Tell me about your minivan

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Originally Posted by mcphee

^that blows


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Yep. It's one of the things that put me off the Sienna (and becoming a 2 minivan family). You have to pry off trim, unscrew things, etc. I just looked up though and someone has developed an "airbag testing module" that you can install once you remove the seats to prevent the van from throwing a code. They're only $16 a piece, so $32 to get rid of the problem isn't too bad, but still it's not something you're going to take out to haul something unwieldy then put back in in 30 seconds after you unload.

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Originally Posted by Not DJSapp

Towing and ground clearance vs. interior space and head/legroom. I need head/legroom every single day no matter what I'm doing, and if I have adults riding with, the 2nd row in a minivan is more comfortable than any SUV. With a name of CAgrown, I'm assuming you never left CA. Which likely means you don't live in the snow, you only visit it. And that means any time you need more clearance to drive through snow than a minivan can handle, Caltrans has alreadly closed all the roads. So you don't need the SUV unless you're dragging a trailer around on the regular.

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Living in the pnw for a few years now and encounter some deep roads and parking lots on occasion. The lift would be helpful for shuttling and camping on washed out logging roads in the summertime mostly.

While we are sticking with 1 kid of our own I am the cool uncle and will be hauling my neice-in-law and probably my son's future friends to the mountains so that's where the extra capacity helps.

Currently in a 04 4runner which works perfectly for everything but safety. Even with shitty mpg it's way better for the environment to run it longer than it is to buy a new car, but 20yr old safety features ain't great.

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Originally Posted by bodywhomper

At the grocery store this evening. Syncro, if you can’t read it. What’s the ladder for?
Attachment 425536

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Wrong thread jong.... 100%gotos 1pointer

Yeah the stow and go seats in the Dodge/Chrysler are why I ended up with a Grand Caravan rather than a Sienna. Well, that and the Toyota tax... I'm mostly glad I did too because being able to reconfigure the inside in minutes has come in handy a few times, having an 8 foot long, flat floor is really nice and with the middle seat(s) up there's a huge hidden storage compartment under the floor.

I get the anti-ChryCo sentiment but, like anything else with all the recalls and shit now and people ignoring regular maintenance the way they do I think that some of the old negative sentiment can fade because they're really pretty good vehicles. On the forums people really seem to be liking them and unlike so many cars talked about on forums the Pacifica doesn't seem to get bashed nearly as often.

I have a 2016 Highlander which I hate and a 2011 Sienna FWD which I love. Our neighbor needed a kid and Costco sized grocery hauler so she leased the first year of the new style Sienna because she liked her previous one. She didn't like the new one and after not very long ended up with a Highlander. If I had the cash I'd go buy a used N-1 AWD Sienna right now as my utility vehicle and keep it forever. I'm not sure about the current Siennas being as useful to me, they are also smaller inside. Removable 2nd row seats are essential to my use of the Sienna as a utility wagon. I don't need to haul the whole family around anymore. I do however find myself helping the kids move. The youngest graduates from HS this year.

Towing a camper with the Sienna does have limitations and I have to be careful in some driveways in town even without a trailer due to how and where the whole assembly has to be mounted. I was told that if I did a lot of camping I should get airbags installed for the rear suspension. Or get a different tow vehicle. I think the Toyota tow package for the Highlander has a different bumper that allows for a higher mount point that passes through instead of going under. It would be cool if that was available for the Sienna. Maybe check out the current tow package option if going new to see how it mounts?

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Originally Posted by Yonder_River

The 3" seems too much and starts making the rig look a bit odd imo. Most report no difference in handling - although I think most dealerships don't "recommend" it.

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It’d be hard to do something to make the handling feel different. They are decidedly not fun to drive, even if they’re perfectly pleasant to go on a road trip in. Comfortable and smooth is what you’re getting, and that’s just fine when you’ve got your family in the back.

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Originally Posted by MarcusBrody

Yep. It's one of the things that put me off the Sienna (and becoming a 2 minivan family). You have to pry off trim, unscrew things, etc. I just looked up though and someone has developed an "airbag testing module" that you can install once you remove the seats to prevent the van from throwing a code. They're only $16 a piece, so $32 to get rid of the problem isn't too bad, but still it's not something you're going to take out to haul something unwieldy then put back in in 30 seconds after you unload.

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It wasn’t a 30 second job with the prior gen either…. It was a moderate PITA to lug the seat in and line everything up. Especially because you can’t unsee all the French fries and chicken nuggets that you’ve been riding around with and have to do some cleaning now, too.

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Originally Posted by gravitylover

Yeah the stow and go seats in the Dodge/Chrysler are why I ended up with a Grand Caravan rather than a Sienna. Well, that and the Toyota tax... I'm mostly glad I did too because being able to reconfigure the inside in minutes has come in handy a few times, having an 8 foot long, flat floor is really nice and with the middle seat(s) up there's a huge hidden storage compartment under the floor.

