Another What Car Thread: Big-ish SUV's (or Minivan?)

We just went through this in late ‘21. Started looking at xc90 but decided the maintenance was going to be a challenge (live in a remote area). Then peaked at; telluride, pilot, cx9, and highlander. And the mdx…forgot about that.

Telluride was our fave but the thing was loaded with features. On a first gen car we had a hard time with that. Plus they’re like 50k. For a fucking Kia.

Then went through the others….drove them all. Some for multiple days. Mdx was too small and had no captains seat option at the time. Same for the pilot I think. Pilot was also sorta pricey and wasn’t getting awesome reviews. So we moved to the Highlander figuring all prices equal, get the yota. Highlander was a great option but we actually found the ascent had more space in the 3rd row, did better on fuel, and was quite a bit cheaper.

Ended with the ascent. 30k miles so far and it’s fine. I don’t love it, but I don’t think I would’ve loved anything that we were looking at unless it was a bmw or a Volvo. Im a snot I guess. They’re just all built for function, which I appreciate. The ascent is functional and was reasonably priced. I’d not write it off since they’re all watered down imo. Drives like a car with space like a suv. And bomber in the snow, and we drive in the snow almost daily here.

Side note I kinda wanted a Pacifica but wifey said no way she’s driving a van.


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Originally Posted by gaijin

Also, all car controls should be on the steering wheel at this point. My stereo buttons and sensor options are on the wheel, but my heating/AC should be, too.

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Tangent rant: all stereo controls should be on the left side of the steering wheel (on left hand drive cars). My current and previous car both have 4 different ways I can adjust volume or skip a track with my right hand, and zero ways to do that with my left hand. And I'm usually a only-the-left-hand-on-the-wheel kind of guy.

I think I've decided. Looking for a low mileage 17-19 Highlander Hybrid with leatherish seats and as few other features as as possible. There are good deals on low mileage used Pilots right now, and I prefer it to the Highlander, but there are a lot more Pilot owners complaining about their cars than Highlander owners. No doubt it is a small but vocal minority, but more than anything else I want this car to be utilitarian and easy to own. If I sell it in 3 three years to buy an EV it should still be worth plenty. And if I drive it into the ground like I did my Volvo it should handle that better than just about anything. Like justcuz said, none of these cars are exciting. I just want to ski, fish, bike, roadtrip and not worry about the car. Plus it burns less gas. And my younger kid won't be too big for the 3rd for for a loooooooong time.

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Originally Posted by I've seen black diamonds!

I think I've decided. Looking for a low mileage 17-19 Highlander Hybrid with leatherish seats and as few other features as as possible. There are good deals on low mileage used Pilots right now, and I prefer it to the Highlander, but there are a lot more Pilot owners complaining about their cars than Highlander owners. No doubt it is a small but vocal minority, but more than anything else I want this car to be utilitarian and easy to own. If I sell it in 3 three years to buy an EV it should still be worth plenty. And if I drive it into the ground like I did my Volvo it should handle that better than just about anything. Like justcuz said, none of these cars are exciting. I just want to ski, fish, bike, roadtrip and not worry about the car. Plus it burns less gas. And my younger kid won't be too big for the 3rd for for a loooooooong time.

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Smart move me thinks. Good luck with the search.


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Highlander is a great choice. My father in law has been informed we'll most likely be buying his 22 Highander Hybrid when he is ready to trade. It is a comfortable ride. Nothing spectacular. Typical Toyota.

The decision is also framed by the experience we have had with our Prius V, which other than routine maintenance and a radiator/condensor from a deer strike, has only needed a front wheel bearing, new front sway bar bushings, and I had to replace the upper brake LED the other day ($71 aftermarket). 11 years old and 245k.

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We are liking our Highlander hybrid. I can't stand the climate control system, but otherwise no major complaints. We did LE trim and put on some rugged seat covers.

^^^^ How has the AWD system been? That's my lingering concern.

Edit to add. What seat covers? How are they?

We have a 2021 Sienna AWD (hybrid, platinum) and the thing FUCKS so hard. Best car in snow I've ever driven. The AWD is legit at both low and freeway speeds.

