Take that, Barry Bonds

Quote:

---

Just curious, are you one of the people who booo's Barry when he steps up to the plate, then boo's the pitcher when they fail to pitch to him?

---

no, what made u think that?

Quote:

---

so name a few player where there is PROOF that they didn't use anything illegal? or show where baseball activley enforced the rules?babe ruth was a cokehead, alcoholic, drunk driving, woman abusing fool... hate him too?

---

anyone that hasnt tested positive since testing has been enforced. even that doesnt say much because of masking agents. theyre actively enforcing testing right now, what are you talking about? there are penalties for testing +. with the exception of women abusing(not sure where you came up with that) did u read it in the NY daily news? , why would i care what he did off the baseball field? it didnt make him a better player.

why dont u think palmeiro or sosa play anymore? u think they stopped just all of a sudden b/c they couldnt hack it anymore? they knew they couldnt play at the level they used to play when they used steroids. are u from san fran? why the love for barry?

yeah barry is quite the family man himself. did u know he had mistress(s)? did u know he bought one of them a house in cash to shut her up? and she has a book coming out on bonds about all the illegal shit he has done. did u know he is being investigated for tax evasion? apparently you cant make $80,000 by signing baseballs and not report it. weird.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

are u from san fran? why the love for barry?

---

My understanding is that even Giants fans are kind of embarrassed by Barry these days.

I'm a life long die-hard Giants fan and will be in enemy territory tonight rooting for my team and Barry! I got to see Willie Mays play when I went to my first game in 1971 and grew up watching Willie McCovey & Bobby Bonds. When the Giants were on the brink of moving to Tampa in 1992, I was thrilled when the new ownership group came in and not only saved the team but signed Barry Bonds. He is the most amazing player it has ever been my privilege to watch play the game I love. The guy has a flair for the dramatic you wouldn't believe if you read it in a storybook. I was there for #s 71 & 72,#600, #660, #700, his first game back last year when he hit a ringing 2B off the top of the wall in his first AB back, countless other game saving catches and game winning HRs, and hopefully tonight #714.
Is Bonds a jerk? Don't know, never met the man. He likes his privacy and doesn't like the media so they don't like him and they were tearing him down & writing shit about him long before the Bud era. If you choose to believe everything you read in the media, good for you. Yes the evidence seems to indicate the man has used steroids. But the evidence is circumstantial and flimsy at best, I don't believe he'll ever be convicted of anything steroid related, he's never tested positive and in America he's innocent until proven guilty. Except in the arena of public opinion where the only thing we enjoy more than building up our idols is tearing them down. As a Giants fan & Barry Bonds fan I'm just more willing than most to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Since the dawn of MLB and probably all competitive sports, athletes have always looked for an edge. I grew up watching Gaylord Perry too. He was a lovable character, but also probably the most famous cheater to ever play the game. Everybody knew he threw the spitter but we'd all just knowingly wink and nod at his unhittable dancing and diving junkballs that propelled him to the HOF. Is it hypocrisy to be outraged at Bonds but not Perry?
The best analogy I heard was this:
For the past 10 years, the "Steroid Era", all of MLB has been gorging at the roid dinner table. Big Mac, Sosa & Palmeiro all left early, only Bonds is left. The last guy at the table always gets the bill.

GO GIANTS!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

anyone that hasnt tested positive since testing has been enforced. even that doesnt say much because of masking agents. theyre actively enforcing testing right now, what are you talking about?

---

barry has tested positive?

Quote:

---

barry has tested positive?

---

noo...u asked me who hasnt used steroids and i said anyone who hasnt tested positive.

Quote:

---

Is Bonds a jerk? Don't know, never met the man. He likes his privacy and doesn't like the media so they don't like him and they were tearing him down & writing shit about him long before the Bud era.

---

if he hated the media so much, why would he have his own show on espn2, Bonds on Bonds? its funny b/c he picked and chose everyone for the show and he has the power to cut and edit whatever he wants to be aired and yet he still comes off as an arrogant jerk.

Quote:

---

Yes the evidence seems to indicate the man has used steroids. But the evidence is circumstantial and flimsy at best

---

the guy's trainer was head of the balco ring. how is that flimsy? thats like being married to a mobster and not thinking the money you have is dirty.

Quote:

---

he's never tested positive and in America he's innocent until proven guilty

---

you're right, except he admitted to taking a substance and putting it under his tongue claiming it wasnt steroids.

