Another What Car Thread: Big-ish SUV's (or Minivan?)

I like the looks, interior and driving dynamics of the CX-9. I'm not sure how on the long term reliability of the turbo 4, and it isn't great on fuel.

I think my money would go to the nicest used Highlander Hybrid that is in my budget, assuming used prices aren't a mess in your area.

I did this last year and ended up in a pilot. The Toyota tax was very high on used highlanders and I found the pilot for a decent deal private party. It is noticeably bigger inside than a highlander or cx9 and the v6 pulls very nicely. My sister has a palisade and it’s fancier than my pilot but I prefer basic and I tow so anything with a cvt was ruled out.

We have a lifted Sienna and bags. 33 mpg or so which is nice for long drives. We have three kids so that may have affected our decision making but it's nice to have plenty of room for camping and road trips. It's probably not much more than a palisade cost wise, although I wouldn't buy one of those anyway since they are being stolen left and right.

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Originally Posted by Yonder_River

We have a lifted Sienna and bags. 33 mpg or so which is nice for long drives. We have three kids so that may have affected our decision making but it's nice to have plenty of room for camping and road trips. It's probably not much more than a palisade cost wise, although I wouldn't buy one of those anyway since they are being stolen left and right.

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A lifted hybrid is still getting 33mpg? Nice. What tires are you using?

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Originally Posted by I've seen black diamonds!

Bump.

Our 2007 XC70 is still mechanically sound, but plastic bits are crumbling. The end is near, even though it isn't a daily driver at this point. I was hoping to hold out until an electric family truckster was viable for us, but it looks like it'll be a few more years at least. Maybe some of you can go all electric now, but I have some frequent drives that would be hassle without more range AND charging stations.

We have 2 kids and dog. We would use a third row for hauling extra people (mostly kids) on day trips, not road trips with lots of stuff. I use the ample trunk space in the Volvo frequently, but seldom when I have more than the five of us (including the dog) in the car. I think a smaller three row car would suit us well.

I'm leaning toward a used CX-9 as it looks to be the best combo of price, quality and reliability. I'm also interested in the new CX-90, but think I'd rather save the money than buy a new car that will be quickly marred by kids and a dog (and me).

I've also looked at:

Highlander- good car, but too expensive for what you get.
Highlander Hybrid - even more too expensive
Pilot- not bad, but the main advantage over the CX-9 is that it is bigger, which I don't think I need. And what is with all the recalls?
Telluride/Pallisade- Very nice car but, similar to the Pilot, I would be paying more for things I don't need (bigger, fancier)
Sorento- bad reliability ratings, the hybrid is lowered and no fucking spare.
Traverse- buying a chevy that isn't a truck seems... dumb
Ascent- like the Traverse, this seems too far from what Subaru does well.
Atlas- slow, poor mileage, will cost more to fix.
Nissan, Dodge, Jeep- Nah
AWD Sienna with a lift kit- Would be awesome, but surprisingly expensive and I don't really sleep in my car anymore.

What am I getting wrong? What am I missing? My kids are 4 and 9. Am I underestimating the amount of space we'll need in two years? Should I consider the previous generation Highlander? I've driven Highlanders, Pilots and CX-9's. The Mazda is the best to drive. The Honda is also quite good for how big it is. The Toyota is nondescript but has a pretty spotless history of being reliable generation after generation. Another Mazda advantage is that lower trims have leatherette seats, which my kids and dog will destroy more slowly. I want durable seats, but I don't want to pay for a bunch of pointless "features." Toyota especially seems to save the leatherette for fancier trim levels. I don't give a damn how big my infotainment screen is.

Anyway, I'm not psyched to spend a lot of money on this car as I see it as a box for hauling kids and stuff. It will deal with wet dogs, kids, waders and ski boots. Cheap and reliable is good. I'll drive to the middle of nowhere to go skiing, running, biking and fishing and on long fmaily road trips where a breakdown would really suck. But would the future resale of the Highlander (or Pilot?) make it worth spending the extra cash now? Am I underestimating one of these cars? What would you do?

Thanks

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I was in the same conundrum 3 years ago. Kids are currently 11 & 13 plus a dog. Wife’s vehicle is a 2006 V8 Volvo XC90. Needed the ability to fit a dog crate plus glamping gear, tow a trailer or boat and fit canoe/ kayaks on the roof. Had a 1997 4Runner that worked well until the oldest needed more leg room, wanted better road trip/ towing performance and she was over 250k miles.
Long story short, ended up with a 2013 Toyota Sequoia base 4wd with heated seats from TX. Been great so far with no hiccups. Only downside is mpg’s around town is 13-15.