Also best roadtrip vehicle ever. 30++ mpg, totally chill cruising at 90+.

My only complaint is that my wife doesn't let me drive it on a daily basis so I'm stuck in the Tacoma.

Big highlander recall yesterday, 814,000 btwn 2020 and 2023MY. Apparently they used "resin" to glue the back bumpers on and they might fall off pretty easily. Of course the remedy is to add more glue, but I'd insist on nuts and bolts.

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Originally Posted by RootSkier

We have a 2021 Sienna AWD (hybrid, platinum) and the thing FUCKS so hard. Best car in snow I've ever driven. The AWD is legit at both low and freeway speeds.

Also best roadtrip vehicle ever. 30++ mpg, totally chill cruising at 90+.

My only complaint is that my wife doesn't let me drive it on a daily basis so I'm stuck in the Tacoma.

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Very jealous of you awd hybrid sienna people. I have a slightly older lifted FWD one which just great for adventuring but it does get stuck going up snowy/icy hills, even with chains. Some day...

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Originally Posted by I've seen black diamonds!

^^^^ How has the AWD system been? That's my lingering concern.

Edit to add. What seat covers? How are they?

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Coverking 2 Rows Genuine Neoprene Wetsuit Custom Fit Seat Covers from costco.com for $300. A little warm, but holding up really well (3 kids under 8).

Awd system seems great so far. Obviously not for legit off-road, but it got me out of a gumbo mud road that I accidentally went down. Did well on packed snow with a few inches of new snow up a steep switch back logging road, figured out best to let the traction control do the work. Icy highways and fresh snow stormy highways seem to do great. And I still have the so-so original tires. I like that the rear wheels are all electric so not wasting MPGs when not needed.

Pros/cons between current awd hybrid sienna vs Highlander?

Our 2006 fwd sienna with 150k miles is still going strong. Gremlins are fairy minimal and engine and suspension/steering systems are all working well. It’s permanently grubby and it’s body has been abused nicely. Plastic interior stuff is wearing out.

I think it is the exact same system. For sure the same cvt.

https://www.motortrend.com/features/...arison?slide=4

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We just rented the Pacifica for five days. Other than being a big old beast for two people that we didn’t need. (We wanted the smallest car they rent, but they gave us a choice between the Pacifica and an F150.) It’s a great car. Made us miss our old Honda Odyssey, which is basically identical. Solid, fast, quiet and they make an all-wheel-drive version.


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We returned 2 Chrysler minivans under the Lemon Law in 2 different states. Worst vehicles we ever owned. Seemed great when new but developed unfixable problems in the first 20,000 miles.


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Rented a hybrid Pacifica last summer. The infotainment required a hard reboot a few times in the week we had it. The drivers assist systems were borderline dangerous. It couldn't keep a preset distance from the vehicle in front and when you tried to pass on a two lane it would slam on the brakes when you were along side the vehicle you were trying to pass. It was a hot mess.

RE: Midsize SUV's

We went down the same road a few months ago but have been looking for the last two years. Our short list included the same vehicles and we settled on the VW Atlas and picked up a loaded '19 with low miles. It just does everything well. Every button, switch and lever is exactly where you expect it to be and does exactly what you need. The 12 speaker Fender audio sounds amazing and the sunroof is the size of an aircraft carrier. It handles well, has adequate power, and is massive inside. We were coming from a Discovery 2, so a pogo stick would probably have felt like an improvement. We've put about 5K miles on it and have had no complaints or problems. I threw some Falken Wildpeak A/T3W's on it and it absolutely slaughtered the snow. I've made some adjustments to it with OBD11 and did a resonator delete to let the VR6 sing. Highly recommend.

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Originally Posted by bodywhomper

Pros/cons between current awd hybrid sienna vs Highlander?

Our 2006 fwd sienna with 150k miles is still going strong. Gremlins are fairy minimal and engine and suspension/steering systems are all working well. It’s permanently grubby and it’s body has been abused nicely. Plastic interior stuff is wearing out.

