Atomic Hawx Ultra XTD aka Hawk Extended aka HawX

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Originally Posted by El Chupacabra

Anyone here mounted Beast heel spurs on this boot? Looking at doing it, but the metal Beast heel fitting sits a little bit above the plastic lip of the Hawx boot heel. Anything to be concerned about?

The Beast heel fitting sat flush on the old boots (Dynafit One), but those were not WTR boots, so thinking that might be the difference.

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Subscribed. I'm in the same boat. I'd like to get them flush so I can possibly use them with alpine, or framed bindings.

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Originally Posted by XXX-er

the entire lip or the entire wing?

just scribe it and file it or if you got a dremel use the mill attachment ... will make short work of it

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100% of the entire upper lip of the Beast heel insert sits above 100% of the entire upper lip of the plastic heel of the Hawx boot. Not just the round ends of the Beast heel inserts, where the two side mounted screws install.

The Beast insert is only above the Hawx plastic heel edge by a millimeter or two. I don't know if this will make any difference if used in a Beast or old style Dynafit binding.

I expect it would make a difference if used in a WTR or alpine binding.

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Originally Posted by My Pet Powder Goat

Subscribed. I'm in the same boat. I'd like to get them flush so I can possibly use them with alpine, or framed bindings.

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Originally Posted by El Chupacabra

100% of the entire upper lip of the Beast heel insert sits above 100% of the entire upper lip of the plastic heel of the Hawx boot. Not just the round ends of the Beast heel inserts, where the two side mounted screws install.

The Beast insert is only above the Hawx plastic heel edge by a millimeter or two. I don't know if this will make any difference if used in a Beast or old style Dynafit binding.

I expect it would make a difference if used in a WTR or alpine binding.

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as El Chup suspected - it made no difference when used in Beast, Vipec, Tecton, Kingpin, old Vertical, Comfort. I never checked in alpine or WTR binding

Thanks Lee - guess I'll go ahead and mount the heel pieces on the Hawx boots. I don't plan on using them in WTR or alpine bindings, but it would've been nice to have that option. I guess I could do a large dremel project later if I want to grind the lip down.

Are you going to drumal out some plastic from the heel to sit the insert flush?


My boots won't get here for a couple days, is it possible to get a photo of the finished product? They way I'll know more about what I'm working with

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Originally Posted by My Pet Powder Goat

Are you going to drumal out some plastic from the heel to sit the insert flush?

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It doesn't sit flush? I need to take a closer look.

I thought the heel piece sat flush against back of the boot. My issue was that the metal lip protruded up higher than the plastic edge of the boot heel.

Just popped the Beast heel piece back onto the boot to see how it fit - there's a tiny air gap between the fitting (where the pins of the binding go) and the back of the boot. I think it'll vanish when I screw the fitting in place.

Some useful references: https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...d.php?t=305039

Update - mounted the Beast heel fittings onto my Hawx boots. Looks like it'll work OK.

The boot heels are hollow, so drilling for the side screws on the Beast fitting goes straight through. The screw tips protrude a little bit into the inside of the boot, but they are completely underneath the zeppa. Should be fine.

arent they wood screws to screw into plastic? If its not bomber enough could you use a machine screw & bolt ?

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Originally Posted by XavierD

I'm aproximatly 200lb.

Lange RS 130 - Power Wraps with one pin pulled - tecnica Mach1 spoiler and sole plates.
Lange XT 130 free tour - Pro Tongue liner with 'expert' booster strap and tecnica Cochise spoiler

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I've spent considerable time in both of these boots. What size are you in the Lange and how did that translate to the Hawx 130 XTD?

n/m just needed to keep reading.

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Originally Posted by XavierD

I'd get them the same size as my alpine boots; 26.5. No need to size up like I do with TLT boots (27.5). I spent a couple days last year in these and found 26.5 to be the right size, although the tight curvature in the Achilles did pry my foot forward cramping my instep. I would probably rework the shape to make them work if the 15deg forward lean didn't disagree with me so much.

I don't however, downsize my Alpine boots the way I used too. My days in a 25.5 are over, and I'm happy skiing a two finger shell fit every day, on account of my high volume and rigid foot. YMMV

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Originally Posted by XXX-er

arent they wood screws to screw into plastic? If its not bomber enough could you use a machine screw & bolt ?

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There's enough screw penetration, but the screw tips go through to the inside of the heels. I guess hollowed out parts is how they made this boot so light.

