test didn’t include plugging/epoxying the abandoned holes. I have never had an issue with pullout even when the new hole touches a properly plugged abandoned hole.


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Yeah, weird test.

Both the old and new screws should have been glued (might strengthen up the wood fibers so you gotta do both holes) and the old holes should have at least been plastic-plugged (but really wood+epoxy which is what anyone would do if mounting that close).

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Originally Posted by skinipenem

I'm cool with overlapping holes after plugging with wood and epoxy... Been there done that.

My question is how close together can binding freedom or quiver killer inserts be installed?

Perhaps that's been answered and I missed it

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Take your time and use a slow set epoxy. I use Hardman 72 hour orange and if you get everything set and screw in loosely you should be good. Every 6-8 hours give a little more on the screw in and things will line up pretty good. Ive remounted with overlapping holes filled with plastic plugs and Hardman epoxy and it worked out. Take your time. Let the epoxy do its job. Ive done some re mounts where people have used fast set epoxy and it didn't work out too good. The fast set stuff seems brittle and does not have the flex. The longer the set time, the better the mount.