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We've had the awd hybrid sienna for a few years now. Never owned the highlander, but test drove it when we were shopping. I didn't like how the highlander drove at all. Felt like a big sloppy vehicle with shitty body roll and vague handling. Sienna (somewhat surprisingly) handles much, much better. Sienna also feels like about the same size vehicle, but has a massive increase in space compared to the highlander. Sienna can fit *a lot* of shit inside.

My gripes about the sienna: the back end is low and the rear springs are soft. A bike rack on the back grinds pretty often. A lift kit and some airbags are in our future. I also really dislike the brakes, which I think is just a hybrid thing with the regenerative braking. They're not predictable; the same foot pressure yields different results on different presses. Not sure if that is the case for other Toyota hybrids. The infotainment is mediocre, but that's par for the course. My sienna also came stock with whining children in the back. Not sure if the highlander includes those.

^^^Might want to have them look at brakes, that sounds odd.

I agree sienna drives better than Highlander, and that is what I wanted to get, but wife didn't want something that long as a daily driver.

Drove a 2020 MDX today. Wanted to drive one since I liked he Pilot and the MDX has fewer transmission and infotainment complaints. The suspension/ handling was pretty darn dialed for a big car, easily better than the Pilot or Highlander. It was as smooth over bumps as the Highlander but cornered at least as well as the Pilot. And while it shares a transmission with the Pilot the shifting was much better. Most cars I've driven that have an auto with 8+ gears have some weird shifts now and then. The MDX did not. The interior is notably nicer than the Pilot but it also gives up 3rd row and cargo space for the sake of styling. Interior space is more like the Highlander. The two screen infotainment thing was confusing but worked fine. It is not a good design at all. Won't bother me. My wife will hate it.

Oddly, 2019-2020 MDX's seem to be a bit cheaper than Pilots around here, and much cheaper than Highlanders. And the one I drove today was immaculate. I might but it, especially since finding a Hybrid Highlander in good shape at a decent price looks... difficult.

^ My daughter has an MDX and absolutely loves it. She can be a picky snot sometimes and she has no complaints whatsoever. She traded whatever the Lexus smaller SUV is and she says the difference is night and day. I know Toyota has a lot of phanbois but my take is that Honda products are just better from a driving perspective.

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Originally Posted by MyNameIsAugustWest

^ My daughter has an MDX and absolutely loves it. She can be a picky snot sometimes and she has no complaints whatsoever. She traded whatever the Lexus smaller SUV is and she says the difference is night and day. I know Toyota has a lot of phanbois but my take is that Honda products are just better from a driving perspective.

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Does she have a roof box that can hold long skis? Now I'm going down the hole of figuring out hatch clearance.

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Originally Posted by I've seen black diamonds!

Does she have a roof box that can hold long skis? Now I'm going down the hole of figuring out hatch clearance.

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I'm guessing that all MDXs in recent years will have a power hatch. Those can be set at a limit on opening height - which allows you to limit the hatch from hitting a roof box. On your next test drive, see what that's like for access under the hatch when stopped at rocketbox height.

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Originally Posted by El Chupacabra

I'm guessing that all MDXs in recent years will have a power hatch. Those can be set at a limit on opening height - which allows you to limit the hatch from hitting a roof box. On your next test drive, see what that's like for access under the hatch when stopped at rocketbox height.

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^^^^ You cannot adjust the tailgate height on the 3rd gen MDX. Also living with a tailgate that doesn't open higher than my head is a no go for me. A roof box will be on the car more often than not. I use it for waders, boots and skis pretty much weekly.

There is an Inno box that fits on the factory bars and holds 189cm skis, or so they say. That would just barely fit my current skis, but I've certainly owned longer and may again. I'll bet there is a way to make a longer box work though. I contacted a couple of the big car rack sellers to ask about solutions.

Well, I just heard back from etrailer. Apparently this thing fits on the factory bars and fits 192's: https://www.etrailer.com/p-MPG902.html

Never heard of Malone Cargo boxes before. Looks fine I guess.