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These two skis both seem to fit the bill for what im looking for, all mtn ski that rips everywhere, including both coasts.
lookin at both in a 188, bigs w the snake on the front. i have an equally good deal on both.
a lot of you own or have ridden one or both, any opinions on what the major differences are? also, are the bigs stiffer than the inspired/8800s?
If you wait until the end of the week I can give you a review on the Intuitiv Bigs. As for the G4 I love the ski. Depending on where you're going to be skiing size matters. I ski almost exclusively on the East Coast and the 178 is just right. However for the wide open spaces out west 188 will be MUCH better. In any length the G4 is going to be stiff and stable with good hold on hardpack, it'll bust through crud and it floats really well.
I have both in a 178
Bigs are softer in flex(almost like a CMH Explosive but without the stiff tail) Mounted up they are significantly lighter then the G4(however the bigs have freerides while the G4s have 977's with the P2 plate), But even unmounted the G4's would still be heavier. The G4 in 178 has much more sidecut then the Big does and the mounting point on the Big is probably 2-3 cm's ahead of the G4 which probably explains why the tail is so much softer on the big. Both are kick tails. G4 is cap while the big is sandwich construction.
You really can't go wrong with either pair its more a question of what you personally want
Both skis kick ass. I would give a slight edge to the G4. I know my 194's Bigs are stiffer than the same years 188's.
One of the best skiers I know is rocking the 8800 in a 178, I would have never believed he would go that short if I hadn't seen it.
are the bigs w the snake any different than the inspireds the year after??
also, you guys both talked about how they both rip and destroy crud/groomers, what are the differences in feel?
skis ive recently demoed and liked - blizzard xxls, gotamas for pow, 7 24 pro but definately too narrow and a little too soft.
didnt like extra hots, not stable enough at all at speed.
thanks for the feedback.
Just to chime in, i agree totaly with laseranimal....i am a proud owner of Inspireds in a 178. I love em most anywhere. I ski a lot of eastern trees and they rip. The reason i picked it over the G4 was because i wanted a little softer of a ski for all the tight trees etc of the east. I've taken the Inspireds at some decent speeds and they have proven to be pretty stable despite their soft feel. You'll have to work the G4's around a little more in the trees than the Inspireds - you said you demoed the 7 24's - i think they will be more comparible to the G4s (at least volkl made the 7 24 pros to kinda take over the G4 spot in the line up). Both ski's are good choices and you will love which ever you pick - just depends basically like the others said on how stiff you want the ski and how hard you want to have to work the ski in some variable eastern tree skiing.
Oh and plus the Inspireds are much more pimp looking than G4's - i mean come on, the old school white longboard look is mucho classy on the slopes.
raps and laser, you think both are better in a 178 instead of 188?
how much softer are bigs than g4s? i really didnt like xtra hots at all, no stability.
Vinnay, how tall are you and whats your weight? I chose the 178 cause i'm a bit shorter, only 5' 8" and its better to have em a little short for all the tight eastern trees - if i was carvin up western bowls i woulda gone longer but for the east i went with the 178 - the twin tip and the center mount makes em ski a little short though
5 11, 180-5 ish. still undecided between these two though. thinkin maybe g4 cause im probably getting a spats for big powder days.
wouldnt g4s be better on hardpack and through crud?
also still not sure if the bigs are the same as inspireds and 8800s.
thanks raps.
Yes, the dragon Bigs are the same ski, and same model year, as the Nobis Inspired. I the Big was intended for Euro markets and the Inspired for North America. The Legend 8800 is unchanged this year, except for the topsheet.
I'd think the Bigs would be a tad more forgiving than the G4. At your size, definitely get the 188.
when you guys say forgiving, i know you mean softer but what else? id be afraid theyd feel anything like extra hots which i really didnt like. i dont know where blizzard titan xxls would list in that stiffness range but i enjoyed that ski a lot for crud/dusted groomers.
i know i could handle the g4 cause its skinnier and stiffer, just dont know where the big fits in here.
Oh god, don't compare these to Salomons. They're anything but.
Yes, by forgiving I mean a tad softer, so going slow through bumps and crud won't buck you around as much.
That's not to say the Big is a noddle, it's far from it. The 8800 is my main ski this year and it has no problems blasting through crud at high speed. It skis equally well on the groomers making GS turns.
