Maroon Bowl Avalanche 1 Dead

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Originally Posted by skideeppow

I heard both papers received numerous letters to editor ripping into these two. They chose not to print it.

They can do what they want, but when you start putting others at risk, you need to really think about your decisions.
They brought in a black hawk and dozens of people to recover the body. So much could have gone wrong.

I would love to know the decision making process of skinning back uphill is such deadly terrain, late in the day with crazy high avalanche danger.

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Obviously they made a deadly mistake, and in hindsight it seems obvious. But I am fairly sure that they never intentionally put people at risk. And they probably did not realize how risky/questionable their decision making was. These were experienced people who wouldn't willingly risk their lives and the lives of their friends (because it is their friends that had to do the recovery). Taking them to task for their decision after the fact does no good. Recognizing that they almost certainly fell into common heuristic traps, and discussing those traps, might be useful.

^^Good Point.

I agree with danno

Fuck, that's horrible. CAIC report is really well done. Lou's tribute is wonderful. Both of which I wish never had to be created in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Kinnikinnick

RIP.

Looks like a tough one to understand putting themselves there from the pictures and conditions. There may be a more complicated explanation.

f nothing else we can deduce that even the best mountain travelers among us can easily fall prey to the heuristic traps and lure of fresh powder and a steep line and then we are vulnerable.

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Nailed it.

RIP Galvinator.

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Originally Posted by skideeppow

I heard both papers received numerous letters to editor ripping into these two. They chose not to print it.

They can do what they want, but when you start putting others at risk, you need to really think about your decisions.
They brought in a black hawk and dozens of people to recover the body. So much could have gone wrong.

I would love to know the decision making process of skinning back uphill is such deadly terrain, late in the day with crazy high avalanche danger.

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by that line of reasoning noone should ever drive a car due to the risk they are putting first responders into. First responders (and SAR members, etc) choose those careers knowing the risks and in many cases because of the risks.

i do a lot of risky things in my life, a little less as I get older (ok that's a lie). Never once has the thought of the risks to my would be rescuers ever entered my selfish mind. i have three daughters. how my death will affect them is less a part of my decision making process than whether they see their father live a happy fulfilled life.
in short, I'd rather teach them to be happy than to be scared.

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Originally Posted by powdork

i have three daughters. how my death will affect them is less a part of my decision making process than whether they see their father live a happy fulfilled life.
in short, I'd rather teach them to be happy than to be scared.

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These sorts of discussions always remind me of a snippet of the movie Meru (which is outstanding, btw). Jon Krakauer is talking about the idea that the rewards of climbing mountains are immense, so long as you come home. But if you die, there's no real way of justifying to your family that cutting your margin of safety too fine was worth it. I don't think that's an argument for staying out of the backcountry - a lot of us need that sort of exposure to the outdoors to stay sane/happy/whatever. But I think it's a good argument for leaving yourself a significant margin of safety. Speaking for myself, while I do need sessions of outdoor therapy to be happy, I don't need those sessions to include skiing gnar lines in sketchy conditions. So I try to remind myself that's the case when I'm route-finding etc.

Also, nice piece on John here. I like their method of locker retirement.

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Originally Posted by Cravenmorhead

Also, nice piece on John here. I like their method of locker retirement.

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Really nice. Thanks for posting.