With Amer Sports and Rossignol/Lange moving to team GripWalk will the Hawx Ultra XTD be seeing a sole update for 2018-2019? My 0G Guide Pro is about to break for the 3rd time (great boot other than the durability issue) and while the Atomic is on my shortlist for new boots I'd rather not get stuck with WTR soles now that everyone's decided that GripWalk will be the "in-between" standard.

not to be rude here and answer a question with a question - but if most of the relevant bindings on the market that i can think of are wtr compatible now (tecton, shift, kingpin, all dynafit type bindings, attack wtr bindings, pivot/rossi 12/14s (dunno about marker)) and those that are not are not gripwalk compatible either (pivot 18 and so on) - what does it matter if they swap soles on the Hawx for next year?

Before boot compatibility of the current Hawx XTD to decent bindings will become an issue, the boots you buy today will probably be worn out anyway. It might be that significant developments have passed me by, but i for one do not see anything revolutionary happening in the binding market before long - especially not in the all alpine segment, though by all means, the introduction of the Shift bindings might open some flood gate :) I might be totally off though - it would not have been the first time, nor the last.

you prob saw it over at NS, but if not this is Atomic's lead boot designer's answer to your question above :)

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Originally Posted by onenerdykid on NS

Yep- Grip Walk is becoming an actual norm and it's what all boot and binding manufacturers will work towards over the coming years. It's one of those things that can't be done overnight since it involves lots of mold modifications on the boot side and on the binding side. But we will be working toward that for sure. Essentially, the 3 norms moving forward are: Alpine 5355, Touring 9523, Grip Walk 9523.

For Range 18/19 (what is being launched at OR/ISPO right now) we will be making replaceable Grip Walk grip pads for Hawx Ultra, Hawx Prime, Hawx Magna, Live Fit, and any older boots that use the same grip pad interfaces as the boots mentioned. Ultra XTD will remain a WTR boot for this year, as it is a "carry over" and production has already been rolling. It will still work with all the bindings that it currently works with.

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source:https://www.newschoolers.com/forum/t...tra-XTD?page=6

so now you know the official line and not only my question to your question :) Matt's availability is second to none and up there with ON3P - i find it really impressive how good he is with sharing info on their products and in answering questions.

(sorry if i cross some line posting his reply on NS here on TGR as a quote or in linking to another similar thread on NS, but i found the answer informative and wanted to share for those that are not on NS :) )

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Originally Posted by kid-kapow

the 3 norms moving forward are: Alpine 5355, Touring 9523, Grip Walk 9523.

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Are Touring and GW the same norm then?

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Originally Posted by kid-kapow

you prob saw it over at NS, but if not this is Atomic's lead boot designer's answer to your question above :)


source:https://www.newschoolers.com/forum/t...tra-XTD?page=6

so now you know the official line and not only my question to your question :) Matt's availability is second to none and up there with ON3P - i find it really impressive how good he is with sharing info on their products and in answering questions.

(sorry if i cross some line posting his reply on NS here on TGR as a quote or in linking to another similar thread on NS, but i found the answer informative and wanted to share for those that are not on NS :) )

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Better etiquette than 99% of the folks here. And very informative

For reference, my 25.5s weigh 1395g with Intuition Pro Tours, 3/4 length Superfeet Green insoles, and expert Booster straps. I didn't weigh them stock because I don't ski boots stock.

I've been doing a ton of work on them to get the fit dialed so only have one run so far, 1500vert of chalky bumps and groomers, in the dark. So far I have to say, I am VERY impressed with the way this boot skis. It's probably 80-90% as capable as my Dalbello Scorpion 130s at a small fraction of the weight. It won't be my only boot but it will fill that role for a ton of people. It tours a bit worse than my OG Scarpa Maestrale RS despite feeling a touch lighter. There's a reason most touring focused boots are three-piece boots. My only real complaint is I wish the BSL was 4-5mm longer and there was a touch more length in the shell.

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Originally Posted by turnfarmer

gregL said this in a GripWalk thread-

"When you end up buying a customer a new ski because the combination you said would work doesn't (in this case a Hawx Ultra XTD with Griffon SoleID) it becomes more than annoying."
Can you expand on this? What didn't work?

The local Marker Rep told me that Sole Id is compatible with WTR .