I get the anti-ChryCo sentiment but, like anything else with all the recalls and shit now and people ignoring regular maintenance the way they do I think that some of the old negative sentiment can fade because they're really pretty good vehicles. On the forums people really seem to be liking them and unlike so many cars talked about on forums the Pacifica doesn't seem to get bashed nearly as often.

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I agree. I’m a Chrysler hater from way back- not for the maintenance/quality issues but because I hated how they drove. I drove a rental minivan a few years ago and it was completely different. I don’t think anybody makes shitty cars anymore.

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Originally Posted by mcphee

What size lift did they have? What’s on yours?

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Mines 3" -- i believe they had the same. I have adjustable airbags as well in back. Those are stock size snows which look piddly. I run AT3Ws between April-Oct in a slightly larger size. Clearance during summer is about 9.5"/10".

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Originally Posted by gravitylover

Yeah the stow and go seats in the Dodge/Chrysler are why I ended up with a Grand Caravan rather than a Sienna. Well, that and the Toyota tax...

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Those "Stow 'N Go" seats are SUPER handy. Got really spoiled when I rented one whilst I happened to be moving. And yup. The Toyota tax is real. I know your engine/trans issues have been annoying to deal with, but for the price of your van AND a new engine AND trans, you're still in for like $10K less than a 20 year old Sienna with half a million miles. Haha. I exaggerate, but still. That was my experience when shopping for a 4x4 vehicle years back. I'd still trust the Toyota more long term though for more trouble free miles overall. You're gonna pay for that "luxury" though.

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Originally Posted by nickwm21

Any opinions on those small commercial style vans; NV200, Transit Connect, Promaster City, Metris, etc….

I know they aren’t “cool” but in passenger build with AWD - they’d be a pretty functional grocery getter / kid hauler. They seem like they would have more headroom, storage, and access (sliding door) than a similar small SUV or crossover but with a better price tag.


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I've been thinking about a smaller better fuel mileage like you state. They are seeming to be in more demand than the traditional Chrysler, Ford, Chevy Mini Vans. Especially the Dodge Ram ProMasters are pricey even used. They also have multiple models- like the Transit from Ford in a 150, 250, etc. and then the NV in a NV100, NV200 as size goes up.

Any that I see used (not a real complete search though using sites like Autotrader, Carfax, Carmax, Edmunds, Kelly, Cars, Cargurus, etc. that list both dealer/reseller and private. Pretty much see what I would consider pretty high mileage vans (more than 200K) that are 10 years or more old and going for $8500 up to $17K still. So fleet vehicles used to be regularly turned over, and I think companies have due to the shortages kept them much longer and the pricing is still reflecting a pretty good premium.

Other option is to fix up an older station wagon which can almost haul as much (including a piece of plywood) as the smaller minivans unless they have the higher extended roofs.

Electric or Hybrid are usually needed to not be in the 25 MPG or lower fuel usage from what I've read so far. But much better than sub 20 MPG with fuel pricing of any SUV or even some soccer Mom vans... Those are even bigger dollars again due to demand and limiting the models out there.

Any comments on the VW Vans (not the old school air cooled)- Minibuses but Rautan?

The Routan is a rebadged Caravan.

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Originally Posted by Yonder_River

There really isn't any data to back up that concern. Anything with a third row is going to be closer to the back end, and in many of the third row midsize SUVs, there's much less space.

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i don't like putting people in the third row of my volvo xc 90

Middle row is likely safest, but there don’t seem to be a massive number of deaths from sitting in the back. This article doesn’t break it down, but I assume a the back seat of a minivan or full size SUV would be safer than a mid size SUV.

“Here’s The Exact Number of People Who Died Sitting In Third Row SeatsWe asked IIHS if they could tell us how many third-row passengers died in the last year for which full data is available from just rear-ending crashes. Not rollovers, side-impact, front impacts, and all that jazz. We were not hopeful that the answer would be possible, but our contact took some time to look into it and then told us. The answer is 14 individuals. 6 in the left third-row seat, 3 in the center third-row seat, and 5 in the right third-row seat. The data did not include ages and genders, and frankly, I didn’t want to know. Let’s make the assumption that these were children. We may also assume that there were not 14 incidents, but fewer. It may be true that one or more crashes killed multiple individuals at once. It’s too horrid to look more closely at this data.
You Decide - Are Third Row Seats Death Traps?
So now we know the answer. In 2019 there were over a trillion passenger miles covered. 36,096 fatalities in all occurred covering those miles. And fourteen individuals lost their lives sitting in third-row seats due to rear impacts. Here is one unfortunate truth that makes the third-row seat hard to call the death seat. 1,092 vehicle occupants were killed in rear-end crashes NOT seated in the third row, but in either the front row or second row.”

https://www.torquenews.com/1083/are-...k-they-are/amp

Our 2006 sienna has been awesome. We keep on mechanical good shape, but beat on it pretty hard. On our current road trip we passed an awd hybrid sienna and my wife’s curiosity was perked. We have toyed with the idea of replacing the van in the past. Seems the right thing is to start that transition to higher fuel economy, ie get a hybrid or E vehicle.

