Powdork: Nice pics, thanx for the amp!!
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Powdork: Nice pics, thanx for the amp!!
Excellent pics all around.
Snow seems super soft on top. Glad the storm came in the way it did.
I've never had a problem skinning at heavely, wondering what the official policy is though now as this summer I noticed a sign I had never seen before accessing the rim trail via bike in the stagecoach area saying uphill travel is prohibited.
Oh Yeah.....
Thank You Powdork
http://www.skiheavenly.com/the-mount...#/UphillTravelQuote:
Originally Posted by TahoeBC
It basically says don't do it when we're open. and no dogs. oops.
I imagined Farley reading schralph post with all those quotes. Indeed he his correct, but it made me laugh.
KW has not always done this. Before Vail bought the place early season traffic was almost encouraged.
Perhaps they are concerned with Avis due to the fact that they had two inbound slides during operating hours the first season they ran the resort within a few days of each other. They came in and cut ski patrol by a third and pushed to open terrain quickly. So it seems that just because the corp leaders of Bail do not know how I mitigate danger, they assume no one does.
It is curious that the Heave seems to have their panties a whole lot less bunched than KW.
It is also curious that I have seen the KW team riders out on the hill early season. I'll be interested to see if the video crew that gets early ups on powder days and holds up te line of paying customers while they film the powder uses drones this year, as there are no drones signs posted all over the place now. Signs, signs, everywhere there's signs.... KW is really losing its soul. It is too bad.
There are other places to park, but it does suck that one needs to go all stealth to ski on public lands. I understand needing to stay away from equipment and workers, but not keeping people away from the other 2250 acres.
As to the question of why at the resort land, S Bowl is simply one of the best early season locations due to easy access, the fact snow blows in to it, the base is grass and loose stone, it faces north and there are several options down to return you to your skin track. I don't think KW even summer grooms, one would not even be utilizing that service.
But whatever. I'm not skiin this storm. More solid surf coming on Sunday.
Drooling. Of all weeks not to be able to call in and have a climbing trip planned.
Banning drones at the resort is one thing I won't knock Vail for. Those things are a lot more dangerous than most people realize (especially the ones with propellers sturdy enough to withstand windy conditions) and the last thing we need is some gaper with a drone closing down a lift due to a collision (which is what actually happened at Vail a few years ago, hence the policy).
Re: pre-season access on USFS land, based on the recent policy amendments that LightRanger mentioned I'm hoping by this time next year we can go to places like K-wood armed with highlighted documentation. The language they used gave the impression of being pro public access, or at least specifically clarifying what restrictions lease holders can impose. So long as you don't use their parking lot, that is. Of course, that was only in a broad sense and it'll be interesting to see the specifics stated in each lease or operating plan, if any.
Nice pics PowDork - just got my first need to ski pangs of the season.
Quote:
Originally Posted by powdork
Love snow dogs, if I ever win the lottery; i'm moving up to some mountainside and getting a couple of snowdogs and one snowbunny with serious SUV to take her places when she's had enough of me and the dogs.
went up to check out conditions. Definitely not as good as what Heavenly looked like. Jibber garden was in full swing at the summit when I drove past, so I continued to another spot. It was thin to say the least, so I cruised back over to the jib garden. Also had some success finding snow at the resort. Definitely wont be heading back up there until more snow.Quote:
Originally Posted by stormyMonday
I think the fact that kirkwood actually has early/pre season terrain that can slide. Nobody is going into Mott and killebrew till it's actually open so not much to worry about at heavenly concerning avy danger. That preseason avy death at alpine is what has pushed current policy in this direction.
Gonna go ahead and say yestrday was a mighty fine first day. Getting some lake effect up here now
Is there anywhere to buy a snopark permit other then the chevron in meyers?
Thanks for that info. Scraped the storage wax off skis last night but I guess I'll put them back away for now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Wobby
Last year Chevron was out of season passes when I tried to get one, decided for grins to check in across the street at Roadrunner and they had them.Quote:
Originally Posted by gimpy
Looks like the forest service sells them also:
You may purchase your Sno-Park permit at the Lake Tahoe Basin Management Unit Forest Supervisor's Office located at 35 College Drive, South Lake Tahoe
Assuming you're referring to the incident three years ago, it wasn't a slide. She fell and banged her head on a rock:Quote:
Originally Posted by gimpy
http://unofficialalpine.com/?p=669 Don't think it was a slide that made her fall either.
That's certainly what made Alpine try to prevent access and put up signs about it. Not sure if that's the rationale for Kirkwood though. Hard to say because Vail started operating Kirkwood that same season, so that could have caused them to start excluding people, but it also could be coincidental. Regardless, marketing/PR is pretty shit rationale for preventing public access, as I'm sure you'd agree.