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Originally Posted by Yonder_River

We have a lifted Sienna and bags. 33 mpg or so which is nice for long drives. We have three kids so that may have affected our decision making but it's nice to have plenty of room for camping and road trips. It's probably not much more than a palisade cost wise, although I wouldn't buy one of those anyway since they are being stolen left and right.

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Which lift kit did you use? I've been debating one for our sienna.

Drove a CX-9 and Pilot today. CX-9 was great, but even smaller than I remembered. It is oddly narrow in the back. With the rear seats folded down I'm pretty sure it still has less luggage space than my Volvo.

The Pilot was good- less appealing in most ways than the Mazda- but good. It is also obviously a better family hauler.

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Originally Posted by Dromond

A lifted hybrid is still getting 33mpg? Nice. What tires are you using?

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If it's fully loaded with a topper then it's more like 29. Tires are just the crap stock ones although I'm about to get snows for it. 18" rims.

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Originally Posted by toast2266

Which lift kit did you use? I've been debating one for our sienna.

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Journeys 2" and it's been perfect. 3 seemed like too much. You'll have to find an appropriate installer. I had a local place that specialized in suspension do it along with the Firestone bags at the same time.

On the topic of unibody large/midsize SUV's, recommendations for replacing the stock suspension? 2021 Highlander hybrid awd. What to keep factory height, but improve highway drive quality, no off road. Probably need tires prior to winter too.

If your tires are pretty worn out, that could be the cause of feeling like the ride is rough. So maybe start with new tires? - - unless there's other reasons you think the suspension needs attention, like visibly leaking shocks, or tire wear patterns showing bad shocks, or bad control arm bushings, etc... But on a 2021, seems too early to have worn out any of that.

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Originally Posted by I've seen black diamonds!

Drove a CX-9 and Pilot today. CX-9 was great, but even smaller than I remembered. It is oddly narrow in the back. With the rear seats folded down I'm pretty sure it still has less luggage space than my Volvo.

The Pilot was good- less appealing in most ways than the Mazda- but good. It is also obviously a better family hauler.

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My wife's CX3 has been a pain the ass since new. Constant error codes, transmission replacement under warranty after, never ending issues with AC arguments with Mazda about it being covered and/or part of a near identical recall.

I will never own another Mazda product in my life.

We had a 2010 CX-9 in our family for many years that we bought new. It was the most reliable, bombproof car we’ve ever had. It was fantastic. Drove very well. Perhaps the older ones were bigger but I always considered it a large car.

Highly highly recommend. I mean, it’s not “cool”, but it does what it’s supposed to do extremely well.

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Originally Posted by PNWbrit

My wife's CX3 has been a pain the ass since new. Constant error codes, transmission replacement under warranty after, never ending issues with AC arguments with Mazda about it being covered and/or part of a near identical recall.

I will never own another Mazda product in my life.

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Originally Posted by EWG

We had a 2010 CX-9 in our family for many years that we bought new. It was the most reliable, bombproof car we’ve ever had. It was fantastic. Drove very well. Perhaps the older ones were bigger but I always considered it a large car.

Highly highly recommend. I mean, it’s not “cool”, but it does what it’s supposed to do extremely well.

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Heh, this is why the internet is great... want to love something? we got you! want to hate something? we got you too! Two shared experiences on completely different ends of the spectrum - Mazda is either the best or the worst car company out there... :)

Looked at current and previous gen Highlanders a few minutes ago. On paper the newer one is bigger but in reality the difference is minimal. Size seems to be smack dab between the CX-9 and Pilot. It would work, but still seems smaller than ideal. Interior of both were on par with the Honda. Drove the new one. Smoother ride than the Honda, but less agile despite being smaller. I think people would be split on which one is the better driver. Neither can touch the Mazda.

I came into this process thinking size wouldn't be much of a factor, but the fact is that Honda got it right, Toyota gets a C and Mazda gets a D-.

Still considering the Highlander Hybrid, but wouldn't buy the (more expensive) gas Highlander over the Pilot.

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Originally Posted by aragon

Heh, this is why the internet is great... want to love something? we got you! want to hate something? we got you too! Two shared experiences on completely different ends of the spectrum - Mazda is either the best or the worst car company out there... :)

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Yeah, we have a CX-3 too, and been reliable, not a single repair. Only complaint is that once in a while the blind spot monitor thinks something is there that isn’t.

Had a Protege 5 that had no issues at all either.

Had a Mazdaspeed Protege that had issues with pretty much everything that made it a Mazdaspeed, but that wasn’t developed by Mazda themselves, and was low volume for US only, so I don’t take that as being representative.

