A TR without photos???
Here's one for you Plake.
http://hosting.the-edg.net/TeleAl/103408_DSCF0042.jpg
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A TR without photos???
Here's one for you Plake.
http://hosting.the-edg.net/TeleAl/103408_DSCF0042.jpg
I think that's the Plaza. Should have a third - MONEY - pointed down to the entrance.
Okay, Now that I'm back from NY, and have time to write up a true TR, I'll go into detail what happenned to me. I'm sure hundreds of others have a similar story, but this was mine.
Tuesday afternoon my freind Jan-Luc and I went into Manhattan to work on an independent documentary on the anti war movement. On the subway in from Brooklyn, he gave me a card from the National Lawyers Guild on what to do if you get arrested. At first we went to Union Square- which has a long history of being the dissent center of NYC. It actually got it's name from early pro-labor demonstrators. We got some good footage of protestors, and interviewed a few Critical Massers who were planning a bike block.
Around 5:30, we decided to check out another protest, this one at the NY public library on 5th Ave. (the one they run out of in the beginning of Ghostbusters). Around 6 or so, the protestors began heading to the Garden. So they begain walking West on 42nd St, toward 6th ave.
The area I was arrested in is an area I know very well. It is right across the street from HBO, where I spent a summer interning. So I know that at 6 PM, the area is full of people leaving their offices. Anyway, as the crowd of perhaps 500- not an extremely large amount actually, began heading towards Herald Square, Police were telling people to remain on the sidewalk or risk arrest. Fair enough. Than a group of police in riot gear amasses on the corner of 42 and 6th. They hold up an orange snowfence, which reads "Police Line Do Not Cross". I figured they were blocking off the street for Anlod's motorcade or something. So I turned around, trying to find an alternate route, and saw another group of cops with a snowfence.
Some people tried to hop the fence, and get away. They were promptly bet with Mr. Billy club. I pulled out my camera and began snapping shots of the police brutality. I'll post them when I get them developed.
I was penned in with about 50 other people, about 1/3 who were media. The police told us to sit down. While I usually am a bit opinionated, when somebody with a gun tells me to do something, I generally do it. Everyone in the pen was arrested, thrown in paddy wagons, and sent to Pier 57.
Pier 57 is an old bus garage that is no longer used by the MTA. The floor was covered in decades of oil, dust, and diesel. And there was no place to sit. Just a bunch of chain link and razor wire cages with portapotties. The place was so bad that the POLICE THEMSELVES called in the health dept, because the conditions were so filthy. There were reports of people getting chemical burns and rashes from the floor. Seeing as how my skin isn't exctly the healthiest part of me, I was a bit concenred.
I have to comment on the food. While I certainly wasn't expecting it to be tasty, I thought prisoners were at least supposed to reieve nutrition. All I was fed was white bread, surplus cheese, and bologna. I recieved one serving of fruits and vegetables (an orange) the entire 26 hours I was detained.
After about 14 hours at pier 57, we were shuttled to central booking. This was where I got real PO'd. How come the NYPD had the forsight to hold thousands of people, but not the infrastructure to process them? I know the real answer- so they could keep us off the streets as long as legally possible.
After about ten to twelve hours of being shuttled around, grabbing a few winks here and there (Downtown was like the W hotel compared to the pier), I was released. Still, I had to wait for four hours the next day to get my stuff back.
Now- to respond to some of your comments:
Benny- I know it could have been worse. But the fact is- I didn't commit a crime. I was WRONGFULLY ARRESTED. I know the NYPD have a lot to worry about. Maybe if the Feds didn't cut funding to local police and fire departments, they wouldn't be so overwhelmed. Don't get me started on the WTC bombings. I knew people who were killed in the attacks. I almost moved back to NYC a month before the attacks, and may very well move back in the near future.
Another NYPD note- they are currently working without a contract. And Bloomberg says that since they all cleaned up on OT this week, he doesn't think they need a raise.