I guess he best thing to do would be demo and see which ski your prefer. They're both great skis, just somewhat different. You won't be at all unhappy with the Bigs though.
one more thing
curious for ec...is more sidecut or less sidecut better for ice and hardpack?
in general i dont like a ski trying to make me turn, like when i skied 7 24s i didnt like them biting turns too much, it was almost tough to let them run sometimes even though they were stable enough.
also, laser, didnt quite understand what u meant, u said review later in the week but that u have both??
if you do have both, which do you end up skiing more and why?
vin,
I do have both, I have a pair of G4's which have alpine bindings on them. LOVE THE SKI, as I said super fast super stable its great everywhere. I also picked up a pair of Bigs to use as a touring setup mounted with freerides. I was going to mount the freerides on my G4's but I got a GREAT deal on the bigs and they're lighter, have less sidecut which is better in the BC, and they're a touch softer so they're more managable with freerides/AT Boots. I've skied my G4's once with soft boots and its really not much fun at all, you need to drive the G4's with a stiffer boot. As for length it sounds like your more EC then WC so I'd STRONGLY suggest the 178 in the G4, as for the big, you could probably get away with a 188 on the EC with the softer flex and less sidecut but I'd recomend skiing a 178. If I read you right I think you'd be more comfy on the Big. Personally I like the way the Volkl hooks up and rips turns on anything but if you don't like sidecut get the Dynastar.
Word of caution
Make sure you're getting the INTUITIV big dimentions 109-80-102ish this year its the Legend 8000 not the INSPIRED big which is 117/89/110 and correct me if I'm wrong guys is the Dragon/Snake thingy on the Supernobis or was it the other way around
The Dragon thing was not on the supernobis, it was just on the non-american big - the super nobis had just that little dynastar silver thing like the inspired but was longer and stiffer and said something different at the tail. Oh and the tip was a tad wider.Quote:
Originally Posted by laseranimal
And to add to the salomon comparison - the dynastar is still a wood core ski so it won't be as unstable as a salomon and will last a lot longer.
It's a tough one vinnay - the inspired doesn't have as much sidecut so it won't get turny on you but the G4 is prolly a little more of a ripper on hardpack. Either way, you can't go wrong....
I've got intuitiv bigs 188 w/freerides. I'm 6'-190. I like em alot. They're not real turny-hold pretty well on hardpack if you don't pressure them too much (just tip them and they'll hold) good float, good in crud, the tips are relatively soft, but the tails are very stiff-so they're not a noodle-the bases are very fast
thanks for the feedback. as to laser, i am mostly a wc skier, thats where i still live, but college has me out here. that said i need them to work on weekends when i go skiing, but i will also spend a lot of those weekends learning how to race(joined club team), so they dont have to be perfect.
also, i WAS talking about the Bigs that are 89 waist, not the 80 waist, i dont know what the old name for that ski is, just the intuitiv not the big/inspired?
i guess im still kind of leaning towards g4, 80 is a little skinny in the waist and you guys seem to think 90 might be a little wide. another factor is i found a pair of 188s new but no 178s, thuogh im sure i could.
Agree w/laser that the Intuitiv Big/Inspired/8800 is a kickass ski, tho' I can't comment on the G4.Quote:
Originally Posted by laseranimal
The 2003 -2004 Intuitiv Big (Dragon graphic), 2003-2004 Nobis Inspired and the 2004-2005 Legend 8800 are the same ski with the 117/89/110 dimensions. Intuitiv Big was released in Europe and Canada, Nobis Inspired in the USA.
In 2003-2004, Dyna also made in Europe limited quantities of the beefier Intuitiv Big Pro Rider (both also had the Dragon graphic, but were differentiated from the Big by their rounded snout) in both the 194 and 186 lengths. They had different sidecuts, with the 194 90mm underfoot and the 186 at 97mm underfoot. The 194 was the same as the (non-Dragon) Super Nobis released in the USA that year and the 186 was not released stateside AFAIK - I almost got a pair from Telemark-Pyrenees before they sold out. These skis are essentially this years Legend Pros with different (IMO cooler) graphics.
Confused yet?
Quote:Quote:
Originally Posted by Tri-Ungulate
Originally Posted by laseranimal
Make sure you're getting the INTUITIV big dimentions 109-80-102ish this year its the Legend 8000 not the INSPIRED big which is 117/89/110 and correct me if I'm wrong guys is the Dragon/Snake thingy on the Supernobis or was it the other way around
so which one is kickass, the 89 waisted intuitiv/inspired big or the 80 waisted intuitiv? and what was that ski called cause it wasnt the big i think, the big is the 89 waist i thought. and yes now im confused, though i did know that there was the widebodied europe only 186 pro last year.
i agree, those graphics are great. though bright orange is sweet too.