I have a pair of skis with Squires on them that will get Shifts next year. Would like to use these skis with XTD boots this year without drilling another set of holes in them. Would love to just throw some Sole ID toe pieces on them for now. Your thoughts are appreciated.

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I feel this pain having already had to change supposedly compatible bindings, and now have some pinboard skis! Further standardisation will be great, just a shame I now have the wrong sole:(..... I better wear these boots out first though!:)

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Originally Posted by PNB

Are Touring and GW the same norm then?

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Not exactly. The ISO 9523 specs are very broad (for instance, the toe height can range from 23mm to 33mm) and the sole can have a smooth AFD pad but doesn't have to. The GripWalk specs fall within the scope of ISO 9523.

Thanks.

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Originally Posted by gregL

Not exactly. The ISO 9523 specs are very broad (for instance, the toe height can range from 23mm to 33mm) and the sole can have a smooth AFD pad but doesn't have to. The GripWalk specs fall within the scope of ISO 9523.

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My bad - misread the diagram - the toe height spec is 28mm plus or minus 3mm. GripWalk makes the effective toe shape "thinner" by adjusting the height and angle of the AFD pad. Heel is less of a problem as a 30mm or 31mm heel meets both ISO 5355 and ISO 9523 spec.

Heads up from Matt Manser

"Check in with your local Atomic retailer and have them order the "XTD Free/Lock Base Plate 13/19", part number AZE001416. This just recently became available and using this piece instead of the stock one will allow you to make the boot 2 degrees more upright (from 15 to 13 degrees).

You unscrew the ski/walk mechanism, remove it, and remove the silver colored base plate from inside the cuff. Use this new base plate with the 13 degree setting in the (you'll know it's the 13 degree setting because you can read it, other wise it would read 19). Attach everything and re-tighten."

Any updates or changes in the liners between the 120 or 130 models?
I've read this whole thread and remember the 130 liners being minimalistic (weight savings?)

Coming from a Cochise 120, looking for a nicer walk/pivot and no less downhill performance. No exceptional fit challenges, weird feet, etc.

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Originally Posted by LeeLau

"Check in with your local Atomic retailer and have them order the "XTD Free/Lock Base Plate 13/19", part number AZE001416. This just recently became available and using this piece instead of the stock one will allow you to make the boot 2 degrees more upright (from 15 to 13 degrees).

You unscrew the ski/walk mechanism, remove it, and remove the silver colored base plate from inside the cuff. Use this new base plate with the 13 degree setting in the (you'll know it's the 13 degree setting because you can read it, other wise it would read 19). Attach everything and re-tighten."

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Atomic delivers!

Very cool! I love it when manufacturers provide those extra customization parts that can make the difference when it comes to fit and function. Boots with too much forward lean have often been a problem for me.

My 120s arrived, sooner than expected. A noticeably tighter fit (good) than the 130s I tried in a shop.

How is everyone setting the cuff buckles for skinning? I've never had an overlap boot with a walk mode before. Tight-ish, maybe one notch looser than for skiing just for comfort?

And anyone with Boosters on these, are you running them over the plastic or under? I normally cut notches in my alpine boots' upper cuffs to allow the Booster to go under it, but my alpine boots cost a lot less than these so I don't really want to experiment.

Wide open on the cuff, anything else compromises the walk mode. I removed the power strap on mine, I couldn't tell a difference skiing with one open and one right, and it added hassle and bulk at transitions. A Booster under the cuff would probably be a lot less annoying.

Booster under the cuff

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using TGR Forums mobile app

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Originally Posted by LC

My 120s arrived, sooner than expected. A noticeably tighter fit (good) than the 130s I tried in a shop.

How is everyone setting the cuff buckles for skinning? I'vte never had an overlap boot with a walk mode before. Tight-ish, maybe one notch looser than for skiing just for comfort?

And anyone with Boosters on these, are you running them over the plastic or under? I normally cut notches in my alpine boots' upper cuffs to allow the Booster to go under it, but my alpine boots cost a lot less than these so I don't really want to experiment.

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No power strap at all and both top buckles undone (lower one in the stainless clip).

I'm running a Booster over the cuff. Annoying at transitions, but I've always used them that way and like how they make the boot feel so I just deal with it.

Recently I bought a pair of Hawx XTD 120. Very happy with both fit and feel. The only problem is that my feet get cold in them very fast. The OEM liner is kinda tight in the toe box so I tried a pair of Intuition Luxury liners. My feet got (numb) cold after 30 minutes. I can wiggle my toes in both liners. The boots have been baked at the local Atomic dealer.
Shell fit is 17mm. Should I punch a little bit more room in the toebox area?