Armchair- you hit the nail on the head. NYC id VERY democratic. The only reason the last 2 mayors have been repubs is Dinkins fucked up the city so bad that even Jesse Helms probably could have won a vote in Washington Hts. Nobody wanted the convention in town, for various reasons. Many businesses in midtown lost money this week- mostly the ones that were "supposed" to make a lot of money during the convention.
And I was hoping to take my dad out for lunch at your place, but, well, I was in a cell.
The police called the actions "pre-emptive". They didn't want a rerun of seattle in 1999. So they were arresting people by the busloads. I met two preists, a few Euro tourists, and at least 5 minors- one of whom was an official guest of the convention- who were busted. This wasn't even profiling- it was divide, conquer, and arrest.
Mr. G- if you are referring to the "free speech zones" cages in Boston- I heard they were in NY too. But I couldn't get close enough to MSG to find out.
All in all, I think that this was one of the most fucked up things I've ever seen in person. I'm surprised there weren't tanks in front of Macy's.
I've been arrested twice. First time I did it the wrong way and ended up with a bloody nose and an unreal processing time. The second time I minded my p's and q's and was processed in around 30 minutes.
It doesn't sound like you had a right or wrong way option. I'm not sure there is a right way with the NYPD. There is a reason that Manhattan(South of 112th) cleaned up like it did. They are not to be trifled with. For they really are killers.
Quote:
Originally posted by ArmchairExtreme
And my quarter is ruined. My business lost about 200K in revenue.
On a positive note, I did save some money on car insurance by staying with GEICO.
^GOLD. new sig for me...
Plake, I admire your spirit much. Been there, done that. Bad War 30 or more years ago. The one they made people go to. But you have to understand that things have changed from the old street theatre daze, unless you have the sheer numbers. (We need a huge mall fest in DC at his door step). Media is everywhere, more than Orwell could imagine. That is where minds change. If they can. Here.
Kelly is a good man, a good soldier in this fight. He has limited resources, and little connection to the neocons in DC and the Republican Party that he had to deal with, like so many other whores coming to Manhattan to suck up the cash. He had a job and duty to protect his City, and plenty of time to think about it, with a lightly trained army of young white guys from LI and Rockland. He has a world view, and studied Seattle in detail, I'm sure. So, on a level of priorities, you were low. Very low. He was much more concerned with massive death and evacuations. He just wanted you out of the way. Sorry.
Did you see what happened in Russia this week? I'm sure. It's so bad , the Media wants to ignore it right now. Go ahead, turn on your video receiving device. Some celebrity outshines that stuff, or just bad weather. Just another battle in the great 21st century religous war, that just seems to be starting. duck.
You've got it wrong, Benny. There's no excuse, and no possible justification for what happened in NYC this week. What's the point of a war on terror if we're trashing the Constitution in the process? We might as well give in. There was absolutely no prospect for free speech in NYC this past week. I was personally threatened with arrest at least 10 times, told that I had to keep moving on the sidewalk, and then when I did, told that I couldn't return to the same location. The cops told me they didn't care, but they had been ordered to keep protestors away. I tried to exercise my rights, and for no reason whatsoever was threatened with arrest. The charge would have been disorderly conduct (walking on the sidewalk is somehow 'disorderly' in Bush, Giuliani, and Bloomberg's NYC). A CNN employee actually got into it a bit with one of the cops when he heard the guy threaten me with arrest. He asked, 'What law is he breaking', and the cop tried to argue with him for a few minutes. Of course, he wasn't going to tell that guy to do anything (nor force any of the Republicans or other people to follow the 'rules' they had for protesters).
I'm glad that judge fined the city 500,000 dollars for violating civil rights, and I hope Bloomberg is held personally accountable. I'd like to file suit myself.
Sorry that had to happen to you Plakes, I know of others who were arrested simply for ending up on the wrong sidewalk at the wrong time. I'm actually glad those guys beat the shit out of that undercover cop trying to infiltrate the protest.
Fuck the fucking piece of shit police.
What the police did was wrong, but Benny's right. Let it slide. Americans are too quick to file a lawsuit at the drop of a hat.
