4FRNT Renegade ~ Hand built in SLC.

mounts on the 196-

I'm thinking about mounting:
plums @-5 from center (93cms from the tail)
fks 180s @-7 from center (91cms from the tail)

Obviously the plums are going to be for bc skiing, of which there will be more untouched pow- do I have to worry about tip sinkage or anything like that? I'm 6'1 155 so pretty light, but I don't want to be fighting the tips all the way down. The fks mount will be for pure inbounds charging days, which is why I had it further back originally. Should I swap the two (plums at -7, fks at -5), so that in the bc, I'm not as worried about float, and inbounds I have more of the slarvey/quick feeling?

I had mine at 88 originally, remouted at 87. I like 87 better - feels a little bit more traditional without giving much up at all in maneuverability.

5'9" 160lb.

My 186 was at rec -5. Only issue I had was setup sierra cement. Everthing else (including groomers), utah blower was insane, drifty and floaty.
6'2 175

196 at BC.com for $640 is sweet. I preordered mine figuring powder would be here by now. Will try then at Baker and whistler now. But build quality, indie and shape are great

Question for 4FRNT

I finally noticed (clearly it isn't a big deal...) but I bought skis this year with a birth date of Nov 16th, 2011 No.573 and they have the old top sheet (crow at the bottom vs trees) with the newer bases (orange tips). Is this because there were extra "older-style" top-sheets kicking around? just curious

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Originally Posted by Bird Blaster

Question for 4FRNT

I finally noticed (clearly it isn't a big deal...) but I bought skis this year with a birth date of Nov 16th, 2011 No.573 and they have the old top sheet (crow at the bottom vs trees) with the newer bases (orange tips). Is this because there were extra "older-style" top-sheets kicking around? just curious

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Yeah, we actually had to re-press a handful of skis this summer after we had some minor base issues (the orange in the tip was only on the surface of the material for some of the skis, so when we ran them through the base finisher, some of the white showed through). We had some extra topsheets from last year laying around, and used those instead of incurring further delays.

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Originally Posted by 4FRNT

Yeah, we actually had to re-press a handful of skis this summer after we had some minor base issues (the orange in the tip was only on the surface of the material for some of the skis, so when we ran them through the base finisher, some of the white showed through). We had some extra topsheets from last year laying around, and used those instead of incurring further delays.

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Awesome! Thanks

What Skins are you using for your 196 Renegades?

I liked clips and weight of G3 and were on some sales lately

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Originally Posted by |K_M|

mounts on the 196-

I'm thinking about mounting:
plums @-5 from center (93cms from the tail)
fks 180s @-7 from center (91cms from the tail)

Obviously the plums are going to be for bc skiing, of which there will be more untouched pow- do I have to worry about tip sinkage or anything like that? I'm 6'1 155 so pretty light, but I don't want to be fighting the tips all the way down. The fks mount will be for pure inbounds charging days, which is why I had it further back originally. Should I swap the two (plums at -7, fks at -5), so that in the bc, I'm not as worried about float, and inbounds I have more of the slarvey/quick feeling?

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Anyone got input? I'm a lanky mother fucker, 6'1 155 so I don't think float will be as big of an issue- ill be touring for the goods, and skiing these inbounds as days when I want to charge- should I go fks at -7 and plums at -5? thats kinda what im thinking now....not really sure, input would be nice!

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Originally Posted by |K_M|

Anyone got input? I'm a lanky mother fucker, 6'1 155 so I don't think float will be as big of an issue- ill be touring for the goods, and skiing these inbounds as days when I want to charge- should I go fks at -7 and plums at -5? thats kinda what im thinking now....not really sure, input would be nice!

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I think you'd be ok float-wise with the Plums at -5, but we do recommend mounting at -6 for your best all-around skiing. I know that may not be possible if you want two sets of holes...

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Originally Posted by 4FRNT

I think you'd be ok float-wise with the Plums at -5, but we do recommend mounting at -6 for your best all-around skiing. I know that may not be possible if you want two sets of holes...

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I'm trying to get both of the mounts as close to that as possible, I just think I'll go with plums in front of it and fks behind. Thanks for the help!

K_M, have you seen the new DynaLook plate from bindingfreedom? Might be the answer to all your woes. I personally take off the heel plate for touring and mount the heel directly to the ski. Saves weight and eliminates the ramp angle of the tech binder.

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Originally Posted by auvgeek

K_M, have you seen the new DynaLook plate from bindingfreedom? Might be the answer to all your woes. I personally take off the heel plate for touring and mount the heel directly to the ski. Saves weight and eliminates the ramp angle of the tech binder.

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Yeah I have, but after printing off the paper templates and comparing them it doesn't look like it'll be too hard, and I don't really want to purchase and mount the plates- great idea though.

