Nikwax in front load washimg nachines? I'm not getting good results anymore

Nikwax Softshell Proof, for years used to work great. It made soft shell pants and jacket as DWR as I've ever seen. A few times a season I got used to doing the wash-twice cycle (TX Direct, then Softshell Proof), dry-on-low once and got consistent results. This was in a top loading washer.

The GF gets a modern, new front loading washer and all of a sudden NikWax doesn't work nearly as well as it used to. I see a big difference in the usage directions, in top loading washers you are supposed to allow the tub to fill with water, then add the required amount of NikWax (key point being the garments are thoroughly wet before NikWax enters the picture). With front loaders you add NikWax, in a lesser amount (HE washer) to the detergent dispenser, instructions are to up the dosage slightly for hard water.

Insights?

Obviously you should get a new GF

or just wash the garment in a front loader then use a spray on product while still wet

Pre soak the garments? Do they even still make top loading washers?

Also, probably get better results if girlfriend is naked.

I've used a bit of their stuff and it seems like, no matter what, you can never quite restore the original repelency or breathability.
Maybe your stuff is just old? :/

Upping the dose helps. Also, one piece at a time. Otherwise you're wasting the shit.

I never could figure out why people would buy a DWR product, dump it in the washing machine and let the excess all run down the drain when they could just spray it directly on the garment?

you can buy the waterbased stuff that you spray on to wet fabric after washing OR the solvent based stuff you spray on to a dry garment

Those wash in DWR's are worthless. Nothing worse then coating the inside of your jacket with a DWR.

Seriously just wash your gear regularly with decent soap and dry it. Thats all you have to do to keep your gear in good shape.

most success I've had...

fill up a bucket with decently warm/hot water and a cap full of that stuff. put your clean jacket in the bucket and leave it for 4-6+ hours. take it out. drip dry. then toss it in the dryer for a bit.

done wonders on my gear.

the spray is just a pain in the ass in my opinion.

After your factory DWR wears off, flouro-based spray-on is the best DWR. This stuff is the best for the $$:

http://ep.yimg.com/ay/autogeek/303-h...ard-16oz-7.gif

Spray on clean dry garment, line dry.

^^@ westmarine?

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Originally Posted by Big Steve

After your factory DWR wears off, flouro-based spray-on is the best DWR. This stuff is the best for the $$:

http://ep.yimg.com/ay/autogeek/303-h...ard-16oz-7.gif

Spray on clean dry garment, line dry.

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No negative impact on breathability?
I never heard of this product and, what I could see so far, it's marketed for cars (convertible tops a.s.o.)

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Originally Posted by PNB

No negative impact on breathability?
I never heard of this product and, what I could see so far, it's marketed for cars (convertible tops a.s.o.)

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Marine, Auto, Aviation industry has been all over this shit for years. A buddy of mine who does marine supply turned me onto it a while back.

Better than Nikwax IMO.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Big Steve

After your factory DWR wears off, flouro-based spray-on is the best DWR. This stuff is the best for the $$:

http://ep.yimg.com/ay/autogeek/303-h...ard-16oz-7.gif

Spray on clean dry garment, line dry.

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I've heard good things about the 303 but haven't tried it yet. I think this product works extremely well and you can get it at Walmart.

http://www.theroot.com/articles/news...e_threatening/

Wash in stuff is lame. Also wash with powder detergent not liquid for best results before using spray on or for general cleaning. Powdered detergent seems to leave less residue on the surface and membranes if the garment has them.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Gunder

Those wash in DWR's are worthless. Nothing worse then coating the inside of your jacket with a DWR.

Seriously just wash your gear regularly with decent soap and dry it. Thats all you have to do to keep your gear in good shape.

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I'll agree with this for hard shells with membrane layers, but not for soft shells. For simple soft shells it works with the coating on the inside. The worst case is the inside is slippery, and glides over the under lying layer.