Hey, I lived on that in college.Quote:
Originally posted by Plakespear
All I was fed was white bread, surplus cheese, and bologna.
Of course the cheese came from my room mates grandmother,
who was eligible for such nurishment thanks to the US govt.
I definitely feel smarter these days when eatiing real food.
I applaud your efforts.
Interested in making a documentary on the Swiss style of democracy?
If so, there is a free place to stay in the Alps. I'm serious.
Clueless about what a different style of democracy is?
I can explain. In short, this democracy is newer than the US', and modified regularly, unlike the US'.
This is a project I have been working on for about a year.
Also, it is a direct democracy.
And campaign finance is not an issue here because of this.
Yes, I am so bold to say this is a solution to that root of the problem.
And there is skiing, biking, and climbing.
Plakedude,
That is seriously fucked up. I hope you caught some of this bullshit with the camera(?)
Sounds like the "Chicken" needs a partner, something along the line of Hitler wearing an NYPD hat.
Going to jail for your principles is a turning point. Sounds like you didn't necessarily anticipate getting thrown in the slammer, but once the indigestion from the bologna subsides, I'd imagine this will be one of those moments that redefines you, in a way.
I've spent a lot of time in situations where I risked arrest, and a several times was arrested. It's eye opening to be on the other side of the system that way, to see how you are treated for standing up for your beliefs. For standing up when no one else will. Often times, those moments end up leading to real societal change. Not always, but sometimes.
Some of my experiences have been quite good - cracking jokes with police officers, laughing with my cellmates. Other times I've been truly frightened. I remember running for over a mile from the police after the Rodney King trial when San Francisco erupted in protests. We hadn't done a damn thing, but we were sprinting from police in riot gear.
It truly sucks that at ever mass convergence in the last 5 years (WTO, the 2000 DNC and RNC, World Bank protests, etc.) people's civil rights are being ignored and trashed. That in and of itself it hugely disturbing, and the fact that more people aren't up in arms about it, is chilling to me. Sorry, but the idea of letting it slide is, imho, practically handing over our rights on a silver platter.
Nice pic TeleAl - I'm sure I've crossed paths with the people who hung that banner :).
Anyway, just my 2 cents, and I'm sure I'll get some shit slung my way, but I guess that's the point of what many of us here are trying to say - ignore the shit slinging and hang tight.
Hey Plake, do you mind if I forward that to some family members of mine?
It's worth reading.
Don't fuck with Guiliani: http://www.un.org/terrorism/statements/giuliani.html
"Americans are not a single ethnic group.
Americans are not of one race or one religion.
Americans emerge from all your nations."
"There is no nation, and no City, in the history of the world that has seen more immigrants, in less time, than America. People continue to come here in large numbers to seek freedom, opportunity, decency, and civility."
"Each of your nations - I am certain - has contributed citizens to the United States and to New York. I believe I can take every one of you someplace in New York City, where you can find someone from your country, someone from your village or town, that speaks your language and practices your religion."
But fuck Switzerland, bankers of Nazi genocide cash.
Easy to let shit slide from thousands of miles away, eh? If you were walking on a public sidewalk tomorrow and were arrested under false pretenses, would you be angry? Rightfully angry? Or would you just "let is slide"? Those cops should be ashamed. Not ashamed as an entity, but individually. Each one of them knew it was wrong and did it anyway. Thievery of freedom committed by those bound to protect serve.Quote:
Originally posted by slippy
What the police did was wrong, but Benny's right. Let it slide.
TeleAl -- though cool, moving to Switzerland is not the answer to changing democracy in America. Even the greatest critics recognize the progress of the US. Hard to change something as an absentee.
Watersnowdirt -- the events you mentioned are increasingly understood and ingrained in the public's consciousness. That's a big step, right? Sometimes you know your rights are going to be trampled. People may not appreciate it when it happens, but time can (and has) change the perspectives of many.
Unfortunately, I'm sure Bloomberg has no problem paying 500k to keep things in line. That fine is stupid low and seems to encourage similar conduct. Not my idea of judicial (as opposed to vigilante) retribution or redress.
