I'm just a ditch digger man! [emoji3]Quote:
Originally Posted by geomorph
I must have that setting off.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...70b9132b41.jpg
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I'm just a ditch digger man! [emoji3]Quote:
Originally Posted by geomorph
I must have that setting off.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...70b9132b41.jpg
^^^ it says it right there. Your tools are stashed in the forest, next to the scenery.
You're welcome.
Thank you!Quote:
Originally Posted by toast2266
Re tool stashes. I share a too stash with friends. When we move them we'll record a little video as it makes it easier to figure out. So far so good
Spent all summer driving a machine building trails. Was pretty fun! https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...1cba083e75.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...45048cda93.jpg
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more developmentAttachment 350442Attachment 350443Attachment 350444Attachment 350445
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inside hippy line or outside flatter landingAttachment 350447
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Spent the weekend with a chainsaw cutting many downed trees. Didn't take many pics, but half is in a heavily wooded Pine area. Not sure how this addition will work out as Pines typically have surface roots from hell. The layout added another .65 miles.
This pic was littered with trees. I should have taken a before pic.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...a18bcf7b7a.jpg
you can just hack down trees at your trails?Quote:
Originally Posted by jackstraw
we have to do trees sniper style make sure no one notices
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No, not in this area. I only cut downed trees enough to move them or an opening to ride thru.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossymcg
I'm currently working in 4 different places and only one is sanctioned by the landowner. There we have cut saplings, but the land owner sells trees, so he's actually planting and burying bulbs along trails which is pretty cool.
I have some internal conflict with cutting trees, whether downed or alive. Just messing with the nature of things gets me thinking sometimes that I'm being a selfish prick.
I justify it (at least in my head) because a lot of our local forests are pretty unhealthy. Nothing is allowed to burn anymore, so the forests get choked out with a high density of shitty small diameter trees that never grow to mature sizes because a lack of fire means there's too many of them. So by cutting out small trees, I'm actually contributing to the overall health of the forest. Or at least that's what I tell myself.Quote:
Originally Posted by jackstraw
Yeah, I'm not knowledgeable enough to speak about that specifically, especially on the east side. I've read about that being a big issue in the West, but I haven't seen the East mentioned. We have forest fires but they are not common. We generally have a solid amount of moisture and a dense canopy that keeps the ground damp. Although this year was a dry one, but nothing like a western dry.
little booter in to a right hand catch berm. 6 of us now actively digging this trail, should be ready for santa to rideAttachment 350821
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Working away on climbing trail "Deep Green". Last 100m is going slow as it's lumpy. Same basic method, routed trail over mineral soil ridges. Carefully take top layer of organic and moss off and keep it aside. Pull rocks and also keep them aside
Pic1. Benchcut the trailbed trying to keep it narrow. Line trailbed with moss and organic
Pic 2. Another BFR. Excavated around it so it can move into place flat side up
Pic 3. Warehoused rocks are useful to take up the space. Use rocks and mineral soil to fill things in
Pic 4. Trail signAttachment 350822Attachment 350823Attachment 350824Attachment 350825
Can't get enough of dumbing down the trails of Dildo. Edit messed up Pic sequence. Pic 1 should be 2 and Pic2 should be 1
Pic1. Lumps.of loam and undergrowth. Move the Oregon grape to the side pulling it out by the roots so it can be replanted.
Pic 2. Hack away at trailbed. The organic goes further down trail and also on to the main trail where the original surface was getting washed away as the water was going down it.
Expose new route down to rock and mineral soil. Dig away some holes so big rocks can be moved so their flat side is rotated to be facing up
Pic 3. New route now has a flat landing with slight grade reversal so water won't go down main trail any more. Oregon grape replanted to keep things narrow. Main trail and new line cleaned up.Attachment 351572Attachment 351573Attachment 351574
Finished up a .6 adder today. Needs some fine tuning rock work as it's an ass kicker in spots. Cleaned two lines in a few places to see what one will work. A lot of double fall line stuff is tricky to layout. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...5cb2cf196b.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...cd9e73ecaf.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...104be5a6fc.jpghttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...0143a94a65.jpg
Rain over night and this morning meant it was time to dig. Aside from a storm in early Nov this was our first notable rain since March.
I re-bermed a section that was getting badly rutted. Hopefully a bigger berm will stop people from dragging their brakes here. Rain only penetrated a couple inches into the dirt but a couple rainshowers passed over just in time to tamp the trail down. Rainbow was a nice touch as well!
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Di..._222054273.jpg
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Di..._231406925.jpg
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Di..._235257904.jpg
Is that where two lines merge, or am I missing something.
Bigger berms just mean jongs will over brake even more much of the time.
Maybe, we'll see. The dirt sucks right there, so not much you can do but fill it in and re-berm every so many years. I changed the angle of the exit so people shouldn't need to brake as much.
