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So I have a few years old shell that was origionally very waterproof, and still is on the inner layers, but the outerlayer gets soaked pretty easilty now. Any recommendations for a spray on, iron-on, or dryer applied after-market waterproofing solution?
Danka.
Spray on Nikwax.
From Gore-tex product care - Gore recommends applying a topical water repellency restorative (DWR treatment) for outdoor fabrics, available at your local outdoor retailer. We do not recommend wash-in treatments as they can affect the garment's breathability
What brit said. Extensive in-house testing at Patagonia (okay, it was me and another guy on a slow day) reveals the spray-on shizzle is the best.
I've used Nikwax on a Paclite Arc'Teryx jacket and it hasn't actually worked that well for me. I washed the jacket first (with the Nikwax wash they recommend using before re-proofing, in a well-rinsed machine - no detergent left in it) then both sprayed and soaked (on different occassions) the jacket with reproofer, then heat-fixed it in a tumble dryer.
Treatment with the Nikwax didn't improve things much at all, the jacket wetted out very easily by the second time it got wet after treatment.
I heard that the Grainger product you can get Stateside is better though.
I never tried it on Paclite. But even on Patagonia Storm and regular Gore, it still doesn't work *well.* To the extent that it does work, the spray works better than the wash. That's all I meant.
Where's fuckacre?
South of the PooPoo party.
Oh, across the Taint chasm, eh?Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven S. Dallas
You might have tried already, but prolly the simplest method is to wash the jacket (make sure to use NIKwash etc., or rinse the jacket really well if you use regular stuff)Quote:
Originally Posted by biggins
Then put it in the Dryer, on low.
The heat is supposed to be enough to liquify the remaining DWR, and cause it to spread out into the worn areas on the surface of the jacket.
...or just head to SaC, STP, Altrec, etc. :wink:
Here's what I do and it works pretty well. I also do this to some of the kids' gear that isn't originally waterproof and its pretty effective.
Wash with Nikwax techwash.
Wash with Nikwax TXDirect Wash-in.
Dry on very low setting.
Spray on Nikwax TXDirect spray-on.
Follow the Nikwax directions very carefully. Especially helpful is the part where you stop the washing machine during the cycle when doing the wash-in part. The nikwax stuff has a bit of a funny smell. Most will go away in the dryer. Hanging the stuff somewhere other than the closet overnight helps too. The smell will be pretty much all gone after 1/2 day wearing the gear outside.
I do this once or twice a season with most of my outerwear - depending on how dirty it gets. Light colored kids gear shows the dirt really fast.
Be sure to fasten all snaps and carefully close all velcro before washing. And check every single pocket in your gear and especially your kids' gear.
Never wash waterproof/breathable stuff in normal detergent - it will no longer be breathable if you do. And don't put fabric softener or dryer sheets in either. If you use a front loading machine, you can cut down on the amount of Nikwax products a bit. Front loaders are easier on your gear too.
You can get all this stuff at REI. Here's what you want:
http://www.nikwax.com/cmsdata/Produc...1_18_en-gb.jpg http://www.nikwax.com/cmsdata/Produc...1_25_en-gb.jpg http://www.nikwax.com/cmsdata/Produc...1_57_en-gb.jpg
I have used Revivex (MADE for Gore-Tex products - it's one of the worst DWR products!) and NikWax (with varying results). The trick is, when you're using NikWax, stop the washer (warm) at the soak cycle for 30-40 minutes for one garment - but usually the DWR protection lasts for maybe a month with everyday use, two to three months with weekend use, and so on.
What I have found works great is Tech-Tron (it might be Tek-Tron) a spray-on for just about every waterproof jacket. It lasts for a year, and it's pretty reasonable and will cover two or three garments. It needs to dry for about two days (dry climate).
Of course, you could never wash your waterproof garments - so the original DWR protection remains intact...
IMO
None of the spray-in, wash-in or similar products work terifically well, and I've found that once they treatments wear out, the garment is worse off then before all the miracle treatments. My take? Buy a good shell with a burly waterproof fabric like Gore-Tex XCR. Don't accept imitations - you'll be cursing them as you are soaking when it's 20F out. XCR will last 5-10 years easily with proper usage and storage.
Newsflash: A "burlier" waterproof fabric doesn't change the properties of how the fabric wets out even one little bit. It's not becoming un-waterproof, the nylon is just wetting out on top of the gore-tex.Quote:
Originally Posted by kellen
Some info I just learned from a Columbia rep today (questionable source I suppose ;) )
Basically it has been stated in parts, but here's the full story.
