Seth Vicious vs. Chief

Wow, thought for sure I would've found info on this, but I couldn't.

Kinda curious how the Chief and Vicious differ since the Vicious was built off the Chief.

Sidecut: Is the extra 2 mm's on the tail of the Vicious because of the twin? Does that actually effect the sidecut? ...On steep stuff in soft snow, is the wider tail of the Vicious going to be more likely to hang up or the non-twinned Chief?

Length: Vicious lengths are 169, 179, and 189. Chief lengths are 167, 174, 181, and 188. I know K2 does effective length on the Vicious. Is it the same on the Chief? Any clue on how the following skis would rank in terms of effective length: 177 mantra, 179 vicious, 181 chief, and 183 gotama?

Flex: Couldn't really find out for sure if the Chief has the progressive flex that the Vicious does? ...if not, what's the pattern and how does it compare?

Has anyone skied both?

I had (and sold) the Chief. It's a medium-stiff flex, I thought it was a good all-around ski, but developed some chatter at higher speeds.

I've never skied the Vicious or Pistol, but they both hand-flex like total noodles, so I wasn't that interested in seeing how they skied. The Chief is definitely stiffer.

The Chief runs long, as do most (all?) K2s today. I had the 181 Chief, which was more like a 185 (almost as long as the 186 Spatula, standing side-by-side).

Quote:

Originally Posted by shmerham

Wow, thought for sure I would've found info on this, but I couldn't.

Kinda curious how the Chief and Vicious differ since the Vicious was built off the Chief.

Is that true? A buddy of mine helped develop the Seths (he always laughed because he had the major input in the Seth model back when I first remember him skiing the protos in 01-02...but he always said that they couldn't sell a ski with the name of a guy over 40 on it!).

Quote:

Originally Posted by shmerham

Sidecut: Is the extra 2 mm's on the tail of the Vicious because of the twin? Does that actually effect the sidecut? ...On steep stuff in soft snow, is the wider tail of the Vicious going to be more likely to hang up or the non-twinned Chief?

Caveat: I've only skied the SV, but a friend of mine that I ride with uses the Chief. Take these comments with that info in mind.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shmerham

Length: Vicious lengths are 169, 179, and 189. Chief lengths are 167, 174, 181, and 188. I know K2 does effective length on the Vicious. Is it the same on the Chief? Any clue on how the following skis would rank in terms of effective length: 177 mantra, 179 vicious, 181 chief, and 183 gotama?

The 179 vicious and 181 chief, I would be, are very similar as the vicous has the twin that is not factored in.

The 179 SV is *very* close to the length of my 190 Gotama, so I would be that it will be several cm longer than the 183 Got...and longer still than the 177 Mantra. Volkl seems to factor in the twin to the measurement, which means that skis with the huge town (Got) ski really short, and skis with a lesser twin (Mantra) ski a bit short.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shmerham

Flex: Couldn't really find out for sure if the Chief has the progressive flex that the Vicious does? ...if not, what's the pattern and how does it compare?

Can't say, for sure, but the dimensions on the Chief and the lack of twin make them a fantastic ski for the BC or ski mountaineering...EXCEPT they are heavy...even heavier than the SV (I've picked up both but, as stated above, not skied the Chief).

For whatever it's worth, I find the SV really fun to ski -- it carves a high-spped arc remarkably well for its width, and the ski is quite versatile. The only real drawback is the length.

Be careful with deriving meaningful conclusions from handflexing in two areas:
1) When skis have progressive flex an overall handflex is not terribly meaningful;
2) With twin-tips, if you are flexing from the absolute end of the ski (end of the rear twin), the ski will often feel softer in flex than it is if you flex from the rear contact point. This is true of the SV & all twins I've both hand-flexed & skied.