4frnt: are the hoji samples/demos made in the elan factory, or in SLC? any planed changes from sample to the production version?

mntlion - not sure about any changes from sample to production, but I am 99.9999% sure the Hoji is going to be made in the Elan factory and only the Renegade will be built in the Whiteroom...

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Originally Posted by Undertow

mntlion - not sure about any changes from sample to production, but I am 99.9999% sure the Hoji is going to be made in the Elan factory and only the Renegade will be built in the Whiteroom...

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yup, I agree, thats what I have heard too.

what I want to know is where the samples, current demos are made.

Mtlion-sure 4frnt will confirm but I was told the wood sidewall protos were SLC, later demos had reg sidewalls and Elan.

Other owners-have a pair of the 186 11/12s that I thought were supposed to have a bit more tip rise than the 10/11s. Mine have a bit more curve but actual rise the same.

Can anybody else confirm theirs has 2.5" of tip height (floor to ptex)?

196 rip it, pow, steeps, trees and GS groomers
-6 rocks it, well done 4frnt

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Originally Posted by mntlion

4frnt: are the hoji samples/demos made in the elan factory, or in SLC? any planed changes from sample to the production version?

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All of the samples/demos of the HOJI will come from the Elan factory, as well as all of the production HOJIs. Renegades will stay entirely in the White Room.

There is some talk of making the HOJI marginally stiffer than the samples we got, but I can't really confirm either way at this point. My guess is that we won't make any flex changes until next year.

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Originally Posted by whyturn

196 rip it, pow, steeps, trees and GS groomers
-6 rocks it, well done 4frnt

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Awesome. Thanks Whyturn! Glad you're stoked on them.

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Originally Posted by 4FRNT

There is some talk of making the HOJI marginally stiffer than the samples we got, but I can't really confirm either way at this point. My guess is that we won't make any flex changes until next year.

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I'm pretty interested in Hojis for next winter, and definitely interested in stiff skis so put me down for a vote for stiff.

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Originally Posted by otto parts

Mtlion-sure 4frnt will confirm but I was told the wood sidewall protos were SLC, later demos had reg sidewalls and Elan.

Other owners-have a pair of the 186 11/12s that I thought were supposed to have a bit more tip rise than the 10/11s. Mine have a bit more curve but actual rise the same.

Can anybody else confirm theirs has 2.5" of tip height (floor to ptex)?

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Mine have 5" of tip splay (ptex-to-ptex) base to base (so, 2.5")

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Originally Posted by Toby

I'm pretty interested in Hojis for next winter, and definitely interested in stiff skis so put me down for a vote for stiff.

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They definitely aren't noodles to begin with, and any changes we made would be pretty small. We mostly want to make sure our production skis match our final prototypes flex-wise.

I finally had a brief chance to try out the Renegades, swapping my 190cm DPS 112WailerRP Pures for one run with a client in shin deep untracked pow while cat-skiing. First impressions - heavy, required lots of effort to turn, awkward at slow speeds, surprisingly little float (tips dived). When I straight lined to get up to speed they at least felt stable, but overall very dissapointed. It was only one run, but the client instantly loved my Wailers.

^^^^wailer is a lazy mans pow tool that really has some float issues at 190 and 112 waist. Renegade is a serious ski for charging and slashing and slarving. I suggest your "client" work on staying forward...

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Originally Posted by kootenayskier

I finally had a brief chance to try out the Renegades, swapping my 190cm DPS 112WailerRP Pures for one run with a client in shin deep untracked pow while cat-skiing. First impressions - heavy, required lots of effort to turn, awkward at slow speeds, surprisingly little float (tips dived). When I straight lined to get up to speed they at least felt stable, but overall very dissapointed. It was only one run, but the client instantly loved my Wailers.

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Definitely took me more than one run to get used to them, but if you're looking for easy slow speed turns the dps 112 is your tool, though I've had no problem skiing my Renegades all over at all speeds and in all conditions. Finally got some knee deep untracked turns on them yesterday, no tip dive issues at all mounted at 87 from the tail. First true pow turns on the remount. So fast on plane.... mmmmmm.

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Originally Posted by whyturn

^^^^wailer is a lazy mans pow tool that really has some float issues at 190 and 112 waist. Renegade is a serious ski for charging and slashing and slarving. I suggest your "client" work on staying forward...

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In fact, it is the most serious ski ever built for the most serious skier ever. There exists in California legislation requiring the owners of these skis to at all times wear a fullface . . . EVEN OFF THE HILL. These skis are so hardcore that if you are in the backseat for even a turn, they self destruct in an explosion that leaves wood splinters and other detritus permanently lodged in the poser's face.

These skis will literally make you take a step back and fuck your own face.
These skis should not be left alone without adult supervision around children under the age of 18.
Lemmy of Motorhead once tried to strap on these bad boys. They ass raped him and then called in all its brethren to run an extremely degrading train on Lemmy in front of his mother.