With the sienna awd hybrids, it sounds challenging, but not insurmountable, to have a workaround to be able to take out the second row seats. Is that right? Are they only available in the top trim level?

We are a Toyota family mostly because we have a good indie mechanic that only works on Toyotas. Am I missing anything with other brands of vans?

Any good suggestions of best method these days to buy used? I haven’t bought a car since 2015. We’d be getting a loan. I fucking hate buying cars.

Is there a workaround to remove the 2nd row seats? I thought they are permanent because of the airbags.

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Originally Posted by riser4

Is there a workaround to remove the 2nd row seats? I thought they are permanent because of the airbags.

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https://youtu.be/24cYWBiTUwY

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Originally Posted by Brownski

I agree. I’m a Chrysler hater from way back- not for the maintenance/quality issues but because I hated how they drove. I drove a rental minivan a few years ago and it was completely different. I don’t think anybody makes shitty cars anymore.

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In all fairness it does ride and drive like shit. It's bouncy, wallowy, leans into everything and it has this hollow boingy sensation when encountering any sharp impacts. Nothing surprising though as every FWD ChryCo product has felt the same since the K Cars came out, it started when they went to torsion bar suspensions in the late 60s. The newest vans appear to finally have that solved.

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Originally Posted by MontuckyFried

Those "Stow 'N Go" seats are SUPER handy. Got really spoiled when I rented one whilst I happened to be moving. And yup. The Toyota tax is real. I know your engine/trans issues have been annoying to deal with, but for the price of your van AND a new engine AND trans, you're still in for like $10K less than a 20 year old Sienna with half a million miles. Haha. I exaggerate, but still. That was my experience when shopping for a 4x4 vehicle years back. I'd still trust the Toyota more long term though for more trouble free miles overall. You're gonna pay for that "luxury" though.

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Yeah I'm in for about 65% of the $22k it sold for new in 2015 but it's mostly refreshed and has no rust. I know it has one more biggie coming when the tranny finally shits the bed (which is inevitable) and I'm sure that age will cause some angst too but it's still going to be less than half what a new one costs. This year is headed in the right direction for me so I should be able to get into something more appropriate for a daily and turn this into a total utility/work/fun rig and run it into the ground.

Of all the new minivans available now I think I only like the 2 AWD ones, Toyota and Chrysler hybrids but that seat thing ruins the Sienna for me.

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Originally Posted by riser4

Is there a workaround to remove the 2nd row seats? I thought they are permanent because of the airbags.

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Most airbag systems work on looking for 2.2 ohms from the devices(seat belt tensioner, airbags etc.) so a 2.2 ohm resister plugged into the yellow connector can trick the system into thinking you have a working device and not trigger the airbag light. In this case that would be just fine but this is how people that sell super glue and bondo repair cars get around fucked up airbag systems they resell. It's fairly handy for trouble shooting airbag light issues and you don't have the factory scanner or software.

https://bradshacks.com/product/airbag-simulator/

Dummy resistor plugs for airbag connectors on Gen4 Siennas

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Originally Posted by J. Barron DeJong

https://youtu.be/24cYWBiTUwY

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Jeebus! I think I'd rather buy a used gen n-1 without the middle row airbags (2020?). They are roomier and if I found a good one, it'd last as I need at this point in my life. Ya, hybrid would be nice, however, that's not really why I want it. One of my other vehicles can be hybrid or ev.

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Originally Posted by mcphee

https://bradshacks.com/product/airbag-simulator/

Dummy resistor plugs for airbag connectors on Gen4 Siennas

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I may end up ordering these. My Sienna is supposed to be ready some time in May. Will have taken ten months by then. Glad I’m not in a hurry

Yeah, what a junk show. Why did Toyota cut out the"utility minivan" people? I suppose the seats can be nicer and include airbags if they are much more difficult to remove, but surely they could have found a way to give us both.

That seat situation is a total boner killer for me. Otherwise i was dreaming about a hybrid Sienna.

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Originally Posted by climberevan

Yeah, what a junk show. Why did Toyota cut out the"utility minivan" people?

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Those people don't buy new minivans. :fmicon:

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Originally Posted by skaredshtles

Those people don't buy new minivans. :fmicon:

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Tru dat. We are usually dirt bag kooks.

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Originally Posted by riser4

Tru dat. We are usually dirt bag kooks.

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This ^^

Anyone interested in an '01 Odyssey with 240K miles on it? Might make for an OK "utility minivan."

:fmicon: