Wagon Stoke

Wish I had the cash lying around to buy the 4S model.

While the regular Panamera, thanks to its large hatch, already is more practical than most luxury sedans, the Sport Turismo widens the gap. There is simply nothing else like it on the market. Audi’s A7 is significantly smaller inside and based on the A6, a car positioned a class below the Panamera. The same is true of the Mercedes-Benz CLS and its not-for-the-U.S. Shooting Brake version, which will be killed in the next model generation. The Tesla Model S is similarly large, but that electric dragster/limousine plays in a class of its own. Some customers may cross-shop the Mercedes-AMG E63 wagon.

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Originally Posted by BmillsSkier

Play around with the Volvo V90/V90XC configurator, you can make some pretty wagons!

http://www.volvocars.com/us/build#wagon

Seriously though, when it's time to upgrade the family hauler I'm focusing hard on Volvo, they're really on point right now.

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I'm with you. I started looking a month or so ago thinking I would pick up a used something or other. After seeing what Volvo's got going on, I'm trying to eek out another summer in my current ride to wait for all the new Volvo has coming later this year.

I dont know guys, every Volvo I see, (when I see them, they usually pass without notice) makes me just kind of go blah. Nice enough, sure. Boooring.

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Originally Posted by liv2ski

Wish I had the cash lying around to buy the 4S model.

While the regular Panamera, thanks to its large hatch, already is more practical than most luxury sedans, the Sport Turismo widens the gap. There is simply nothing else like it on the market. Audi’s A7 is significantly smaller inside and based on the A6, a car positioned a class below the Panamera. The same is true of the Mercedes-Benz CLS and its not-for-the-U.S. Shooting Brake version, which will be killed in the next model generation. The Tesla Model S is similarly large, but that electric dragster/limousine plays in a class of its own. Some customers may cross-shop the Mercedes-AMG E63 wagon.

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Yeah, I'm gonna need that.

It's the practical choice. Seats fold down flatter than many current wagons, making dirtbag sleeping in parking lot a breeze.

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Originally Posted by frorider

It's the practical choice. Seats fold down flatter than many current wagons, making dirtbag sleeping in parking lot a breeze.

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I believe the correct term is Schmutzbeutel?

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Originally Posted by basinbeater

I dont know guys, every Volvo I see, (when I see them, they usually pass without notice) makes me just kind of go blah. Nice enough, sure. Boooring.

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The older body styles -- absolutely. The new look that started with last year's XC90 and this year's V90 -- pretty gorgeous in person.

8 cyl AWD wagon? What's up with MBs? Auto no bueno? Ex: https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto/6021295086.html

What some people think is good enough for a post selling their car is beyond me.

3 random pics and 5 two word sentences to describe it?

Nailed it!

Let's sell this thing!

^^^ great cat; geed deal. 150K vis mucho miles, but if it was taken care of that's only 1/2 a life.

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Originally Posted by BmillsSkier

What some people think is good enough for a post selling their car is beyond me.

3 random pics and 5 two word sentences to describe it?

Nailed it!

Let's sell this thing!

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I know, but what I was really asking was whether MB wagons are any good.

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Originally Posted by 54-46

I know, but what I was really asking was whether MB wagons are any good.

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Ask Tipp I believe he has a 6cyl of that vintage. I believe they're pretty reliable but with anything German and old, one repair can run 1000s.

WSJ reviewed the new eWagon about a month ago. Good read on the car and a brief history.

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Originally Posted by 54-46

I know, but what I was really asking was whether MB wagons are any good.

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Lots of seemingly good to great deals across the country on used MB wagons.

Yeah I'm told by a coworker who's leased several for his wife that steep depreciation is a standard option.

I've always found them to be pretty cars. Check out the fully spec'D e400 picture in that WSJ review on 20" radius style wheels and in navy. It just screams horsey set class.

Should PM 4Matic and have him go check it out for you. He's an MB guy and IIRC lives quite close to where that car is located.

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Originally Posted by LightRanger

Should PM 4Matic and have him go check it out for you. He's an MB guy and IIRC lives quite close to where that car is located.

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Great idea if I were looking right now. I'm scouting ahead for a potential replacement for my wife's X3

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Originally Posted by 54-46

8 cyl AWD wagon? What's up with MBs? Auto no bueno? Ex: https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/cto/6021295086.html

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I have that same car in white. Owned since 2009 when I bought it on eBay drunk. Shipped from Florida with 95k miles. It has 155k now and does hard duty as my Tahoe car. It still looks great. The V8 is a magnificent engine and the transmission is smooth and bulletproof. Quiet car. No air leaks so you can wear shorts in winter. No rattles. Just drove 600 miles in that crazy storm. Idled it for six hours. I do not baby this car.

One of the rear air shocks has leaked since I bought it. Still pumps up. No codes. I replaced one front air shock. The abs pump was replaced on a recall. Tires will last 25k at best. The spark plugs have never been replaced. Mechanic says wait till it starts missing. The problem is the wires probably won't survive a plug swap. 20 mpg driving hard.

That car will have three way adjustable sport suspension and 3/4 inch of lift. I use all of them often.

I've owned a bunch of benzes so glad to help. I'd be happy to help check it out and be the bad friend. You're welcome to check out mine anytime too.

Just in time for potential replacement of my wife's xc70. Something like that benz is spot on other than the 20mpg. But the money saved at that price buys a lot of gas

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Originally Posted by 4matic

I have that same car in white. Owned since 2009 when I bought it on eBay drunk. Shipped from Florida with 95k miles. It has 155k now and does hard duty as my Tahoe car. It still looks great. The V8 is a magnificent engine and the transmission is smooth and bulletproof. Quiet car. No air leaks so you can wear shorts in winter. No rattles. Just drove 600 miles in that crazy storm. Idled it for six hours. I do not baby this car.

One of the rear air shocks has leaked since I bought it. Still pumps up. No codes. I replaced one front air shock. The abs pump was replaced on a recall. Tires will last 25k at best. The spark plugs have never been replaced. Mechanic says wait till it starts missing. The problem is the wires probably won't survive a plug swap. 20 mpg driving hard.

That car will have three way adjustable sport suspension and 3/4 inch of lift. I use all of them often.

I've owned a bunch of benzes so glad to help. I'd be happy to help check it out and be the bad friend. You're welcome to check out mine anytime too.

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Thanks! I ought to come to E Bay and play some golf after it stops raining and pick your brain.

Would probably need a E Bay Indy to do a PPI on a car like the one in the ad. Wife's not ready to give up the X3, but I want to move it before the next big repair.

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Originally Posted by mcski

Just in time for potential replacement of my wife's xc70. Something like that benz is spot on other than the 20mpg. But the money saved at that price buys a lot of gas

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How was your experience with Volvo and the XC70? I've been looking at them a lot as a potential replacement for my current ride.

It's a nice ride and I liked it. We got it used in great cond from a super anal friend of a friend that had it serviced at the dealer but it still managed to rack up a lot of pricey repairs. I was actually kinda glad when it got totaled and we got a decent payout. If you're looking used make sure fuel pump isn't under recall, timing belt is replaced, and engine supports / struts in good shape as it's a heavy car and they wear out. Also the awd can just stop working so there's that. Prob not going there again

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Originally Posted by mcski

It's a nice ride and I liked it. We got it used in great cond from a super anal friend of a friend that had it serviced at the dealer but it still managed to rack up a lot of pricey repairs. I was actually kinda glad when it got totaled and we got a decent payout. If you're looking used make sure fuel pump isn't under recall, timing belt is replaced, and engine supports / struts in good shape as it's a heavy car and they wear out. Also the awd can just stop working so there's that. Prob not going there again

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Not super inspiring. What model year?