Rusty, I believe I am agreeing with what you wrote. I hope you take it that way. Just a few opinions about your points:Quote:
Originally posted by Rusty Nails
Those cops should be ashamed. ---
TeleAl -- though cool, moving to Switzerland is not the answer to changing democracy in America. Even the greatest critics recognize the progress of the US. Hard to change something as an absentee.
- Cops are doing a job they are told 2 do. A bit like our boys going to war. It is the people "upstairs" giving the orders that are responsible and need to answer to the law and Constitution. Sounds like they behaved badly and need to be moved out of their offices. We have a chance this Nov!
- I am absentee, too. Yes, it is hard to work on change from a distance, but I am registered and requested my ballot to vote in Nov. ...just hope the Republican-controlled Board of Elections in Hamilton Co. Ohio (read Cincinnati) follows thru and sends it to me and... counts it, too!
I read TeleAl's post and it seemed he was inviting you to see CH democracy in action for a ski/bkie season, or more. I did not think he was saying to flee the madness, avoid the draft and escape the US. ;)
Anyway, I will be short and say that the US has implemented its version of democracy. It has its flaws and strengths. In CH, the local and canton levels (read US state) are more important in peoples lives. The Federal level is less strong. Travel around and/or research to see how it is implemented elsewhere. I think that is what TeleAl was saying.
LITT
LITT,Quote:
Originally posted by Lostinthetrees
Rusty, I believe I am agreeing with what you wrote. I hope you take it that way. Just a few opinions about your points:
- Cops are doing a job they are told 2 do. A bit like our boys going to war. It is the people "upstairs" giving the orders that are responsible and need to answer to the law and Constitution. Sounds like they behaved badly and need to be moved out of their offices. We have a chance this Nov!
- I am absentee, too. Yes, it is hard to work on change from a distance, but I am registered and requested my ballot to vote in Nov. ...just hope the Republican-controlled Board of Elections in Hamilton Co. Ohio (read Cincinnati) follows thru and sends it to me and... counts it, too!
I read TeleAl's post and it seemed he was inviting you to see CH democracy in action for a ski/bkie season, or more. I did not think he was saying to flee the madness, avoid the draft and escape the US. ;)
Anyway, I will be short and say that the US has implemented its version of democracy. It has its flaws and strengths. In CH, the local and canton levels (read US state) are more important in peoples lives. The Federal level is less strong. Travel around and/or research to see how it is implemented elsewhere. I think that is what TeleAl was saying.
LITT
No worries. In an earlier post TeleAl seemed to say that the US was messed up (I agree) which is why he left (nothing wrong with that). Only trouble is if everyone who wants change leaves, nothing changes. That was all I was saying. I also didn't want to dive into a deep theoretical discussion on how Federal Government is way fackin easier is a small country than it is in a large one. If everyone country had the size and demographic homogeny of Norway, government would be easier. Switzerland would fit into a corner of AK, so talking comparative government can only offer so much.
Individuals that know they are doing something wrong (false imprisonment) should be held individually responsible. Most troops who went into Iraq, like most americans, thought it was morally justified when they did it. There's no way the cops in NYC thought it was right to arrest people without probable cause.
Impeach Bloomberg. Maybe that should be a new sign for Dex's chicken.
Oh Canada............................................ .......................
--Sometimes you can't see the trees through the forest.Quote:
Originally posted by Rusty Nails
[BTeleAl -- though cool, moving to Switzerland is not the answer to changing democracy in America. Even the greatest critics recognize the progress of the US. Hard to change something as an absentee.[/B]
Get out and see what is possible.
Go back if you want and try to make the change.
And yes, I am inviting anyone over to see Swiss democracy in action!
My apartment is has 4 extra beds. Bring your skis.
--As for moving out, all I said was, "Consider it."
For me, it was the correct decision.
Not an easy one either. I left all my friends and family behind.
And I was working hard for change while in the US.
