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Hey, Ice. I did a 10 day liver cleanse with an almost all raw foods diet (no wheat, some cooked meat) over the last couple weeks and I feel like a new mang. Just did the longest hike I've done since blowing out my knee. If you want it, just say the word and I'll scan and email it to you.
I have a Brittany with shitty swiss cheese hips, I give it to him twice a day and there is a noticeable difference in his mobility and energy levels as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sicks
I have tried just about everything available with horses..
The only thing I feel like made a visible difference was MSM and legend (Hyaluronate Sodium)/adequan (polysulfated glycosaminoglycan) injections.
Actually adequan works so well that I know of people who inject themselves with it... not that I am recommending that..
This is as I understand it too. I had a chem professor that was interested in it so he followed the research for a while and decided it was bull shit.Quote:
Originally Posted by hutash
It is made up of bits of shark cartilage, crustacean chitin and exoskeletons for other sea arthropods. This is the curious thing is that if it was actually going to help your joints it would have to get to your joints. However, we ingest it, putting it into our stomachs where it gets broken down and pieced into aminoacid building blocks. You might as well eat the bone in your T-bone.
From a british medical journal, "Compared with placebo, glucosamine, chondroitin, and their combination do not reduce joint pain or have an impact on narrowing of joint space. Health authorities and health insurers should not cover the costs of these preparations, and new prescriptions to patients who have not received treatment should be discouraged."... Wandel S, Jüni P, Tendal B, Nüesch E, Villiger PM, Welton NJ, Trelle S (2010). "Effects of glucosamine, chondroitin, or placebo in patients with osteoarthritis of hip or knee: network meta-analysis". British Medical Journal 341 (sep16 2): c4675. doi:10.1136/bmj.c4675. PMC 2941572. PMID 20847017
American Academy of Orthopedic Surgeons (AAOS):
We recommend glucosamine and/or chondroitin sulfate or hydrochloride not be prescribed for patients with symptomatic OA of the knee.
AAOS Level of Evidence: I
AAOS Grade of Recommendation: A
Rationale:
This recommendation is based on an Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality (AHRQ) report12 that provides evidence from one RCT and six systematic reviews (Table 8) on the use of glucosamine and/or chondroitin sulfate or hydrochloride among patients with symptomatic OA of the knee. We evaluated this evidence as Level I.
The AHRQ report states that “the best available evidence found that glucosamine hydrochloride, chondroitin sulfate, or their combination did not have any clinical benefit in patients with primary OA of the knee.”
hmmm, the 50-60% range is the typical max efficacy rate of placebos.Quote:
Originally Posted by hutash
actually, the placebo effect has been observed in animals as far back as pavlov's experiments. now how or if this could work if you slipped it undetected into a dog's food, i don't know. it could also be explained by observer's bias, the fact that you know you did it and your observations are biased towards seeing it as being effective. or possibly the effects of more human contact; perhaps knowing your dog is sick you spend more time with him, petting him, talking to him, etc. this has been demostrated to have positive benefits in animals. maybe hutash knows more on this and can comment.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sicks
i had been taking glucosamine/chondoitin supplements since mid-2010, shortly after my posts above. i thought my hands felt less creaky although i could never say there was any drastic improvement. then again i didn't have any severe symptoms to begin with. i had foot surgery about 7 weeks ago and decided that since i was going to be immobile on the sofa for the recovery period, there was no need to be taking the supplements during this time, so i stopped. i've been starting to get more mobile in the last 2 weeks and can now say with certainty that i don't notice any difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by iceman
the fact is that the placebo effect is real and not fully understood. if it works for you, go for it as long as what you are taking has no harmful side effects. be prepared to be separated from your money for what is basically "all in your head".
I've been taking it a couple of months and my Cholesterol did jump. This might be my last bottle?
looks like str8line camp alumni here;I thought there was flexability improvement...but this stuff isn't supposed to work fast;any coments from knowedgeable people on this? Wonder if the studies accounted for fish/non-fish eaters. Like to see a poll related to this important factor. I am a non fish eater.
Wasn't there another thread on this in the way back time?
http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/s...ht=glucosamine
Quote:
Originally Posted by DougW
I've been on for years. First I had an ankle injury that would not go completely away and seemed to do trick. I once was in a warm climate for 6 months and problems came back slowly. Pills had yellowed from heat. Once I was back on fresh stuff got better again.
I have severe OA and DJD in the right knee and left hip. Last couple of months have been painful. But since my cholesterol went up a lot, I thought I'd quit the glucosamine, condroitin, msm suppliments I've been taking.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shredhead
I quit last monday. By Friday I was more stiff and sore. Friday night I had a very intense workout. Saturday I could hardly walk. I'm back on.
I had an elbow injury for years from motocross. I finally took glucosamine, chondroitin, MSM, fish oil - Seemed to help.
THEN-
I tried Oseteo BiFlex NutriJoint with my BCAA's and protein before lifting weights. Also, Natrol's; Glucosamine, MSM, CetylPure capsules.
PAIN GONE!
First time in years.
Can't say what did it. Only anecdotal. The Oseteo BiFlex NutriJoint was primarily for the gelatin which supports collagen production.