And yeah two lines are merging there. On the left is a jump. It was originally the only line but people started riding around it to rider's left and made a huge fucking mess because it immediately got rutted out and soon widened to about 10 ft. You can still see where it was to the right of the rock. There was a rut about 3 ft deep there and another one forming further right. So I filled and covered that and built a bypass that was less steep. It's lasted about 3 yrs but once a rut starts people seem to panic and either slam on brakes or they ride next to the rut and widen the trail.
More trailwork today. Someone came in last spring and built a turd of a trail that has berms which are more of a trench than a berm. Not surprisingly the ones that were flatter just filled with water. So now they will be re-built. The one below was the worst one. But all the berms were too narrow, so back wheel drags on the inner lip as you go around the turn. Super awkward. And the sections that traverse the slope have bench cuts that are too narrow so people ride off onto the uncompacted edge and create ledges.
Have to get to this soon because people won't stay off the trails even though they're wet, and they'll just ride off trail around sections like this and make a mess.
Before & after:
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/2.jpg
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/3.jpg
^effort was made, but yeah that whole bench should have been much wider.
My latest berm is still a work in progress. The fill dirt needed to settle and then we needed to ride it to dial in the line. I also created a quasi french drain with my fingers crossed. So far it's ok, but looking forward to getting back to it in the spring and making it better.
I'm not the best berm builder, usually end up starting it too high and ending it too soon.
In the pic above I'd built a french drain at first but the dirt started getting mucky. Once I removed the rocks and left the drain open it seemed to actually drain, even in an hour it was more solid. I was debating whether to just remove the berm altogether here. It's not much of a turn so it's not really needed.
Whoever built this trail was pretty hopeless. Did what I could to fix the berms they made. They ride well uphill now which is the direction most are riding this trail, but they're still awkward/tight downhill.
Some before & after of 2 berms. First one was the worst on the trail:
This switchback was fucked. Vertical outer wall and a narrow trench with high inner berm that your rear wheel would get hung up on. You can see a second berm attempt behind that was abandoned.
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/03a.jpg
I cut down the inner berm, angled the outer berm and moved all the dirt to the outer berm. Cut down the upper part a bit.
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/03b.jpg
Upper view. I busted up the abandoned berm too. Once some brush grows on it next spring it shouldn't be visible.
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/04a.jpg
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/04b.jpg
Switchback above that wasn't as bad but still had an awkward surface that I fixed.
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/05a.jpg
Both of them are still too tight to ride nicely downhill. May need to realign further
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/05b.jpg
An example of the ledging I've mentioned. Trail was built with a narrow bench that was too off camber and people keep riding off the uncompacted edge forming a ledge. Later riders all seem to end up on the lower ledge due to target fixation or general ineptitude. Trail keeps widening as the tread creeps down the slope. This also happens every time a cobble pokes out of the tread. People in Socal have rockophobia, always riding around the most trivial rock and usually on the downslope side.
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/7a.jpg
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/7b.jpg
And a final section with the ledges removed. There is one more long section that is pretty bad but that will have to wait til the next rain storm to fix. These will look a lot nicer when grass grows in next spring.
http://www.habventures.com/photos/Digging/2020/02.jpg
Same. I've only built a few of them, so it's a work in progress.Quote:
Originally Posted by evdog
I treat it just like new trails that I've built. Ride it, figure out what is not right and then go back and make it better.
I've said this before, but it drives me nuts when people think the line as built first should stay that way. Sure, often it's a good line, but frequently corners need to be tweaked (usually wider) as it starts to roll faster. That's the biggest mistake around here and I am certainly guilty of making that mistake.
A lot of old school kooks think that the corners should stay tight like it's still 1991! They have no comprehension of how fast kids are hitting these downhill sections. I build (try!) above my ability. I think some get caught up in that also. They cannot envision next level riding beyond their own skills.
bit of a chute in construction Attachment 357093
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this spring is going to be immense, our dig crew has tripled in size. Does anyone else really hold a grudge against the cuts who regularly ride the trails and have never picked up a spade?Attachment 360461Attachment 360462
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Re grudges..you can't. If you do it'll poison you. I used to but now simply expect it. Nice work [emoji122]Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossymcg
I'm in a Facebook group you're in. Im not from Squarmish but I'm fascinated with your trail network and did plan to spend this summer in BC but clearly not happening. There are people in the group who post up problems they've come across on the trails and ride away from them expecting others to deal with it. Ive made it a rule now I only ride with folks who build/maintain trailsQuote:
Originally Posted by LeeLau
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Bike Squamish is very toxic. It reflects the Squamish community well. Many takers. Few doers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossymcg
I think its a reflection on the world as a whole.Quote:
Originally Posted by LeeLau
You must have a very active dig/maintenance crew in Squarmish though, the amount and variety of trails in the area is top whack.