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Originally Posted by AaronWright

Also wash with powder detergent not liquid for best results before using spray on or for general cleaning. Powdered detergent seems to leave less residue on the surface and membranes if the garment has them.

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Is it not the other way out?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PNB

No negative impact on breathability?
I never heard of this product and, what I could see so far, it's marketed for cars (convertible tops a.s.o.)

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No adverse affect on breatheability IME. Flouro-based and seems to stick on the fabric better than Revivex, Graingers and Nikwax IME. Best of all, it's about 1/3 the price. NRS (manufacturer of kayaking garments and gear) sells it. From NRS's DWR reco page:

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Third step – reapply DWR treatment to the fabric. * * *
You need to use a product like 303 High Tech Fabric Guard, Gear Aid ReviveX Spray-On Water Repellent, Nikwax Spray-On Waterproofing or Nikwax Wash-In Waterproofing that doesn't require high heat to activate the DWR. Follow instructions carefully for best results.

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Again, it's flouro-based, so spray it on a clean dry garment and allow to hang dry. You can throw it in the dryer on low after it has air dried.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PNB

Is it not the other way out?

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Not in my experience. A lot of outdoor clothing manufacturers recommend powdered detergent.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AaronWright

http://www.theroot.com/articles/news...e_threatening/

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thread drift o' the week

Buy new stuff from me. Problem solved! ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Big Steve

thread drift o' the week

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I don't know how that happened. It's happened a couple times now. This is what I linked to
http://www.atsko.com/water-guard-extreme-12-oz-aerosol/

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Originally Posted by Nobody Famous

I'll agree with this for hard shells with membrane layers, but not for soft shells. For simple soft shells it works with the coating on the inside. The worst case is the inside is slippery, and glides over the under lying layer.

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That simply is not true. Think about it for a minute. if you put a DWR on the inside of any jacket, you are going to prevent heat vapor "sweat" from your body escaping out of the jacket. So in effect you are running around with a trash bag on.

The vast majority of factory "DWR" is actually microscopic hairs on the surface of the fabric that create the DWR effect. When these get matted down they quit working and dirt is one of the main things that causes that. Heat restores them by making them stand up again. Abrasion and very abrasive soap destroy them.

I am willing to bet I spend way more time then just about anyone in cold wet condtions. I quit using any DWR aftermarket products years ago and I have stayed drier ever since. The key is to KEEP YOUR GEAR CLEAN. I wash may gear at least twice a month, sometimes once a week depending if it needs it. I always follow with drying it on medium heat. By doing that I am constantly restoring the factory DWR and keeping the membranes clean so the gear actually breathes. A the fabrics are so good these days, you never get wet from the outside in... instead if you feel dampness inside of your outwear it is the inability of the membranes breathing to keep up with the activity level.

there are 2 kinds of DWR:

there is water based DWR you put on a still wet garment and there is solvent based DWR you put is on a dry garment, IME there were several brands of water based products readily available and solvent based stuff was hard to come by but I am seeing more of the solvent based stuff

https://www.mcnett.com/gearaid/insta...ng-spray#20420

http://www.toko.ch/en/products/care-.../textile-proof

That is a new brand Steve has come up with, these ^^ are a couple more of the solvent based products, I like them for my dry suit cuz you don't need to use any dryer heat after wards like you do with the water based product which is better for latex seals

if your gortex fabric is wetting out and you haven't used any DWR then it isn't going to repel water

I have always used powdered detergent and I do a wash cycle in just water to rinse out all detergent

OP-try cleaning your dispenser with really hot water. Our front loader dispenser tends to cake up with the detergent that apparently breaks down the chemical DWR.

There is so much weird and conflicting info on how to reapply DWR out there, all from supposedly reputable sources. Sometimes you can even find conflicting information within one manufactures website. It's like it's voodoo magic and no one really knows.

The major clothing mfrs all seem to think that the wash-in methods are just fine. Are they wrong? Biased in some way I'm not understanding?