--As for progress, I recognize the US' contribution to the world through the Great Experiment. However, I also recognize that other countries have taken that idea (democracy), modified it, improved upon it, and made their democracies more inclusive (in terms of their population's role) than the republic of the US.
The US has not modified its system much in the last 200+ years.
Allow me to offer the example of the Electoral College. Originally set up to vote on behalf of the population in its state, it seems a bit outdated. The EC has the right to vote for a population as it believes the population would have voted. In the case of a storm, flood, or other means to prevent a population from voting on the second Tuesday of November, this would be employed. The second Tuesday in November is because it is after the harvest, and with enough time to go to Church on Sunday, travel Monday, and vote Tuesday. I won't refer to FLA 2000 as an example, it is too hot a topic. I will simply say, the EC is no longer necessary, yet it exists.
Another example is that a majority is not necessary to win an election. Clinton won with some 43% of the vote, as a result of a strong 3rd party Perot. Or, in the State of Connecticut, my home state and the Constitution State, Gov. Rowland won with some 30something% of the vote (we had 5 candidates, most strong ones).
Yes, I am calling for some change.
--As for making change as an absentee, I am serious about making an educational film explaining the Swiss Democratic System. I do need the filming support, but am deep into the writing of the script. I doubt I will ever return to live, for many reasons, including that I built my life here.
--As for the racist remarks from another person, I will not engage in a discussion with someone so ignorant.
Your anger and hatred (to what I do not know) is obvious.
--And peaceful protestors should never be arrested!
Especially in the US, the advocate of Freedom, of which I remain a citizen.
Look at the arrest in a positive note.
You wouldn't have nearly as much to talk about without it. You'll have great stories to tell for years and plenty to bitch about until November voting.
As far as the food.......what do you expect from an underfunded agency, fucking red whine and filet mignon? You won't die of scurvey in 26 hours.:rolleyes:
To the judge in the lawsuit "And I didn't get my daily ration of fruits and vegetables. I'm a vegan, I almost died in there"
Yeah, it sucks getting tossed in the slammer for nothing. But you got what you were looking for, a good story.
that's the most fucked up story I've ever read.
I have a good friend who was protesting the Iraq war when it first began (in LA), and was arrested for something very similar. She was pushed and so crossed over the line and immediately arrested. She served the time rather than pay a fine. I have her TR somewhere if anyone wants to read it, it's really incredible (and not long). My hat was/is really off to her. I know her time in jail wasn't too bad since she's pretty recognizable and was treated well by all during her "stay".
edit: here's why she served :
June 12, 2003
Dear Friends,
Yesterday, I was sentenced by the federal government to 6 days in jail, because of 2 civil disobedience actions I did to protest the policies of the Bush administration and the war in Iraq. I will start serving tomorrow, on Friday, June 13.
I think this is a fair sentence. Since it was made clear to the judge that I was morally unable to pay a fine to the government I was protesting, or to take probation which would curb my ability to dissent, I understood that the only option he had left was to incarcerate me.
The most important thing we can do as Americans is not to be silent when it comes to our government's policies, whether that government be liberal or conservative. Speak out peacefully and with respect, and our nation will remain open and free.
All the best,
A
The more wars like Iraq the more terrorists were breading.
If Detroit was a more active city I would protest.
Stand up for what you believe and try to make a change, its stories like this that make me think once in a while that the terrorists are right (in beliefs not actions)
I like what you wrote even if you did not intend it! "...the more terrorists were breading". Makes it seem like our war machine is like a giant KFC that is cranking them out hot and extra crispy!Quote:
Originally posted by Sublime
The more wars like Iraq the more terrorists were breading.
If Detroit was a more active city I would protest.
* maybe you meant to write "...more terrorist we're breeding"?
;)
btw. at least when i was growing to college in the early '70's Detroit was a hot political scene. What happened? i reco protesting anyway and anyhow. Rattle your cage and make some noise!
Also, thank you Plakespear for your time and trouble in NYC. I admire you and all others who are making yourselves heard.
Shake, rattle and rumble!