I'm not even asking for folks to get on the spade, just have a litter pick, pull out the leg scratchy weeds on the connecting trails, clear out a drainage sump/pipe.
Like you said ive got to stop letting it get on my tits but it boils my piss the cunts
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Eh, i work a desk job, so just being in the woods is a nice time for me, and ever since i was a child ive found digging in the dirt theraputic. It also helps keep you manual labor-strong, which i think is important. I find it really cool and satisfying (to my stunted artistic side) to create trail- be able to envision a path through the woods, and enhance the natural terrain into cool features to ride. I have a whole bunch of full days digging on trails or features that i will never ride (way above my paygrade) along with the days digging trails i do/can ride.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossymcg
The one trail i built fully myself, i get stoked when i see fresh tire marks on it. I only get bummed when people try to pirate build shitty jumps on it, or dig out trail flora i intentionally left in because of aesthetics.
I wouldn't say a grudge build wise, but its annoying when you know the amount of traffic on a trail and the amount of debris still down from the last heavy wind. The lack of 10 second trail maintenance from the masses is annoying.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossymcg
My son just started working for MBOSC non profit. He's pretty stoked as it looks like he'll be off the computer and on trail once a week or so building and maintaining.
Snow is a coming, so looks like build season is officially going into hibernation. Cleared some tools from the woods yesterday.https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...040722fc58.jpg
My experience is that as you transition to a bigger paid crew you lose some of the volunteer culture. You also get less jank, for better and worse. Also, the grudge doesn't do anybody any good, least of all you, but I'm guessing you know that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossymcg
SC = Santa Cruz? If so, congrats, that's a good crew. Matt has figured out how to raise funds and grow the program (they have volunteer days where 70+ people turn up) and Drew knows his stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by jackstraw
Right on! Yes, I don't know anything about them, but looking at the web site and in my sons short time there, they seem like a great company. And "Matt", who I don't know, aside from you mentioning him here is without a doubt a likeable intelligent guy. Anyone that can grow a small non-profit focused on trail building and advocacy to the extent he has is impressive. Hopefully I'll get to meet him sometime when COVID ends.Quote:
Originally Posted by teledad
My son is in their marketing department, but he's stoked to do some manual build labor once or so a week. The funny thing is he didn't plan to ride at all moving to SC. He is addicted to surfing, so logistically and time wise he didn't even bring a bike. Things changed! I am shipping his bike out this week.
No one i know gets paid for digging, we've got a good strong crew actively digging and we're getting along just fine. Ive no drama with everyone/anyone riding the trails.Quote:
Originally Posted by panchosdad
There's coaches giving lessons on the trails that haven't done a tap, then the folks suggesting what we should build or how we should build them that havent done a tap.
LBS who use trails to demo bikes have given diggers deals on consumables and muc off, which I don't take, I dont want anything other that more users kicking in
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We have a pretty good volunteer base, considering the size of the community. A big dig day might have 30ish people. The fact that there are plenty of riders that never come dig doesn't bother me that much. Especially if they make some nominal donation to the local club - don't have time to dig? Throw $50 / year towards the club that does the work and call it good.
There are, however, a few people in particular that piss me off. Some of the most frequent users of the trail. People that I see almost every time I'm out digging. But they always have some lame excuse as to why they can't stop and help for 15 minutes. And they've been using those same lame excuses for years and have never once lifted a shovel. And they're cheap - they've never donated a penny to the local club either. Fuck those guys.
Unless you have specific permission by the land managers/owners or your local trails organization, you should not be out there digging around on trails. Cutting out a small tree with a handsaw is about as far as anyone should go and I think the forest service for one even frowns on that. Maybe toss branches or other debris off to the side? If there's an issue with a trail, a big tree down or something, you really should just be reporting it and not trying to fix it yourself. Well, I guess unless there are no organized, official groups doing work around you. If that's the case, maybe check with the fs/owner/etc about getting something going. We have a crew of sawyers certified by the forest service on a mailing list, and usually a tree will be out within a day or two.
And no, I don't have any problem with people who just ride and don't do volunteer days or donate. Kind of a silly expectation that every single person out there who goes hiking or running or biking would need to do that. I'm just happy they're going outside.
^cut a tree? I"ll rake and dig before cutting trees. Cutting a tree is like the worst thing I can possibly do when building a trail.
Well, i was talking about trees that fall down across the trail.
But anyway, as not a forest ecologist, it's my understanding that due to logging and poor management and fires and stuff parts of forest are pretty dense with young trees and thinning in these places is helpful. So in those cases cutting stuff down to make a trail go where you want isn't that big of a deal. Our newest trail up to the top of a mountain involved a lot of tree cutting.
NorCal is like the only place in the world where the landowners are like, "You want to cut trees down (invasive eucalyptus which are also massive fire hazards)? Oh god yes, thank you!"