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Originally Posted by mcski

It's a nice ride and I liked it. We got it used in great cond from a super anal friend of a friend that had it serviced at the dealer but it still managed to rack up a lot of pricey repairs. I was actually kinda glad when it got totaled and we got a decent payout. If you're looking used make sure fuel pump isn't under recall, timing belt is replaced, and engine supports / struts in good shape as it's a heavy car and they wear out. Also the awd can just stop working so there's that. Prob not going there again

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Al the above is true. My 06 V70R was super cheap to drive for the first 80k miles. Between 80-120k I replaced a lot of parts to keep the car in original condition. The only actual failure was the AWD angle gear at 120k miles which was about a $3k repair.
Since then it has just been normal maintenance for the most part and not to bad. Car is in for a 170k service and needed the parking brake repaired ($400) but other than that a cheap service.
Yurpeon cars cost money to have serviced. Pay $500+ a month to drive a new one or maybe $3k a year on average to maintain a used one.

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Originally Posted by 54-46

Thanks! I ought to come to E Bay and play some golf after it stops raining and pick your brain.

Would probably need a E Bay Indy to do a PPI on a car like the one in the ad. Wife's not ready to give up the X3, but I want to move it before the next big repair.

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Cool. I've had the same Indy mechanic for more than 20 years.

Last night

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...391ddd7793.jpg

Earlier that same day.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...8fa431d435.jpg

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Originally Posted by 4matic

Earlier that same day.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...8fa431d435.jpg

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How often do you have yours in the snow? How does it do, especially during or after a storm? I'm in the mountains a couple of times per month each fall/winter/spring, and I had dismissed the wagons from Audi, Mercedes, BMW -- basically everything other than the Subaru Outback and the Volvo Cross Country models -- because of their lack of ground clearance. I've never ended up high centered in my Honda Element, but I have had a few times where it had trouble getting through some deep stuff, even at 6.9 inches.

My wife's Bmw 530xi is a tank in the snow. It goes.

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Originally Posted by burrito

How often do you have yours in the snow? How does it do, especially during or after a storm? I'm in the mountains a couple of times per month each fall/winter/spring, and I had dismissed the wagons from Audi, Mercedes, BMW -- basically everything other than the Subaru Outback and the Volvo Cross Country models -- because of their lack of ground clearance. I've never ended up high centered in my Honda Element, but I have had a few times where it had trouble getting through some deep stuff, even at 6.9 inches.

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Good question. I drive snowy plowed high altitude roads all the time in all conditions. The last storm was crazy because the roads weren't really plowed. The car does have 3/4 inch extra clearance which puts maximum clearance around 5.9 inches. Pretty low. I had snow over the bumper a couple times and was buried. First time ever.

Overall, the car is excellent in snow. But, you do need good tires. My current tires Michelin Pilot 2 or something are crap in snow. The MVV was so much better and the Pilot Alpine is another step up. It has traction control (ESP) that works very well.

clearance for driving snow only does so much for you. ime, driving into deep snow, e.g. a drift, pull out, area that is deeper than expected, usually happens with some momentum and more clearance only means more shoveling to get unstuck. also an inch or two never seems to make a big difference getting over a plow berm.

clearance, angles, etc. on a dirt/rocky road is a different beast.

also posting because of the fun of getting face shots while driving. had a day in the big CA winter storm right before the deluge that resulted in the jan 1997 floods where those were the only face shots of the day on hwy 88 (in a pathfinder). good times.

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Originally Posted by 4matic

Overall, the car is excellent in snow. But, you do need good tires.

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On that note I'll vouch for my Toyo Open Country A/T IIs. They've been awesome in the snow and have lasted much longer than I thought they would. The Open Country is the SUV/truck version, and I think the car version they recommend for wagons is called the Celsius.

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Originally Posted by burrito

Not super inspiring. What model year?

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Ya. I wish it was more inspiring because I liked driving it, it had great storage, fast and it did well in the snow - until I noticed the awd had utterly quit right before it got totaled.

It was an 04 w about 80k on it when it was about ~5yrs old I think. We had it for ~7yrs and got the odo up to 150k. The price was really good which made the 100k service cost go down a little easier. Also the ins paid us out well just 3k below what we had paid so it made the annual cost great in retrospect

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Originally Posted by mcski

Ya. I wish it was more inspiring because I liked driving it, it had great storage, fast and it did well in the snow - until I noticed the awd had utterly quit right before it got totaled.