Quote:

---

Except in the arena of public opinion where the only thing we enjoy more than building up our idols is tearing them down

---

what other idols have the public built up and then torn down? (in baseball)

Quote:

---

Is it hypocrisy to be outraged at Bonds but not Perry?

---

the difference between bonds and perry is that its happening NOW, when something can be done. perry doesnt play now, either does mcgwire or sosa or palmeiro, thas why their records stand. what are u gonna do take pete rose's records after he was kicked out of baseball?

Quote:

---

Big Mac, Sosa & Palmeiro all left early, only Bonds is left. The last guy at the table always gets the bill.

---

thats b/c he is so arrogant. he knows he wont get busted.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

the difference between bonds and perry is that its happening NOW, when something can be done. perry doesnt play now, either does mcgwire or sosa or palmeiro, thas why their records stand. what are u gonna do take pete rose's records after he was kicked out of baseball?

---

He's playing now, but he isn't testing positive. The home run record happened 5 years ago, why is that one under scrutiny? Would you take away your asterisk or critisism if he stopped playing today?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by runethechamp

He's playing now, but he isn't testing positive. The home run record happened 5 years ago, why is that one under scrutiny? Would you take away your asterisk or critisism if he stopped playing today?

---

all those guys are under scrutiny and all their records. its not my asterisk, its the mlb's, but no i wouldnt. i believe he and all those guys cheated and therefore should be criticized.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by marshalolson

babe ruth was a cokehead, alcoholic, drunk driving, woman abusing fool... hate him too?

---

Yup I can't believe the bastard had the nerve to come back to bean town and play for the braves

The Babe did blow??? who sez?


The Hall of Fame was a big dissapointment for me, and a focal point of that letdown was the Babe Ruth "corner", as I call it. I have never seen so many pictures of the wife. It's as though the Cooperstown nerds are trying to whitewash Babe's legendary party rep. Just pics of him and the wife and pics of him with kiddies smiling. yeah, right.
But the wife was cute. Like to see some naked pics.

talk about bringing down baseball idols. more importantly, the man who made the game what it is. show me a current player who has over 700 home runs, lead the AL in homeruns 12 years in a row, and has won 65 games in 3 years as a pitcher with a 2.28 career era.

i know nothing about ruth's rumors of a man, but bonds is no savior and no idol on or off the field.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

bonds is no savior and no idol on or off the field.

---

dude is a quality father, that genuinely loves his family, and brings them to all of his games. i see him as a standup guy that gives all that he has 100% of the time.

say what you will about "tax evasion" but not reporting 80,000 when you make 20mil or whatever ain't shit. sounds like a mistake to me. do you think barry is maliciously trying to screw the government out of a thousand dollars? wtf?

Quote:

---

noo...u asked me who hasnt used steroids and i said anyone who hasnt tested positive.

---

so since barry has not tested positive, he hasn't used steroids? your logic there ace. plus, i can tell you he ain't on the juice NOW, nor would i susspect he had been on it KNOWINGLY in the recent past, as there is so much to loose. his numbers have not fallen off at all, othere than injuries. but fuck, he's 42

hate all you want, but he has accomplished one of the great achievements in all of sport, and i say congratulations. he also truly appreciates the gravity of his achievement, and really respects all of those that he has passed.

ps: benny, read some babe bio's... some of the revisionist stuff published 5-10 yrs ago is really interesting. THAT dude was a nasty as they come. its just that the journalists chose to cannonize him, rather than demonize him

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by marshalolson

dude is a quality father, that genuinely loves his family, and brings them to all of his games.

---

ummmm....wasn't that his mistress, the one he lied to with pie in the sky promises, who helped the Balco investigation and prosecution?

well, you got me there... (but ruth never cheated...)

Barry is an ass. He went to my High School, a bit before me though. In all his years he has only donated a single 4 yr scholarship to the school.(private Boys Catholic). He will not show up and sign autographs for charity without a fee. Compared to our other pro's, like Tom Brady, Gregg Jefferies, Lynn Swann and others, he is a total prick. TOm Brady donated his mvp car for an auction that raised 300k. Thank God for him. Booo Barry.

Quote:

---

dude is a quality father, that genuinely loves his family, and brings them to all of his games. i see him as a standup guy that gives all that he has 100% of the time.

---

wow, you have a strange take on what being a quality father is. i guess having a mistress and cheating on your wife is a good example for your children. a standup guy? no one likes him on the giants team, he is an asshole to his teammates and never gets off the bench to congratulate his teammates after scoring or winning a game. its easy to give 100 % all the time when you play every other game. i dont blame it on age, because there are pitchers older than him who work 10 times harder.

