What's your standard roll?

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Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles

The fastest is the no setup roll. Use whatever paddle purchase you can get hip snap against. Watch a good paddler in a play hole, rolling is just paddling upside down. This mean having a bomber on and offside and not favoring either side. What not to do = (assuming your on side = right hand forward) if you flip to your right, spinning your paddle and boy all the way around to on side roll. Instead, use the momentum of your flip, throw your body under the boat and roll off side. The back deck roll does have it's place, generally if you go over vert playing or unintendo rodeo, but I don't think it is the right "go to" roll under most situations. I think most better paddlers use a modified sweep where when the paddle blade gets perpecdicular with the boat, then either reverse the stoke and scull up or pull down on the paddle into a C - C. This put you in a better position to start paddling than finishing on the back deck.

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I would agree with most of this, in particular using the momentum of the flip and going to the off side, particularly when rolling on a river run (creeking, rather than playboating). When you get knocked over on a river run, usually it is because you are bracing against the current and your paddle gets pulled under the boat. The mistake most people make in that situation is to try and set up on the side they tipped over on and try and roll repeatedly against the current (difficult to impossible if in a wave train).

I always try to start with a sweep and end with a reverse/skulling stroke which is effectively like starting with a sweep roll that then finishes with an abreviated backdeck. This is often the only roll that will work if you are on a swirling eddy line where the current is reversing direction on you.

When playing in a hole, a backdeck is usuallymy roll of choice, since the current is typically flowing from the front to back of the boat and sweep rolls are hopeless. Even if I start with a backdeck I usually reverse the stroke at the end and go into a skull/sweep as well.

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Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles

The fastest is the no setup roll. Use whatever paddle purchase you can get hip snap against.

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That's the roll I want. I've been working to make myself skip the mistaken security of immediately going to a setup and instead just putting my paddle out and doing a hip snap.

I'm kind of with blured here. i don't think the backdeck really deserves the bad rap I think it has in creeking. I was actually surprised last summer when I rode out this slide this slide (... not me in the footage) on my back deck. With my elbow pads, and my hands in front of me the shaft of my paddle actually deflected the worst of the big hits I took away from my face. I came out still looking beautiful.

I am going to agree with Blurred. For me the back deck is superior in all but in the middle of a slide on Oh Be Joyful or something. If I know I am flipping over I just start the back deck momentum and I can spend very little time under the boat. I even used it last year racing in a 14' composite wildwater boat when I flipped in the hardest rapid in the race, but I was able to roll up only missing about 2 strokes and keep the boat going downstream...

all that being said it takes a shit ton of playboating to get really comfortable with back deck roll.

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Originally Posted by Blurred

So what do you guys think is the safest roll in a shallow, manky creek?

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My votes for a bomber brace before I have to drag my head over the rocks.:)

or

I did once push off the bottom with my paddle- in about 2 feet of water-on the Lochsa-and yes I was very embarrassed.

Carry momentum in your body and your boat. All you're doing is pulling your boat back under your body. Playboating/squirtboating teach you to think cubically (3D) so you keep rotational momentum in your boat so you stay in the hole, on the wave, or on flatwater/seams/eddies to keep you moving into the next move, even if it's just paddling forward again downstream.

Your body snap and paddle sweep or pull tend to move towards and across or reflecting off a line vertical from your cockpit.

I personally pass or reflect so I end up in a forward position; more stable and with an active forward stroke ready, rather than needing that extra time to get your body forward once you're on the surface. A weighted back-deck will send you right back into the pit.

Righting your boat is just another stroke and body movement, continuous with your others.

Blurred: Listen to Harv. He's The Man on the river.