Both of the Intuitiv Bigs are well-regarded, but wider is newer and better. The 80mm waist Intuitiv Big is the older (I think '00-01) green and orange model. The 89mm waist Intuitiv Big/Nobis Inspired (white topsheet +/- dragon) ran from '02-'04. The 89mm Legend 8800 (orange graphics, same ski) is current.
The 90mm 194cm Intuitiv Big Pro Rider/Super Nobis (white topsheet +/- dragon) ran from '02-04 and is the beefier semi-race-room version. The 97mm 186cm Intuitiv Big Pro Rider (white topsheet + dragon) was only released in Europe in '03-'04 and was pretty much handmade race-room only, AFAIK. The current 97mm 186 cm Legend Pro Rider is the same ski as the previous year's IBPR, only different graphic. But here's where I get confused, in that I've heard that the current 194cm Legend Pro Rider comes in either/both the 90mm and 97mm waist - don't know which is true.
Hopefully that makes more sense, and hopefully it's more-or-less correct.
edit 'cause I confused myself :confused:
people on here have said the new pro is 97mm in both sizes, but midseason releases of them last year were still 90mm basically still supernobis w the orange topsheet.
this years prodution are all 97 if im not confused tho.
just curious for hardpack, is sidecut better for edge hold or worse? ie would bigs or g4s have better edge hold/grip?
Quote:
Originally Posted by vinnay
sidecut is better for most EC skiing, as you'll be on a lot of hardpack where you'll need to make short, fast turns. For trees, pretty much anything 80-ish with a base and an edge works, as you'll be busting up both constantly.
I have the dragon Bigs in a 188 and I've sniffed the G4s. The Bigs have a sandwich construction in the middle with a capped tip and tail. So it's stiff underneath with a soft tip and tail. Makes for an easy turning ski. The G4 is stiff and too much work for me. I have G30s which are stiff but not as stiff as the G40/G4.
i've skied the g4 178cm for 2 seasons in tahoe. my weight is about 150 lbs.
great fun ski, especially on groomers. no forgiveness, must be on top of them and driving them to enjoy them. they tire your ass out by end of day and because of the sidecut (which allows a ski to turn easier) are work in powder, trees and places where you want to hop skip and jump. if you are spend 75% or more of your time on groomers, go G4, fly all over the hill and hold on tight. nothing beats icy edge hold like a G4, hands down. it is the torsional stiffness that gives it that grip on ice and hardpack, not just the stiff flex. in bumps - learn to ski the troughs, because you don't want to be smashing mogul tops with them. don't just equate stiff flex to hardpack. a soft flexing ski that is still stiff torsionally will hold an edge. shovel flex is about forgiveness and stability at speeds - i.e. not noodley feeling. in a turn, sidecut effects how easy it is to get into that turn, as does beveling your edges, and stiff tails impact energy out of the turn.
i am about to mount up and ski the dragon covered intuitiv big - 89mm model - ski. will be comparing it not to a g4, but a vokl explosiv. and i plan to mount them at least 1cm back b/c of the very far forward factory mount. should give a little better stability at speed. i'll update with a full review later.
i think you'd be fine on a 178 cm G4. think of total ski area size. and where you spend most time skiing. all that extra sidecut means the ski will really flex hard and maintain massive edge contact with the snow...so make sure you want all that extra edge on the surface by going longer.
Perhaps you should look at an iM85 (179 prolly). It's stiff and burly a la the G4 but it has a quiet dampness from the slightly softer tip - but it's tip not NEARLY as soft as the 8800/Big/Inspired. I've had all 3 and the iM 85 hammers crud and hardpack as well or better than the G4, floats as well and feels as smooth in the soft stuff as the Inspired/Big/8800 and does everything in between MUCH better than those with a damp burly goodness. I've heard some complain of tail hookyness - I did find a tiny amount in some very heavy wet pow - then I moved my railflex bindings back to the -1.5cm position and now no hook, just perfect power and smoothness in EVERYTHING...similar shape (122/85/110) to the G4 (118-83-106)...
I'm 6' 175 fwiw....
hope I'm not adding any complexity to your decision...just my $0.02 that's all...
edit: you got me ansel4powsident...now please stop bumping old tech talk threads!!