Quote:

---

do you think barry is maliciously trying to screw the government out of a thousand dollars? wtf?

---

no, he just didnt want his wife to find out he had a mistress so he paid her off. another quality moment in fatherhood.

Quote:

---

so since barry has not tested positive, he hasn't used steroids? your logic there ace. plus, i can tell you he ain't on the juice NOW, nor would i susspect he had been on it KNOWINGLY in the recent past, as there is so much to loose. his numbers have not fallen off at all, othere than injuries. but fuck, he's 42

---

of course he used steroids man. he has doubled the size of his head ten fold and he looks more like a wrestler than a baseball player. up until 2000, he had never hit the 50 hr mark and since then, at the end of his career, he puts up abnormal hr numbers? dont be naive, he knew what he was doing and there is nothing to lose when you can disguise steroids. dont tell me you think guys in the mlb arent using roids anymore.

bottom line, the majority rules against him, you are one of the few and proud barry supporters.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

the guy's trainer was head of the balco ring. how is that flimsy?

---

Who's denied he ever gave Bonds steroids
At least you're not trumpeting the testimony of his jilted ex-lover as credible.


Have you actually read Book of Shadows? Here's a brief synopsis of the evidence against Bonds:

1) Kimberly Bell's Grand Jury testimony that Barry told her that he started using steroids after the 1998 season and then changed what and how he used after his injuries in 1999.
2) An anonymous source (identified as close to Barry Bonds) says Greg Anderson was providing Barry Bonds steroids during the 1999 season. (The only new source the book provides that was not in any of the original SF Chronicle articles.)
3) Tim Montgomery's Grand Jury testimony that Victor Conte told him he was providing steroids to Barry Bonds sometime in 2000 or 2001 (Tim wasn't sure which year!).
4) IRS Special Agent and Lead Balco Investigator Jeff Novitzky's notes on his interviews during the raid on Balco with both Victor Conte (Balco President) and Jim Valente (Balco VP) in which Jeff claims both Jim and Victor state that they provided steroids to Barry Bonds. (Both Victor and Jim have repeatedly and publicly denied ever making these statements and ever providing steroids to Barry Bonds.)
5) CJ Hunter's Grand Jury testimony in which he claims that Victor Conte told him in 2003 that he was providing steroids to Barry Bonds. (Like Tim Montgomery's testimony this testimony is hearsay against Barry Bonds it is only usable in court (criminal or civil) against Victor Conte and not against Barry Bonds.)
6) Documents seized in the raid of Greg Anderson's apartment that suposedly document use of steroids by Barry Bonds in 2002 and 2003. (Greg Anderson has repeatedly denied providing steroids to Barry Bonds while he has acknowledged providing steroids to others.)
7) Unverified (no voice verification or untampered verification)and never played in public Tape Recording of conversation between an anonymous source (identified as close to Greg Anderson) and Greg Anderson in which Anderson is supposed to brag about how undectable the steroids are that he is providing to Barry Bonds. (Again, Greg Anderson has repeatedly denied providing steroids to Barry Bonds while acknowledging he provided steroids to others.)

Like I said, flimsy!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

you're right, except he admitted to taking a substance and putting it under his tongue claiming it wasnt steroids.

---

No he didn't. Bonds has made zero claims, that's what's driving you and all the Bonds haters crazy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

bottom line, the majority rules against him, you are one of the few and proud barry supporters.

---

Yes, I'm proud to say I think for myself and make my own decisions rather than follow mob mentality.

GO GIANTS!!

here ya go: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2...e=hruby/060512

Quote:

---

Yes, I'm proud to say I think for myself and make my own decisions rather than follow mob mentality.

---

make sure you patt yourself on the back.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

dont tell me you think guys in the mlb arent using roids anymore.

---

who, like alber pujols?

The sad truth is, America does not give a shit about steroids. they just like big numbers.

Hey kid you want to play in the big leagues? Bend over, let me jab you in the keester with this.

If i were a baseball geek, i'd be real pissed right now.

Quote:

---

who, like alber pujols?

---

no, but everyone is under the microscope who puts up really good numbers and they will be under suspicion now that steroids have been brought to light. its too bad, but we are in the steroid era now.

Quote:

---

The sad truth is, America does not give a shit about steroids. they just like big numbers.