Sorry if you've already addressed this, but has Honda sorted the transmission problems on the Pilot? My mom has owned a 2016 limited since new and the transmission has been nothing but trouble, I think ~80k on hers right now. She has done multiple flushes/controller resets/etc. through the dealership but seems resigned to live with it. Shifting from 2 -> 3 is absolute garbage. I would agree that the Honda interior is better thought out than the Toyota interior.

If you are planning on any sort of city driving the instant torque from the electric AWD in the hybrid Toyota makes a huge difference.

I have a Honda Ridgeline with the 9-speed ZF transmission. It shifts a little weird, but internet anecdotal data suggests it's reliable. The 6-speed Honda-built transmission in the earlier ones is reportedly trouble prone.

I assume any other Honda product with the same engine, like a Pilot, Passport, etc, has the same issues.

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Originally Posted by Yonder_River

Journeys 2" and it's been perfect. 3 seemed like too much. You'll have to find an appropriate installer. I had a local place that specialized in suspension do it along with the Firestone bags at the same time.

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Nice. And that's good to hear about the airbags - last I looked, they hadn't released them yet for the hybrid. So yeah, I'll probably end up copying your setup. Thanks for the tip!

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Originally Posted by toast2266

Nice. And that's good to hear about the airbags - last I looked, they hadn't released them yet for the hybrid. So yeah, I'll probably end up copying your setup. Thanks for the tip!

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These are the airbags I used. There are other brands I'm sure but most in the sienna forums we're using this one. They definitely work on AWD even though it doesn't say it in the specifications. Near the gas cap is the best place to route the inflation tube.

Firestone W237604155 Coil-Rite Kit https://a.co/d/eJV4wmB

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Originally Posted by ghosthop

Sorry if you've already addressed this, but has Honda sorted the transmission problems on the Pilot? My mom has owned a 2016 limited since new and the transmission has been nothing but trouble, I think ~80k on hers right now. She has done multiple flushes/controller resets/etc. through the dealership but seems resigned to live with it. Shifting from 2 -> 3 is absolute garbage. I would agree that the Honda interior is better thought out than the Toyota interior.

If you are planning on any sort of city driving the instant torque from the electric AWD in the hybrid Toyota makes a huge difference.

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I think this was mostly resolved with more recent models. I'm more concerned about the "infotainment" system which has given a lot of people problems.

^ wifey has a 2019 Ridgeline approaching 45K miles. No issues with transmission. Interior on Hondas is far superior to Toyotas even at the higher trim specs. Hondas just drive better too. The infotainment system is slow af. Seems to have Commodore 64 tech (with better graphics). No "problems" other than growing old waiting for screens to change.

Honda seems to use wildly different infotainment systems across their vehicles. The Accord has a really nice head unit, vs the one in my Ridgeline that is pretty dated, but it functions fine - there are just a lot of better ones out there.

Some of them lacked a volume knob, and just used a touchscreen slider for volume - those were annoyingly difficult to adjust while driving.

Sound quality is acceptable, not great, in mine. I haven't changed anything on the stereo - I may try changing the tweeters, as the sound seems kind of harsh to me, and internet discussion says tweeters make a good difference on these.

I'm not picky about my infotainment experience or anything. I just want bluetooth that works every time and radio. There was a lawsuit and recall along with many horror stories regarding the infotainment system in Pilots, Passports and Odysseys. As always it is hard to know how common the problem. The internet amplifies this kind of thing.

I have a 2017 Honda Stepwagon minivan, fwiw. The infotainment is rarely used for anything other than a conduit for my phone. The GPS never gets used. Again, phone. It's nice for hands-free phone calls, and sometimes I watch the TV during sports tournaments, but frankly, I'm of the belief that all infotainment systems become obsolete fairly quickly. Just as quickly as phones. Also, all car controls should be on the steering wheel at this point. My stereo buttons and sensor options are on the wheel, but my heating/AC should be, too.

With paddle shifters, thumb toggles, index finger buttons, ring finger buttons, my phone magnetized to the dash to my side, I don't even know why we have infotainment systems anymore. Everything should be right in front of me and tactile. Touch screens that I have to reach out to are annoying.

Also, Honda Sensing got worse in version 2. I have version 1 and it's subtle. I think they're on version 3 as of 2022 or 2023. Version 2 is too aggressive, the lane-stay almost won't allow the driver to switch lanes in an emergency, and the front sensor for emergency braking is downright dangerously aggressive, constantly slamming on the brakes if you're within 50 feet of anything. Hopefully ver3 is better. Test that if you're going Honda Sensing. Still appreciate my version 1, though.