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Originally Posted by adam

These skis will literally make you take a step back and fuck your own face.

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Giggity giggity.

All I was trying to say is that in last MSP flick Hoji had no issues with dive in 4 foot pillow blower in interior BC. I find with a ski this good it's usually operator error not the ski. I have had days with some really good models where I failed to ski them to their potential and I flailed.

But I find renegades will roll over most anything including small groms and badgers. These skis will ski themselves back to the lodge and leave you looking for a ride home in the horse drawn carraige.

After one run, I was disappointed. After two runs, I was starting to see why people liked these skis. After 3 runs, I was stoked. YMMV. FYI, this was the 186 and coming from a 202 Lotus 138 earlier that day. The Renegades do not charge as hard (maybe the 196 does), but they are very playful in the trees when piloted correctly. I needed something for trees that can still charge, and the 186 is perfect. Like all skis I like, it's not a ski for the timid but it really rewards good style.

Working on a full review soon.

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Originally Posted by adam

Lemmy of Motorhead once tried to strap on these bad boys. They ass raped him and then called in all its brethren to run an extremely degrading train on Lemmy in front of his mother.

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This is a sad, but true, story. Lemmy never had a chance. :(

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There exists in California legislation requiring the owners of these skis to at all times wear a fullface . . . EVEN OFF THE HILL.

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Dude it's LA, we have to wear a fullface at Starbucks.........It's scary out here:fm:

I can see where Kootney is coming from. If I happened to be Cat-skiing and my Rens magically showed up at the top on the second day, I'd be bummed about how they skied too.

I know Whyturn has owned both the 112 and the Ren so he's not just spouting shit. To acknowledge his reference to how they look in ski films, the Renegades need to be skied on steep faces or pillow droppy kinda pow terrain which all of the athletes are on all the time. They tend to not film less than death defying runs. IMO, they suck at skiing extended sections of flatter deep pow.

I have enough boards now to realize that each ski has it's own individualized personality rife with both strengths and weaknesses.

10/11, 186 - mounted at both 86 and 88
5'8 160lbs

Thanks Dude, I actually skiied 196 all week in Utah and Wyoming. both steep and low angle. POW, trees, glades, groomers, ICE and windbuff. 196 was way better than my 186 at low angle and in flat sections they trucked. The 196 is a winner and super easy, like a 188-190. Love IT!!!!

Buddy demoed everything under the sun (Icelantic, wailer, R2, and others I forgot) wailer sank in 12-16" softies in WY. R2 was fun as expected and float was better. Icelantic Keeper was too stiff for him (6' - 160)

I am highly impressed with the Ren's and feel they are truly a one ski quiver for out west (196 anyways)....

But so many good skis right now, great time to be a skier and have so many choices - HOJI and 4FRNT killed it on this one.........

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Originally Posted by whyturn

Thanks Dude, I actually skiied 196 all week in Utah and Wyoming. both steep and low angle. POW, trees, glades, groomers, ICE and windbuff. 196 was way better than my 186 at low angle and in flat sections they trucked. The 196 is a winner and super easy, like a 188-190. Love IT!!!!

Buddy demoed everything under the sun (Icelantic, wailer, R2, and others I forgot) wailer sank in 12-16" softies in WY. R2 was fun as expected and float was better. Icelantic Keeper was too stiff for him (6' - 160)

I am highly impressed with the Ren's and feel they are truly a one ski quiver for out west (196 anyways)....

But so many good skis right now, great time to be a skier and have so many choices - HOJI and 4FRNT killed it on this one.........

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DUDE! Why do you gotta be that way?!!? WHY do you have to INSIST that I spend the remainder of my season's savings on 196's? It's YOUR fault! It's all your damn fault. For Fargo's sake, I thought I was over this...

I'm biased by the conditions we had last week. Could have skiied any rockered and been happy.

I got 7" and 25 lbs on ya, just go faster like Hoji does:rolleyes2

Haha... I love my Rens now and have them 'figured out'. Plus I never ever ever ski anything but the most EXTREME STEEP-TECH terrain so float in the flats is a non-issue ;)

Finally got my 196s in working order, currently with plums but mounted with inserts @ sports creel in spokane (thank you so much micah. so so much, you put a ton of work into these and it shows. THANKS!). fucking beautiful skis.

http://i.imgur.com/5wVcL.png

http://i.imgur.com/k44Td.png

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Originally Posted by 4FRNT

All of the samples/demos of the HOJI will come from the Elan factory, as well as all of the production HOJIs. Renegades will stay entirely in the White Room.

There is some talk of making the HOJI marginally stiffer than the samples we got, but I can't really confirm either way at this point. My guess is that we won't make any flex changes until next year.

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@ 4FRNT, next year is that then 2013/2014 range or are we talking about the skis that will be in shops next winter ? 2012/2013 ?