---

sad, but true. i think now that books have come out and the public has been exposed to the whole steroid thing, they may feel different. but yeah, everyone ate up the home run race between mcgwire and sosa. poor bonds felt he wasnt getting enough attention so he joined the group and increased his homeruns the next year by 24. gotta be natural.:rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

all those guys are under scrutiny and all their records. its not my asterisk, its the mlb's, but no i wouldnt. i believe he and all those guys cheated and therefore should be criticized.

---

First off, there's no asterisk. Its all what the media is playing it up to be, and MLB hasn't put an asterisk anywhere.

Second- I love how America (mostly fueled by the moron Congressmen and Senators) thinks that steroids are only a problem in baseball. Wake up people. I'm betting the NFL has more of a steroids problem than baseball, and who knows about basketball or track and field. If its not steroids, its some other performance enhancing drug. Hell, I bet its a problem in COLLEGE sports. They don't regulate it at all there- when I was in college (D1 baseball), we had a couple tests a year that were administered half-heartedly at best. Our star OF smoked weed a couple days beforehand, and for the test he filled his pee cup with water and gatorade. Didn't get caught.

Quote:

---

First off, there's no asterisk. Its all what the media is playing it up to be, and MLB hasn't put an asterisk anywhere.

---

yes, there is man. the reason for the asterisk is to let people know in the future when steroid testing started. its a fact, i didnt make it up. go to espn.com and find out for yourself. there will be an asterisk next to barry bonds' name.
what school did u play for out of curiousity?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

here ya go: http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2...e=hruby/060512

---

Yea, ESPN has become so classy in their ways of recognizing a great feat. The significance of this accomplishment has been totally clouded by the media frenzy about Barry's potential steroid use.....if you choose to be lured in by the shallow opinions from somewhere far behind the sidelines. The easiest thing to do in life is to be a critic, right JMan? Props to the Oakland fans for giving him a standing ovation upon his HR - I'm glad to see some folks in this world (Nor Cal) still think for themselves and recognize a great feat, rather than react as an angry mob led around by the media nose ring, a la Houstan-ites.

Anyone remember how defiantly positive the French, the press, and who ever the fuck wanted some limelight were in their accusations about Lance being a doper? NO POSITIVE TEST RESULTS, EVER. But the media had to cover every tiny, ridiculous, insignificant accusation. And then, of course, it never even made the ESPN midnight airing when the French judge dismissed all charges against LA due to lack of evidence. Because a hard working hero being succesful is not the immediately satisfying, controversial icon buster of a story the media thrives on. He even had to threaten to make a return for an 8th tour victory just to shut 'em all up again last Winter. Our celebrity enamoured society finds the only attraction in modern day sports to be the stories of flawed and falling heros. And he who discovers and divulges that flaw has accomplished the greatest feat in the ratty world of sports media. Isn't it great for our kids to tune into ESPN to learn more about their idols only to see constant updates on the wrong doings of T.O., Rasheed Wallace, Allen Iverson, Ricky Williams, Kobe and Duke Lacrosse....?! As a parent, I remind my kids that T.V. (and the internet) are not actually the real world. I hope other parents do this too.

Watch out Pujols, cause you are everyone's darling right now. The sharks are quite strong - and they know that the higher they build your temple now, the hotter it will burn later. :rolleyes:

When Barry retires he will regain his status as one of the greatest players to ever swing a bat. Because critics have no soul, and when he is through playing they will conveniently whore their opinions in which ever direction they feel it is best received by the mindless masses.

well, we agree to disagree. i based my opinion on the inconsistency of his numbers throughout his career, not the media fyi. the question will always remain and his numbers will always be in question too with or without the persuading media. as far as pujols goes who may get criticized and judged by fans or the media, you can thank barry for that as well as mcgwire, sosa, and giambi.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1937594

looks like sheffield through him under the bus. the media can lie, but a quote is a quote.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JMan

yes, there is man. the reason for the asterisk is to let people know in the future when steroid testing started. its a fact, i didnt make it up. go to espn.com and find out for yourself. there will be an asterisk next to barry bonds' name.
what school did u play for out of curiousity?

---

Well damn, I be wrong. My bad.

I played for UNC-Greensboro from 96-99, back when we were good (averaged 40 wins when I played) and played a tough schedule. We played all the ACC and SEC teams for non-conference, and were in the Southern Conference. It was pretty interesting to see how different schools and conferences treated their players (I played in summer leagues with a lot of Miami, UCLA, Ga Tech, etc guys).