It was an 04 w about 80k on it when it was about ~5yrs old I think. We had it for ~7yrs and got the odo up to 150k. The price was really good which made the 100k service cost go down a little easier. Also the ins paid us out well just 3k below what we had paid so it made the annual cost great in retrospect

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I'm pretty sure the angle gear (awd) issue is with old Volvo's (similar to your 04). I remember slipping into the service area to grill a poor tech about it at the Volvo dealer when my wife was out test driving her XC70 because I had heard about it here and on sites like Swedespeed. He told me it was a prior design error that Volvo remedied and changed. IIRC they even paid out to owners of that era for the issue.

TL;DR it used to be a problem but isn't anymore.

http://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/the-20...bia-1793039416

The Volvo crosstrek details.

I normally hate crossovers with a level of ambivalence that they deserve, but that looks pretty damn sharp. Like a shrunken XC90 which is the best looking SUV out these days. Whoever is running the design team over there right now is earning their paycheck, that's for sure. Best looking stuff out of any of the luxury brands. Whoever is in charge of putting fake vents and hockey sticks on every damned car at BMW should take notice - and while he's at it, send a fucking 5 series wagon over here too.

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Originally Posted by BmillsSkier

I normally hate crossovers with a level of ambivalence that they deserve, but that looks pretty damn sharp. Like a shrunken XC90 which is the best looking SUV out these days. Whoever is running the design team over there right now is earning their paycheck, that's for sure. Best looking stuff out of any of the luxury brands. Whoever is in charge of putting fake vents and hockey sticks on every damned car at BMW should take notice - and while he's at it, send a fucking 5 series wagon over here too.

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I totally agree. The Volvos coming down the pike are why I decided to try to hold out until later this year after I started looking for something new a month or so ago.

It's an 07. We like it. A lot.

My doggies can't jump up in a SUV, hence the need for a wagon for them and I just like a wagon better for me. God dammit, someone bring a wagon to the USA I gotta have that doesn't set me back $110k. Please.........

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Originally Posted by liv2ski

My doggies can't jump up in a SUV, hence the need for a wagon for them and I just like a wagon better for me. God dammit, someone bring a wagon to the USA I gotta have that doesn't set me back $110k. Please.........

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I was hopeful when Honda released the Accord Crosstour a few years ago, but I think poor gas mileage coupled with interior space closer to that a standard hatchback than a full-on wagon sunk that ship. It's a shame they never took a second crack at that car.

Crosstour was not a wagon. Why they didn't go full steam at the outback I will never understand.

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Originally Posted by kai_ski

Crosstour was not a wagon. Why they didn't go full steam at the outback I will never understand.

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I'll take it one step further. Why does BMW make a lifted half attempted wagon-turned hatchback version of the 3 series as well as a half attempted wagon-turned hatchback version of the four door version of the two door version of the 3 series? Also why do they make a half attempted wagon-turned hatchback version of the 5 series that's actually on a 7 series chassis? Also why do they make a half attempted coupe-turned hatchback version of the X5 that's supposed to be the lifted version of the four door version of the two door 6 series?

I'll tell you why. Because too many Americans are willing to fork over good money for any shit design that's slightly lifted like a sport utility but still (in some distant universe) considered sporty, in that soccer-mom-appealing demo called a crossover. And wagons are still thought to be driven only by east coast pseudo-intellectuals, liberal arts college freshmen, and the partridge family.

The fact that actual car enthusiasts like wagons is lost on the general public and whose cries are only really heard on places like this one and jalopnik.

I understand but Honda already had/has more shitty crossovers (not unlike BMW) than I can keep track of and the Crosstour was a complete flop!

How many outbacks does Subaru sell? Does no one else want part of that market? I mean vw just released the alltrack but it's significantly smaller and more expensive. The tdi golf sportwagen we just sold back was a driving revelation after 5 years in an outback but the tsi is comparatively underpowered due to excessive turbo lag. Will not buy.