Anybody know what Vail does at their other properties? (Northstar doesn't count because much of it is on private land.)
You can buy them online. Print out a temporary permit. They'll mail you a formal one within a week or so.Quote:
Originally Posted by gimpy
http://www.ohv.parks.ca.gov/?page_id=1233
Yep, this makes alot of sense. Thanks for the info!Quote:
Originally Posted by LightRanger
And SchralphMacchio - Definitely noted on the vocab and it's a good PSA. Thanks!
What a freakin' nightmare. The damned quail on the hill are bad enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by TahoeJ
http://sdakotabirds.com/species_phot...ia_quail_1.jpg
Looks like they allow it at Vail/BC with the usual caveats.Quote:
Originally Posted by LightRanger
http://www.vail.com/mountain/mountai...ftAccessPolicy
I remember that at Alpine; it was a really sad, pretty freak accident. It was also like the second year KSL had Alpine, so I imagine the liability concerns weighed heavily towards restricting pre-season access.
As far as KW is concerned, I think it would be valuable to figure out exactly where the figurative boundaries are. (If parking in the parking lot is not OK, is parking in the public right-of-way on the street? Shoveling your own spot off the street? Is all access on the slopes prevented, or only on groomers? Or only where there is active snowmaking?)
Currently preseason access is a complete grey area. Forcing them to codify the boundaries will help with two things: 1) It would allow BC skiers to know where they can legitimately ski and skin (presumably this is in the interest of Vailcorp as well). 2) It would require Vailcorp and the USFS to publicly provide evidence of justification of the policy (which may or may not exist, and may demonstrate that there is no basis for restricting access like this).
As snow levels keep climbing up year after year, this is definitely something to work on now since road-accessed BC will become harder to find.
Thanks for covering for my laziness.Quote:
Originally Posted by teledad
That seems like a totally reasonable policy. You can argue with their disallowing of fat bikes (I'd imagine they'd say something like they mess up the corduroy that their clients pay $$$ for), but that's about the only thing to complain about. Looks like they allow dogs on leash at night, but not during the day (assuming that part refers to during the season). Again, totally reasonable, IMO. They make clear that the standard safety rules apply, and, notably, do not require uphill travelers to sign a release or get a ticket (even a free one) like Sugar Bowl has been doing.
Good points. Though resort liability concerns are way overblown. They're very protected. They'll use that as an excuse, but it's largely a BS excuse IMO. I think it's more PR. Your average member of Joe Public wouldn't understand that A/C hadn't started when somebody dies in an "inbounds" slide preseason. To us, it's backcountry. To a non-skier or fairweather skier, it's "Skier Dies in Avalanche at Alpine Meadows." At least that's how the marketing/PR folks would see it.Quote:
Originally Posted by emcee
Also good point on snow levels. We've seen that for the last several seasons, and we'll continue to see it in the future. Definitely something I've been thinking about.
Actually was stoked to see the no drone sign. Can you imagine a busy day with those things buzzing every where. I'll only bring my drones with me into the bc. :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by TahoeJ
Vail has done a good job of placing signage at KW. I'll give them that. They placed a bunch out on the high hike toward Pali that in effect can close down the ridge. That used these early season last year, and during heavy storms. While I miss having the access, I am sure they will prevent some gapers from accidentally skiing down the the lake. In general there is much better signage around the valley. But I know where everything is, so, meh. I'll only be happy once VC opens up the cirque for peeps w a partner and gear.
I'm waiting for nuthons pics, but I might be spending some time this week getting my shit in order.
Lightranger, thanks for the pm and all the work you're doing to keep public lands open to the public. I can easily see the same happening to heave when east bowl slides.
"6. Ensure that holder operations comply with Forest Service regulations (36 CFR 251.55(b)) and permit terms and conditions for non-exclusive use and that the ski area remains open to the non-paying public for all lawful uses that are not inconsistent with the holder’s rights and privileges and public safety. Document in the operating plan authorized restrictions on use by the non-paying public, and require the holder to post these restrictions in locations where they would be effective in informing the public, for example, on the ski area’s website and on site at a primary entrance or public information facility. In most cases, it would not be appropriate for restrictions to preclude all public use during the ski season other than by those purchasing a lift ticket or paying for other services."6
"
1st 3 pic are my deepest turn. Shitty light but you get the idea.
https://www.tetongravity.com/images/...kw1__forum.jpg
https://www.tetongravity.com/images/...kw2__forum.jpg
https://www.tetongravity.com/images/...kw3__forum.jpg
The Frush getting some as well.
https://www.tetongravity.com/images/...kw4__forum.jpg
Jealous!
Where's that text coming from?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Toad