P.S. When using the very same Intuition Luxury liners in Tecnica Cochise 2015 I have zero issues with cold feet.

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Originally Posted by aanev

Recently I bought a pair of Hawx XTD 120. Very happy with both fit and feel. The only problem is that my feet get cold in them very fast. The OEM liner is kinda tight in the toe box so I tried a pair of Intuition Luxury liners. My feet got (numb) cold after 30 minutes. I can wiggle my toes in both liners. The boots have been baked at the local Atomic dealer.
Shell fit is 17mm. Should I punch a little bit more room in the toebox area?

P.S. When using the very same Intuition Luxury liners in Tecnica Cochise 2015 I have zero issues with cold feet.

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sounds like a shell shape issue on the atomics.

usualy cold = not enough instep room (height) not a length thing

use a thinner footbed, or grind the boot board thinner,

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Originally Posted by mntlion

sounds like a shell shape issue on the atomics.

usualy cold = not enough instep room (height) not a length thing

use a thinner footbed, or grind the boot board thinner,

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Now that you mention it, the boot is tighter on the instep than the Tecnica. Nothing too extreme, no hot spots, excellent heel hold. I'll give a try to the OEM liners without footbed and if there is improvement I'll look for thinner foodbeds. The Luxury liners are without footbed (they have 9mm moldable sole AFAIK).

Many thanks!

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Originally Posted by aanev

Now that you mention it, the boot is tighter on the instep than the Tecnica. Nothing too extreme, no hot spots, excellent heel hold. I'll give a try to the OEM liners without footbed and if there is improvement I'll look for thinner foodbeds. The Luxury liners are without footbed (they have 9mm moldable sole AFAIK).

Many thanks!

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Removing the footbed seems to work (sort of - I got cold feet again but after several hours and it was bearable). Now I plan to heat the tongue of the Luxury liner with a heat-gun and tighten the buckles. As an alternative I can rebake the shells with some padding on the instep.

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Originally Posted by aanev

As an alternative I can rebake the shells with some padding on the instep.

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Rebake shells & liners with an extra insole or two under the liner. This is what I've done to my last few pairs of Salomon Falcon/X3/Ghost which are very low on the instep.

I ended up cutting the cuffs of my XTD 120s today to allow the Boosters to go under the plastic - always prefer my alpine boots like this. Also cut the first overlap flap 10-15mm narrower because it was digging into my foot with the buckles fastened tight (very skinny calves) - done this on my last few alpine boots also.

Fit feels good at home, might try them tomorrow depending what skis I want to be on. Softer than I'd like (at home), but I can live with that if the fit is significantly better than my Vulcans. Might try old Powerwraps in them sometime and pick up a new pair if they feel good.

Thanks for the skinning/buckle tips above. I have a feeling my heel is going to slip a bit with the upper buckles completely loose, but I'll experiment. Even when I skin in my alpine boots I normally just loosen the top buckles a couple of teeth.

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Originally Posted by LC

Thanks for the skinning/buckle tips above. I have a feeling my heel is going to slip a bit with the upper buckles completely loose, but I'll experiment. Even when I skin in my alpine boots I normally just loosen the top buckles a couple of teeth.

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Put the laces on the liner. Skin with the liner laced tight and buckles all loose. The whole liner might move in the shell (probably not) but your foot won't move in the liner, so you won't get blisters and you'll get full ROM.

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Originally Posted by adrenalated

Put the laces on the liner. Skin with the liner laced tight and buckles all loose. The whole liner might move in the shell (probably not) but your foot won't move in the liner, so you won't get blisters and you'll get full ROM.

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+1. Had to switch away from touring in powerwraps because of blisters. No blisters with lace-up intuitions (in Vulcans, not XTD).

I am thinking of getting some intuition pro tongues or pro wraps for inbounds in my 130s and keeping the stock thin liners for touring as they do that well. Any reason not to go wrap, it seems like I will get extra stiffness and a tighter ankle fit. I still need to find some good footbeds too, probably just have to bite the bullet for thin high arch customs.

On this topic, does anyone know how the volume of an Intuition Pro Tour LV compares to the stock liner?

I'm concerned my 25.5s may be too small for touring--does anyone have experience with how much the boot can be punched for length?