Wash with powder detergent
Wash with no detergent
Let dry
Apply waterproofing (DWR treatment)
Immediately dry in drier for about 10 min
Let dry
Haven't tried all these steps at once, but I will soon. My patagonia shell could use some more waterproofness.
EDIT: He also recommened washing about four times a year for a shell
I tried waterproofing a light jacket that was never really waterproof with this stuff.
Holmenkol Textile Proof
http://www.bobshop.de/oxid.php/sid/x...//changelang/1
While it certainly seemed like some serious stuff (my lungs wanted to kill me), the end result wasn't too impressive. Then again, my jacket was never ever waterproof to begin with...
If anyone wants to try it. I have about half a can left. PM me if you want it.
Anyone ever use Fels Naptha soap instead of the $10 per bottle Nikwax Tech Wash? It is supposed to be just pure soap without any of the detergent agents of modern laundry detergent. Just curious if anyone else had tried this before I go ahead and ruin an expensive jacket to save a couple bucks on soap.
REI sells special liquid soap specifically for washing DWR-coated fabrics. It costs $2-3, a lot less than the Gore stuff, and looks the same. I can't find it on their site, but every store I've been to has it.
The main thing is to not let your stuff get dirty, because dirt messes up the DWR. Beyond that, washing with the above detergentless soap and tumble drying on low heat will help revive and distribute the DWR that's left.
Beyond that, I agree that the spray stuff works better than the alternatives, but nothing works as well as the original stuff the fabric came with.
bump an old thread.
To everyone who said spray-on works better than wash-in: did you use a hot dryer after using the wash-in stuff?
Just curious, I haven't tried either method yet. Need to treat some old stuff for the coming season.
I've managed to get pretty good results on my 'Ryx shell, both with using Nikwax and Grangers...
1st wash with a small amount of washing powder
2nd run the washing machine twice without washing powder (I often just keep the clothes I plan on treating inside) to get them really clean (and get rid of possible washing powder residues).
3rd add Grangers/Nikwax according to the instructions
4th chuck in a drier, set to medium heat and let it roll until the clothes are dry.
That will give a long lasting result, which isn't as good as the original (ie. high wear areas, such as shoulders where the backpack straps are, loose the repellecy really fast), but miles better than the spray-ons (and will last a lot longer).
If you have a 2 layer or 1.5 layer garmet go ahead and use the wash-in treatments. If you have a 3 layer garmet always use a spray-on treatment as the wash-in will make the inside of your garmet hydro-phobic (water repelling) which slows some of the moisture moving ability of the garmet. The wash-in is great for 2 and 1.5 layer garmets because you get a nice even coating.
Washing is good.
Low residue soaps (not detergents) are best.
Never use liquid detergents or fabric softners on any product with a DWR.
If your garmet is newer Gore-Tex or eVent go ahead and dry it on high to rebuff the existing DWR.
And by all means get your jacket/pants dirty...that's the point.
Cheers
Just wear the fuking jacket, your're not going to get wet as long as the gore membrane is in place.
I've had bad luck with nikwax on anything. Funny thing is, of all the manufactures I've contacted about re-proofing, NONE of them have recommended Nikwax. The three that are consistantly recommended whne I contacted the manufacturer was Grangers, Revivex, and Tectron(sp?).
BTW, Nikwax is supposed to be formulated to NOT put it in the dryer to activate the DWR coating. Unlike flurorcarbon products, you do not need to heat garment to activate the waterproofing treatment. As I recall, both Grangers and Revivex are flurorcarbon products and do need the heat of a dryer to activate the DWR treatment though.
Also, in the land of powdered detergent, GORE's instructions are Machine-wash warm (104° F/40° C). Powder or liquid detergent. No fabric softener. Follow manufacturer's instructions. I think my marmot membrain stuff also recommended deft powdered detergent with 2 rinses or grangers gwash. Mt hardwear says Shells can be machine-washed in warm (not hot) water using regular powdered laundry detergent. Wash in a front-loading washing machine only. Do not use Woolite, other cleaners with lanolin (or any other oil), or fabric softener. Put the garment through at least two rinse cycles, as the detergent can interact with the DWR finish and needs to be totally rinsed out of the material.
WL Gore and all their users DEMAND you use Revivex with Gore-Tex XCR.
Don't use nikwax with it.
Is "Zero" soap suitable for washing shells? It is liquid, but supposed to be 'detergentless'.